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CTF Discussion


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Corporal Ice
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#1

Posted 19 November 2001 - 10:14

In Capture the flag missions, sometimes I place a Satchell in the Flag´s ground and wait until the enemy comes. When they come I let them see the flag going down. Then, when it touches his hands I activate the Satchell. I always advise it:"Please, do not take our flag, it harms". And I never do it more than two times in the same game.
Yesterday, some people told me: "that is camping!".
I think that´s only a nice joke, and a real tactic, cause I don´t go elsewhere to activate the bomb when I see "Flag captured" (that will be cheating, I think). I wait there till I see it!.

Do you think it is a nice joke, a good tactic or cheating?
Please, I want to know different point of view about this

Thundercok
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#2

Posted 19 November 2001 - 10:29

From a non-camping ex-quaker I have no problem with that scenario. I never had a problem with quake 'campers'.

Unless you have a binding agreement with the geekwad clan you are playing, you can do any d*amn thing you want to.

"CAMPING" has been, and always will be, the cry of the anal that just got their head blown off.

Happy trails, I say.

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Corporal Ice
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#3

Posted 19 November 2001 - 10:37

Thanks Sergeant!.

RN Malboeuf
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#4

Posted 19 November 2001 - 12:30

I use it all the time, telling some one they are not allowed to use a weapon basicaly defeats the purpose of the game

1 they can use it as well
2 it's not hard to find the guy with the switch and kill him
3 never just send ONE man to get the flag lol

Suchey
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#5

Posted 19 November 2001 - 15:22

If you can do it within the rules of the game its ok in my book...people b*tch about respawn camping too...if it is important to you...keep a guard there to ensure that the enemy can not approach the position rather than running into the middle of the map and emptying all your clips. People need to remember that this isnt a Frag Fest. If someone calls you a camper...take that as a compliment...it means you figured out that standing straight up and running around balls out only gets you whacked.

WhoCares
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#6

Posted 19 November 2001 - 15:48

The respawn area camping is a bit more critical imho. Just check the new CTF mission, where the US respawn area is covered with bushes and behind a 'hill', but the russian one on an open slope. I played it offline, just got the sniper rifle, went some steps up the hill and could control the russians respawn area...
However, camping at the flag is a different thing, since its the opponents risc to enter a nonsecured area. Like the other official map, were the flag is next to this shed with an ammo crate inside - what would have been the idea of the mission designer??? Posted Image

Lange
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#7

Posted 20 November 2001 - 05:25

1st
in a tactical environment there is nothin as rushing or camping or whatever as long the environment is realistic as far as possbile (weapons, health, physics,...)

2nd
i HATE ctf!
CTF is a great game-type for deathmatch-games like quake halflife or other ones.
But for tactical motivated people its like a slap in the face!
Why?
Well, just imagine this scenario as it can happen everywhere:
You know that you can get flag but can make only the "point" if your own flag is still in your base. now a nasty player could do this - he takes your flag, take it to his own and gets the point for it, THEN a teammate does take AGAIN the enemy flag and runs away - AND I MEAN he runs away and just hides! so the enemy team has NO POSSIBLE WAY to make a point!

OFP were made for people who are fed up with deathmatch-alike games.
We do like coop missions, team vs team, lastmanstanding and so on but we do NOT like CTF. CTF causes just stupid deathmatch scenarios because the "soldiers" dont care for their lifes! as long the can respawn within a second....

3rd
remove CTF and add some userful tactical types as:
hamburger hill
last man standing
team vs team (its already i know but there is still a lot room for enhancements)
co-op mission

sincerly

Simon aka [USR]General.Lange O-11 USAR 1BN 5th

RN Malboeuf
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#8

Posted 20 November 2001 - 05:28

yea ok then why is CTF the most played?

and even if that guy runs and hides you can actually still track him down

thats tactics baby YA!


(Edited by RN Malboeuf at 9:53 am on Nov. 20, 2001)

Lange
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#9

Posted 20 November 2001 - 05:40

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from RN Malboeuf on 7:28 am on Nov. 20, 2001
and even if that guy runs and hides you can actually still track him down

thats tactics baby YA![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

LOL how BABY! HOW!?
imagine a sniper in a helicopter 10km away and then 5 km in a forest or whatever...

HOW YOU WANNA TRACK HIM DOWN?! (in 15minutes?! or 30minutes?!) maybe in recruit-mode (LOL) but not in vet mode BABY!

searching for him the whole island may take hours to complete but on ctf server you only have 15 minutes or 30minutes but not hours. EXPLAIN! we are really excited in learning sumthin new by your awesome "tactical" experience. LOL

before talking bulls**t think first

Simon



(Edited by Lange at 7:43 am on Nov. 20, 2001)

Pete
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#10

Posted 20 November 2001 - 10:11

the problem is that they CANT disarm the satchel by shooting it before getting the flag..the only thing they can do is to find and kill you, but since the range for the detonator is several hundred meters you could be anywhere, and if it is a town its even worse....

AND if they do find and kill you they still dont know if it is safe to get the flag since they dont know if it was your satchel in the first place.....


sure you can use all methods in the game but that one gives the player no choise but to commit suicide when trying to get the flag.....its a working tactic, but id advise you not to use it to keep the game active...if both teams do it then a ctf game turns to deathmatch, no1 is willing to kill themselfs for that flag and risk finding another satchel there when they respawn and get back....

Thread Starter
Corporal Ice
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#11

Posted 20 November 2001 - 10:38

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from RN Malboeuf on 2:30 pm on Nov. 19, 2001
I use it all the time, telling some one they are not allowed to use a weapon basicaly defeats the purpose of the game

1 they can use it as well
2 it's not hard to find the guy with the switch and kill him
3 never just send ONE man to get the flag lol
[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

I don´t think that "they can use it as well" is a good reason. But I like the third point... lol

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Corporal Ice
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#12

Posted 20 November 2001 - 10:40

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from Suchey on 5:22 pm on Nov. 19, 2001
If you can do it within the rules of the game its ok in my book...people b*tch about respawn camping too...if it is  important to you...keep a guard there to ensure that the enemy can not approach the position rather than running into the middle of the map and emptying all your clips. People need to remember that this isnt a Frag Fest.  If someone calls you a camper...take that as a compliment...it means you figured out that standing straight up and running around balls out only gets you whacked.
[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

Yes, it seems to be there is a "political acepted" way of fighting CTF. I Don´t like that way. Squads combat is a mixture between discipline and creativity.

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Corporal Ice
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#13

Posted 20 November 2001 - 10:42

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from WhoCares on 5:48 pm on Nov. 19, 2001
The respawn area camping is a bit more critical imho. Just check the new CTF mission, where the US respawn area is covered with bushes and behind a 'hill', but the russian one on an open slope. I played it offline, just got the sniper rifle, went some steps up the hill and could control the russians respawn area...
However, camping at the flag is a different thing, since its the opponents risc to enter a nonsecured area. Like the other official map, were the flag is next to this shed with an ammo crate inside - what would have been the idea of the mission designer??? Posted Image
[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

I don´t like camping at the respawn area. It kills the spirit of fight itself....
But There is a huge difference between camping at the respawn area and defending the flag.
I´m sure that mission designer thought about defending (otherway that ammo crate isn´t usefull).

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Corporal Ice
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#14

Posted 20 November 2001 - 10:48

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from Lange on 7:25 am on Nov. 20, 2001
1st
in a tactical environment there is nothin as rushing or camping or whatever as long the environment is realistic as far as possbile (weapons, health, physics,...)

2nd
i HATE ctf!
CTF is a great game-type for deathmatch-games like quake halflife or other ones.
But for tactical motivated people its like a slap in the face!
Why?
Well, just imagine this scenario as it can happen everywhere:
You know that you can get flag but can make only the "point" if your own flag is still in your base. now a nasty player could do this - he takes your flag, take it to his own and gets the point for it, THEN a teammate does take AGAIN the enemy flag and runs away - AND I MEAN he runs away and just hides! so the enemy team has NO POSSIBLE WAY to make a point!

OFP were made for people who are fed up with deathmatch-alike games.
We do like coop missions, team vs team, lastmanstanding and so on but we do NOT like CTF. CTF causes just stupid deathmatch scenarios because the "soldiers" dont care for their lifes! as long the can respawn within a second....

3rd
remove CTF and add some userful tactical types as:
hamburger hill
last man standing
team vs team (its already i know but there is still a lot room for enhancements)
co-op mission

sincerly

Simon aka [USR]General.Lange O-11 USAR 1BN 5th
[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

I don´t like CTF too much, but it´s a good game, because in multiplayer games it is really difficult to find a good co-op game. Players hardly admit the orders of the commander (everyone runs and become a sniper), and (even worse) there aren´t good commanders out there. I´m not a good commander, but I had my real training as one (Corporal, not an officer), and I tryed to act as a true commander in a mission 5 against 5. The players who acted at snipers running everywhere in the last mission accepted this ime the command. And we kick the others in a really easy way. Ambushing, envolving, givin coberture fire, supressing. That game was cool!!

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Corporal Ice
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#15

Posted 20 November 2001 - 10:50

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from Pete on 12:11 pm on Nov. 20, 2001
the problem is that they CANT disarm the satchel by shooting it before getting the flag..the only thing they can do is to find and kill you, but since the range for the detonator is several hundred meters you could be anywhere, and if it is a town its even worse....

AND if they do find and kill you they still dont know if it is safe to get the flag since they dont know if it was your satchel in the first place.....


sure you can use all methods in the game but that one gives the player no choise but to commit suicide when trying to get the flag.....its a working tactic, but id advise you not to use it to keep the game active...if both teams do it then a ctf game turns to deathmatch, no1 is willing to kill themselfs for that flag and risk finding another satchel there when they respawn and get back....
[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
That is a great problem. I have been asking for a deactivate bomb or mine option (enemy ones, i know U can deactivate yours). It is really necesary.
I think that option will change lots of home-made-tactics in OPF.


Thread Starter
Corporal Ice
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#16

Posted 20 November 2001 - 10:52

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from RN Malboeuf on 7:28 am on Nov. 20, 2001
yea ok then why is CTF the mos played?

and even if that guy runs and hides you can actually still track him down

thats tactics baby YA!
[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

I think people likes CTF cause it´s a good blend between co-op and individual game types.

WhoCares
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#17

Posted 20 November 2001 - 10:53

@Pete: This might be a prob with few players, that's true. But then you can add some AIs and he might blow up one of them (CTF with two players only might be boring anyhow). Satchel is not that worse, since he has to go to the flag himself to place it, what makes him vulnerable. A sniper would be a bigger prob.
With a Team-CTF you must expect, that someone left behind to protect the flag. And in a common CTF it's a tactic to wait for the enemy closing in, kill him and then take the flag by yourself, knowing that it's less dangerous with one less in the area. And if you respawn and nobody has taken the flag - well, now you know, that there is someone around waiting for you...
As I said before, only respawn area camping is bad, since you can't control the way you enter it (except if you avoid to be killed Posted Image

RN Malboeuf
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#18

Posted 20 November 2001 - 14:01

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from Lange
before talking bulls**t think first

[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

Sorry you have not played OFP enough then yo know how it's done, any player can be track and trianglulated when the Squad players have extensive Map and member location knowlage

with in moments of the flag captuer several members will begin traking, the stolen flag, they know thier location and other members location by communicating

Thus ruling each other out as a target

then that will leave the Flag Man, two - three members will track him and either cut him off or force him to fight so a sniper can get him

I have never lost a Flag's positions

if you know your stuff it's actually quite easy

Don't every say it's impossible because of 1 little fact I wont tell you about, you'll have to learn it for your self



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Corporal Ice
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#19

Posted 20 November 2001 - 14:54

There are many ways to protect the flag owner... It does require of cooperative tactics and trained coms between atackers. But I think that defenders do need the same to track the flagman.

Morchaoron
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#20

Posted 20 November 2001 - 15:38

Respawn camping = bad and spoils all fun

Satcheling flags.... hmmm its by the rules... but i think it should be changed (not being able to satchel the area near the flag in a 50 meter radius or something like that)

I mean come on.... 5 people hiding in bushes waiting to detonate their bombs at their flag is nonsense.

Thats my opinion