Make Arma Not War - Submissions Re-opening

[bayum 10]

So, are these entries actually missing or just "not to standard"? Reason I ask - this is a screenshot from the twitch stream for the Helicopters DLC Support mode on November 7th and appears to show a collection of MANW mission files from the Multiplayer Game Mode category.

http://www.twitch.tv/arma3official/b/586198527?t=1h55m40s

Note specifically that 'Hunting Trip v1.0' is highlighted at the very top of that list. Yet if you check the "List of missing entries" it is also one of the Multiplayer Game Modes:

So did something happen to it between November 7th and now (like it was conveniently deleted), or was it just not up to standard? Because it obviously wasn't a "missing entry" at that point. :j:

Edited November 30, 2014 by bayum

[fluttershy 2]

And what about the people that were able to read the rules, that uploaded their stuff correctly to dropbox a few days before the deadline, that checked even if it was sent properly and then BI says that they haven't received the file properly :j:

I don't really have a problem with these particular teams in mind. Sadly we have 0 intel on how many of thoose are there to begin with. I know several teams had a solid version to show for and based of the ammount of "not uploaded correctly" claims i would say its rather a BI mistake. They could have just contacted the groups and told them what was wrong about it instead of opening it up publicly. It is still more fishy then it should be considering the amount overall. Though some of the listed addons and mods appear nowhere near as finished as other submitted projects. Since incompetence can only go so far i am pretty sure its a combination of teams simply not having uploaded anything or, as in the RHS case, the files went into a deep black hole of no return.

Edited November 30, 2014 by fluttershy

[cifordayzserver 119]

For me this is really weird, I had a legitimate problem uploading my content, so the SMD/Jbad Buildings submission is just some of the Jbad Buildings, however that was my own fault for delaying both work specifically for; and attempts to upload the content to; the contest.

With a fresh 2 weeks I could go from having 13-20 SMD buildings and 100 Jbad buildings done to the entire packages of both and Sahrani A3 included... I could probably slap together some BI terrains with the buildings replaced by M1lkm8n and Mine. Maybe even a few missions.

Where is; or I guess; Is there, a line?

*aside:

I've struggled to be motivated to work on anything for the contest, to the point that I only started work on SMD Sahrani A3 after the deadline passed. I'm sure that will be the case again, but if not, I at least will be at a SIGNIFICANT advantage having cranked out a ton of work after the deadline because I "felt like it".

I'm sure it's pointless to mention, but I feel like all of this could have been avoided by having more reasonable monthly awards as was suggested at the beginning by many community members. I likely would have not only started work on A3 sooner, but also would have seen the fun in participating in the contests from time to time. Where as, the way it is structured now l am not only unmotivated to work on stuff for it, I'm less motivated to work on Arma 3 at all.

5k up for grabs by anyone every month, is a LOT more enticing than a 500k slice of pie in the sky to stare at every day for a year. If DayZ's success should have taught BI anything, it should have been that the community is not a very happy seeing drastic disparity in reward for work.

[tupolov 520]

1. Out of 50 missing entries, 26 were total mods. Out of 26 missing total mods, only 2 look like proper legitimate entries (i.e. have a download somewhere, have been released, don't look like some nonsense entry).

2. Why RHS and Living Through didn't upload properly is anyone's guess (they both have downloads available). Based on mikero's response, maybe people felt that BIS should just download from a public website. Sorry Mikero, love your stuff, but the rules are the rules (and your stuff wasn't missing according to BIS?).

3. There are a couple of entries in total mod where you would expect something like Arma 3 Scenario Editor, Turkish Union Mod, but generally the rest were never released or looked like being released.

4. Now anyone can add anything to their entry. Why not now team up with the makers of another addon and include in your entry?

Out of 46 entries for Total Mods, you now have 20 entries, of which 10 of the top 14 isn't a bad list.

In supporter order..

1. Epoch

2. MOCAP

3. VTN

4. Breaking Point

5. CSE

6. ALiVE

7. AGM

8. Reign of Jurassic

9. East vs West

10. MCC 4

11. Cerberus

12. Mikero Tools

13. Arma 3 Fishing

14. LOSounds2 (lol)

Keep in mind there were 256 entries, so 50 isn't too bad considering how common it is for developers to miss deadlines ;)

Edited December 1, 2014 by Tupolov

[zapat 54]

Tupolov got me thinking. I think BIS is on extremely thin ice here. Without any control mechanism, you can take my situation for example:

I have a (I guess pretty good) addon. I did not upload it to MANW for some pretty foolish reasons. Now the addon is released correctly, I have fixed bugs, it's pretty solid now.

What if I contact athe author of one of the incomplete looking mods (eg. Third Reich) and we upload my mod there?

Its highly unethical, so I won't do this, I don't have a face big enough for this, but it's not against the rules. The contest is reopened.

What if it won the competition? How would that be explained? It'd obvious as hell it wasn't Third Reich, but without any control mechanism BIS should accept it.

And I am pretty sure one could find other fraud-like uses of this situation...

[feuerexcz 11]

Thanks, Tupolov, for taking the time to go through the entries. I was going to do that as well, but didn't find the time, you saved me some work.

I checked several entries mentioned by BIS, and only a small portion of them is actually in need of some adjustments. In many cases it's a reserved spot for a mod, that wasn't made in time, so it's just a place-holder for something that doesn't exist.

Now consider what zapat said. Technically, there is a place for twenty (or so) completely new entries, that could have been made after the deadline. The only thing needed is to contact the author of the original entry with nothing in it, and publish the mod under their name. The description can be changed, new images added, and suddenly there's a completely new mod, that legitimately got into the contest a whole month after the deadline.

Also, if you take into consideration, that many modders were unwilling to release their entries publicly, saying that their work could be stolen by others. Unpack a PBO and copy the insides is an easy task.

Some of these mods were uploaded within the last few days, most probably to avoid anyone copying the scripts and placing them to other works. Now, a month after the deadline, there has been more than enough time to download all of the entries, look inside, and use any part of the code for a different mod, that can now be uploaded with little to no problem at all.

I'm not saying that there are lots of people waiting to cheat the system in any way possible, but everyone with any mod now has a possibility to sneak into the contest. You are also punishing all others, who were able to get things working properly, by allowing all these small exploits to happen.

[tupolov 520]

All good points.

BIS needs to be transparent on who resubmits their entry.

You can't help but ask the question, if so few "real" mods/addons/MP gamemodes are impacted here, why reopen the competition? and why so late in the day?

[PuFu 4591]

1. Out of 50 missing entries, 26 were total mods. Out of 26 missing total mods, only 2 look like proper legitimate entries (i.e. have a download somewhere, have been released, don't look like some nonsense entry).

2. Why RHS and Living Through didn't upload properly is anyone's guess (they both have downloads available). Based on mikero's response, maybe people felt that BIS should just download from a public website. Sorry Mikero, love your stuff, but the rules are the rules (and your stuff wasn't missing according to BIS?).

3. There are a couple of entries in total mod where you would expect something like Arma 3 Scenario Editor, Turkish Union Mod, but generally the rest were never released or looked like being released.

4. Now anyone can add anything to their entry. Why not now team up with the makers of another addon and include in your entry?

Out of 46 entries for Total Mods, you now have 20 entries, of which 10 of the top 14 isn't a bad list.

In supporter order..

1. Epoch

2. MOCAP

3. VTN

4. Breaking Point

5. CSE

6. ALiVE

7. AGM

8. Reign of Jurassic

9. East vs West

10. MCC 4

11. Cerberus

12. Mikero Tools

13. Arma 3 Fishing

14. LOSounds2 (lol)

Keep in mind there were 256 entries, so 50 isn't too bad considering how common it is for developers to miss deadlines ;)

I will only comment on your rhs part: the files (the same that were released to the public later on) were uploaded and double checked for manw dropbox over 24h prior to the deadline. It is just as a bad surprise for us as it is for you.

So no, it wasn't a matter of stuck up here, everyone would like some real reasons behind the decission and the so called bad submissions.

[mistyronin 1181]

I will only comment on your rhs part: the files (the same that were released to the public later on) were uploaded and double checked for manw dropbox over 24h prior to the deadline. It is just as a bad surprise for us as it is for you.

In fact, as I said 4 posts before Tupolov, our entry was sent and double checked more than two days before, because BI got the deadline wrong in the contest rules. In the rules it was specified that the deadline was:

Submission of Entries will be closed on 28th October 2014 at 12am (GMT+1).

28th of October 2014 at 12am is one minute after 27th of October 2014 11:59 pm ( 12 am = 00 ) In fact BI allowed submissions until the 29th of October 2014 at 12am. So 24h more than it stated in the rules of their website ( that BTW can still be checked in MANW's website ).

Check how the 12 hour system works.

But nothing too big as they also gave different dates in other places.

Edited December 3, 2014 by MistyRonin

[fn_Quiksilver 1633]

Some categories of the Make Arma Not War contest have been temporarily re-opened for submissions. Unfortunately a sizable number of contestants had not submitted their work properly. This was a tough decision for the MANW committee' date=' but [b']the contest's ultimate goal is to highlight quality content[/b]. Take a look at this news article to find out whether your entry is affected or not.

http://dev.arma3.com/post/sitrep-00085

Goal of the contest isn't to hand out prize money, it's to highlight quality content ... If leaving the submissions open for some brings in more quality content then the decision is still in line with the ultimate goal.

[zapat 54]

Then why not open fully?

For eg. half a year more.

If that's the real goal and not some weak explanation...

[das attorney 857]

I scratched my competition entry as I couldn't finish in time.

If somebody submitted a dud entry it should be judged on it's merits and not given additional time to put their house in order.

[HorribleGoat 1464]

How did this go by the way? We did update couple of bugs out but did the missing entries show up? Also Some confirmation that the update was received would have been nice.