Jump to content

Photo
- - - - -

Audio Tweaking (dev branch)

audio feedback sounds tweaking

  • Please log in to reply
1557 replies to this topic
dna
dna

    BI Developer

  • 1695 posts

#1

Posted 07 May 2013 - 12:28

The audio changes which delayed Development branch updates are now partly published. As with most of these large tasks, this is ongoing work and so the current state is not considered final (in some places it may be worse for a little while). Effectively the core foundations are in place and now each individual asset needs tuning and fixing. We feel it will improve the soundscape in the final game :622:

Senior audio team member Ondřej Matějka goes over the details:

We’ve added a so-called limiter effect. If there are a large number of shots at the same time, there was an unpleasant effect of 'cracking'. The limiter should help counter this eventually.

We’ve changed the audibility of some sounds based on distance. Due to the changes to the sound engine it is now possible to affect the sound very accurately. As example, by separating the samples for weapon shooting and their mechanical parts, you can now not as easily hear the shooter in a remote area. With this change, the player also gets a better sense of ambient sound, because e.g. crickets are now heard only in a limited space. Another big change is the accurate setting of the volume of resources (dB) and controlling the audio mix (vehicles versus weapons for example). Rather than tweaking volume and loudness in the source samples, these are now all normalized and tweaking is done in configuration.

Finally, we’ve introduced an improved WSS format. With this change we can drastically reduce the size of the sounds by more than 60 percent and format WSS finally supports stereo samples.

Of course, there have been many fixes and tweaks to sounds themselves based on your comments. Please help our audio team by continuing to report possible improvements in this field.


Bohemia Interactive
Arma 3 - Project Lead
Watch us, tweet us, poke us

Take On Helicopters - Project Lead
Take On Noisecontrollers!

kremator
kremator

    Major

  • Members
  • 7517 posts

#2

Posted 07 May 2013 - 12:48

Good to see new stereo sounds. Looking forward to hearing the new soundscape!

Bigpickle
Bigpickle

    Sergeant Major

  • Members
  • 1516 posts

#3

Posted 07 May 2013 - 13:13

Hi DNA and thanks very much for the info, I have a couple of questions about the new sound works if you think you may be able to ask the sound guys.

format WSS finally supports stereo samples


Will we get a tool to support this or does it mean the engine now processes wss in stereo format?

We’ve added a so-called limiter effect


Will this be like arma 2 were the amount of samples is capped and going over that cap stops the first of the sound files from playing.


Many regards & Thanks for the communication
Bp

dna
dna

    BI Developer

  • 1695 posts

#4

Posted 07 May 2013 - 13:15

Will we get a tool to support this or does it mean the engine now processes wss in stereo format?


Currently it means the engine processes it. I'll investigate whether we can add a conversion tool to the tools package.

The rest will need to be answered by my team :)
Bohemia Interactive
Arma 3 - Project Lead
Watch us, tweet us, poke us

Take On Helicopters - Project Lead
Take On Noisecontrollers!

NeuroFunker
NeuroFunker

    Warrant Officer

  • Members
  • 2207 posts

#5

Posted 07 May 2013 - 14:44

Hi DNA and thanks very much for the info, I have a couple of questions about the new sound works if you think you may be able to ask the sound guys.



Will we get a tool to support this or does it mean the engine now processes wss in stereo format?



Will this be like arma 2 were the amount of samples is capped and going over that cap stops the first of the sound files from playing.


Many regards & Thanks for the communication
Bp


in audio production, limiter affects the volume of anything that goes in, it cuts to loud peaks of audio, making it not to clip, (distorted) audio starts clipping at over 0dB, also you must not be afraid of damaging your highend audio system, by overcliping audio at large battles.
Posted Image

I just dropped an IFV from 3,000 feet in the air. You know what happened? That's right, absolutely nothing. It hit the ground at 150 km/h, landed upright, and the AI driver kept right on trucking without a bit of damage.


But BIS! You have promised "The most realistic simulation game!" ;)

-=seany=-
-=seany=-

    Sergeant Major

  • Members
  • 1607 posts

#6

Posted 07 May 2013 - 15:51

Nice update thanks, looking forward to hearing them. Also, 60 % is a massive gain!
Vote for these Bugs
Spoiler

PC Spec:
Spoiler

NeuroFunker
NeuroFunker

    Warrant Officer

  • Members
  • 2207 posts

#7

Posted 07 May 2013 - 15:53

yup, now they can add, twice as much sounds as now, and it will stay about they same size, amazing!
Posted Image

I just dropped an IFV from 3,000 feet in the air. You know what happened? That's right, absolutely nothing. It hit the ground at 150 km/h, landed upright, and the AI driver kept right on trucking without a bit of damage.


But BIS! You have promised "The most realistic simulation game!" ;)

Bigpickle
Bigpickle

    Sergeant Major

  • Members
  • 1516 posts

#8

Posted 07 May 2013 - 16:18

in audio production, limiter affects the volume of anything that goes in, it cuts to loud peaks of audio, making it not to clip, (distorted) audio starts clipping at over 0dB, also you must not be afraid of damaging your highend audio system, by overcliping audio at large battles.


Yeah i understand what clipping is, all audio files should treated for clipping before being used or implemented in the game engine anyway.

Correct me if I'm wrong ofc, your suggesting that they are using code to treat clipping in game but more aimed towards "clipping caused by amounts of simultaneous files playing at once".

ezcoo
ezcoo

    Gunnery Sergeant

  • Members
  • 509 posts

#9

Posted 07 May 2013 - 17:36

Nice to know that the sound engine is being enhanced :) May I ask that will the sound positioning be enhanced later? That would be more than amazing (and desperately needed :P)

Posted Image

INTER ARMA CARITAS


mr.g-c
mr.g-c

    Warrant Officer

  • Members
  • 2381 posts

#10

Posted 07 May 2013 - 18:30

I dont know where the benefits of stereo sounds are for a game?
Anyone care to explain?
Marek Spanel: [...] Every single element is well taught so that it fits together. So this is a significant change, because with ArmA 1 it was just random, really.
We made some units because we had to. There wasn't much passion from our side with the first ArmA, to be honest. This time it's different. (Videogamer.com Interview:)

Please BIS: Arma2 must become a TRUE MASTERPIECE - Not a middle-heavy catastrophe!

NeuroFunker
NeuroFunker

    Warrant Officer

  • Members
  • 2207 posts

#11

Posted 07 May 2013 - 18:34

Correct me if I'm wrong ofc, your suggesting that they are using code to treat clipping in game but more aimed towards "clipping caused by amounts of simultaneous files playing at once".


exactly that. No matter how polished the audio samples are, the game engine supports up to 128 samples, imagine what happens, if all of them playing at same time, there would be always clipping, until there is something, that doesn't allow it to clip, like software audio limiter.
Posted Image

I just dropped an IFV from 3,000 feet in the air. You know what happened? That's right, absolutely nothing. It hit the ground at 150 km/h, landed upright, and the AI driver kept right on trucking without a bit of damage.


But BIS! You have promised "The most realistic simulation game!" ;)

AnimalMother92
AnimalMother92

    Warrant Officer

  • Members
  • 2947 posts

#12

Posted 07 May 2013 - 20:52

Cool, always nice to see audio improvements.
Posted ImagePosted Image
Posted Image // fragOut Studio

Bigpickle
Bigpickle

    Sergeant Major

  • Members
  • 1516 posts

#13

Posted 07 May 2013 - 21:19

exactly that. No matter how polished the audio samples are, the game engine supports up to 128 samples, imagine what happens, if all of them playing at same time, there would be always clipping, until there is something, that doesn't allow it to clip, like software audio limiter.


like a sound cap, like in A2 and OA to me, but I guess we'll see when its finished. Having tested the latest patch today I am sure there is lots more work to be done, its a shame really so much was broken and with missing sound classes from configs and so on it kinda seems like QC has gone awry.

mikero
mikero

    CWR² Developer

  • Members
  • 234 posts

#14

Posted 07 May 2013 - 21:23

Will we get a tool to support this or does it mean the engine now processes wss in stereo format?


The current wss format supports stereo. A few (not many) wss files in both arma and ofp were rendered that way (perhaps unintentionally). The engine ignored the 2nd channel, afaik, but the format, already supported stereo.

Most 3rd party wav-> wss convertors 'out there' already do this conversion for the current formats, plural. Providing those older formats remain supported in the shiny new wss, those tools will still do the job.
Ook?:cool:

Bigpickle
Bigpickle

    Sergeant Major

  • Members
  • 1516 posts

#15

Posted 07 May 2013 - 21:26

WSS converter gives a warning that the file is not a 16bit mono file, should i ignore it and crack on?

EricFr
EricFr

    Staff Sergeant

  • Members
  • 339 posts

#16

Posted 07 May 2013 - 22:56

Wind noise is too loud.
kind of cicada everywhere even in winter.

Forza Dominique Fidanza


mikero
mikero

    CWR² Developer

  • Members
  • 234 posts

#17

Posted 08 May 2013 - 00:10

WSS converter gives a warning that the file is not a 16bit mono file, should i ignore it and crack on?


so far as I recall that exe would then not create 4 bit nibble compressed pch (if that was wanted). Secondly, perhaps now removed, the engine would flag such wss in it's (dot)rpt. But, again, so far as I recall, the resulting wss worked 'ok'

A better ™ solution is wss2wav.exe (which does wav2wss too) available at

https://dev-heaven.n...ro-pbodll/files

There were additional 'undocumented features' with the bis version in producing 4 bit nibble pch. This format contains severely scrunched data which is excellent for engine noises and keeps the payload respectable, but atrocious for voice. The exe mentioned above produces 8 and 4 bit compressed stereo which the engine understands but the bis tool, does not.

As for "what's so special about stereo". It changes a tank coming at you from everywhere to a tank coming at you from the left.
Ook?:cool:

Unknown03
Unknown03

    Private First Class

  • Members
  • 36 posts

#18

Posted 08 May 2013 - 01:38

Awesome!

Does this mean that firefights wont sound like tapping pencils on a desk, or popcorn in the microwave?

Bigpickle
Bigpickle

    Sergeant Major

  • Members
  • 1516 posts

#19

Posted 08 May 2013 - 07:31

so far as I recall that exe would then not create 4 bit nibble compressed pch (if that was wanted). Secondly, perhaps now removed, the engine would flag such wss in it's (dot)rpt. But, again, so far as I recall, the resulting wss worked 'ok'

A better ™ solution is wss2wav.exe (which does wav2wss too) available at

https://dev-heaven.n...ro-pbodll/files


There were additional 'undocumented features' with the bis version in producing 4 bit nibble pch. This format contains severely scrunched data which is excellent for engine noises and keeps the payload respectable, but atrocious for voice. The exe mentioned above produces 8 and 4 bit compressed stereo which the engine understands but the bis tool, does not.

As for "what's so special about stereo". It changes a tank coming at you from everywhere to a tank coming at you from the left.



Excellent info and thanks for the link Mikero, I grabbed it but I get this error when i drop a wav file on to the exe, Ive checked my file is 16bit but i guess I'm doing something wrong.

Posted Image

Edited by Bigpickle, 08 May 2013 - 07:46.


SQB-SMA
SQB-SMA

    Staff Sergeant

  • Members
  • 387 posts

#20

Posted 08 May 2013 - 08:09

I think some of the functionality from JSRS should really be in Arma. Most notably the change in how a gunshot sounds with distance, from bang to pop. With separation of mechanical and gunshot sounds we're off to a good start, but if the distant sounds could be put in it would be fantastic.

Apart from that my main complaint is in regards to bullet snaps, which sound like hollywood style "swooshes", once again JSRS, though awfully low quality (probably from youtube videos?), is perfectly on the money. Keep in mind even if you aren't close enough to hear the actual loud snap the bullet still produces a rattling sound as that snap is reflected off nearby objects (especially in alleyways/CQB).



Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: audio, feedback, sounds, tweaking