Jump to content

Photo
- - - - -

Realistic joystick?


  • Please log in to reply
15 replies to this topic
Thread Starter
Mattressi
Mattressi

    Sergeant

  • Members
  • 122 posts

#1

Posted 14 March 2012 - 12:07

A long time ago I had a few flights in an R22 (that is, I was flying it, with an instructor of course). Since then I haven't flown at all, but I recently heard about TKON and thought I'd give it a go. The demo has been quite fun, though it doesn't seem to perfectly match my experiences (though, as I said, they were a long time ago).

I'd think quite a lot of the issue is that I'm flying with the keyboard only. I can easily manoeuvre through the training and missions, but I find it to be quite difficult to maintain a perfectly steady hover.

So, I'm in the market for a good joystick (preferably with some kind of collective and pedals; even if the collective is just a plane throttle). The thing I'm wondering, is if there are any joysticks out there that respond like a helicopter cyclic - from what I can remember, the cyclic didn't spring back into the center if I let got of it - rather, if I were to let go of it, it would slowly fall away and could potentially cause a dangerous situation if allowed to fall too much. I tried the only joystick at the local computer store and it sprung back to center after I moved it.
So, the question: are there any joysticks that don't do this? I know that it's not a huge issue, since I don't plan to let go of the joystick anyway, but I was just wondering if there were more authentic helicopter-oriented joysticks.

Thanks,
Matt

hon0
hon0

    Gunnery Sergeant

  • Members
  • 562 posts

#2

Posted 14 March 2012 - 12:21

http://www.maxflight...Collective.html
http://rainman.tv/in...inman_links.htm
Welcome. See here for some heli stick.
Youtube Channel
Don't Live on the Edge, Jump off it! ♥♫


Posted Image

Thread Starter
Mattressi
Mattressi

    Sergeant

  • Members
  • 122 posts

#3

Posted 14 March 2012 - 12:36

http://www.maxflight...Collective.html
http://rainman.tv/in...inman_links.htm
Welcome. See here for some heli stick.


Wow, they look great! But the price is certainly quite high. I'm not sure I want to spend that much yet - maybe when I get more into helicopter sims. Are there any cheaper controls (joysticks, rather than those excellent cyclics) that work in a similar manner? If not, I might just buy one of the regular joysticks, play around with it for a while and if/when I start to really want a "real" setup, I'll move to one of those control systems.

hon0
hon0

    Gunnery Sergeant

  • Members
  • 562 posts

#4

Posted 14 March 2012 - 12:54

Yes it's verry expensive.. I don't know if there are other helicopter control cheaper. At the moment At the moment I fly with the thrustmaster t.16000m as cyclic and an old saitek x45 as collective.

It work great for Take on Helicopter and I am REALLY enjoying the extra precision of the T16000. Little brother of the Warthog.

When I started Flying in TOH I used a Cyborg evo force 2.. I wasn't enought precise.. The difference with the T16000 is huge !! And the stick is cheaper x)
An other awesome thing with the T16000 is that you can script everything you want:D/can:confused:/other can ;) with target
Youtube Channel
Don't Live on the Edge, Jump off it! ♥♫


Posted Image

zentaos
zentaos

    Sergeant

  • Members
  • 102 posts

#5

Posted 14 March 2012 - 12:57

the least expensive option is to buy the joystick from your local computer store and remove the centering spring.

check out the homebuilt forum at Hovercontrol:
http://www.hovercont...gi?;act=SF;f=43

..and I also found another manufacturer, but could not find any reviews of their product:
http://shop.c-tekfli...Controls_c2.htm

hon0
hon0

    Gunnery Sergeant

  • Members
  • 562 posts

#6

Posted 14 March 2012 - 13:00

Thanks for that Zentaos !

After overwhelming request, we will soon be offering our controls with hall-effect sensors. Hall-Effect sensors are non-contact position sensors providing a guaranteed smooth response and long life.

Definition: The production of a potential difference across a conductor carrying an electric current when a magnetic field is applied in a direction perpendicular to that of the current flow.

Discovery: The Hall effect was discovered in 1879 by Edwin Herbert Hall while he was working on his doctoral degree at Johns Hopkins University in Baltimore, Maryland. His measurements of the tiny effect produced in the apparatus he used was an experimental tour de force, accomplished 18 years before the electron was discovered.

We are in our final testing and will have them available for sale within the next few weeks.


I'll keep an eye on this website.

Edited by hon0, 14 March 2012 - 13:04.

Youtube Channel
Don't Live on the Edge, Jump off it! ♥♫


Posted Image

zentaos
zentaos

    Sergeant

  • Members
  • 102 posts

#7

Posted 14 March 2012 - 13:26

I have been working on some budget home made controls designs as well, but I haven't been able to progress past the design phase since the workshop is not heated, and I am in the process of moving.

Hopefully soon I can get back to work.

this is the link to the plans i put up on google docs since Meg@Uplo@d is, well...:jail:
https://docs.google....pYW9TM21lUUt0Zw

I'm in the process of a new design using the Thrustmaster T16000M that Hon0 is referring to, I've ordered one from Amazon and I will be taking it apart to use the components to build my setup, this is the least expensive option that uses Hall sensors.
I will document my process for others to see, comment on, and improve.

Thread Starter
Mattressi
Mattressi

    Sergeant

  • Members
  • 122 posts

#8

Posted 14 March 2012 - 13:56

Awesome, thanks for the replies! I never thought of just taking the spring out of a joystick (I assumed it'd be more complicated). The C-Tek flight controls are more in the price range I was looking at. I might see if I can find any reviews (though, you mentioned you couldn't, zentaos) and get one if there's nothing too negative said about them. Looking forward to seeing how you make your controls, zentaos; if you can get it working, I might even give it a shot if I haven't already bit the bullet and bought some expensive controls.

Thanks again :)

Jedra
Jedra

    Warrant Officer

  • Members
  • 2048 posts

#9

Posted 14 March 2012 - 16:46

Hey Zentaos - be sure to upload your price list and shipping costs when you're done ;-)
Jedra's Addons
Arma 2 : Enhanced Skills Slider
Take On Helicopters : Take On Taxi | Jedra's Time Trials | Weapon Indicators | No Radar

Liquidpinky
Liquidpinky

    Sergeant Major

  • Members
  • 1565 posts

#10

Posted 14 March 2012 - 17:16

Hey Zentaos - be sure to upload your price list and shipping costs when you're done ;-)


Plus one, looks pretty decent design there.
Looks perfect for a flat pack, would like to find it in IKEA one day.


The Dummehs guide to running Arma2 within a RamDrive or on multiple HDDs

Spoiler


hon0
hon0

    Gunnery Sergeant

  • Members
  • 562 posts

#11

Posted 14 March 2012 - 18:19

http://www.checksix-...ad.php?t=164787

Check this guy have done a collective with a T16000. Hope it can help you.
Antoine
Youtube Channel
Don't Live on the Edge, Jump off it! ♥♫


Posted Image

rainman_simulators
rainman_simulators

    Suspended Member

  • Banned
  • 5 posts

#12

Posted 15 March 2012 - 19:02

One of my customers has posted a review of the controls he bought from me here http://www.hovercont...ST;f=43;t=20965
I am always more than happy to answer questions in regards to the performance or customising of my controls as well.
I have noticed that everybody is wanting hall effect sensors, I have been fitting an industrial grade robotics hall sensor in each of the cyclic axis and I am getting a 700 increment count across each of the axis.
Posted Image
This is the sports plane sim with H300 style collective prototype.

Edited by rainman_simulators, 17 March 2012 - 19:51.


daryld12
daryld12

    Newbie

  • Members
  • 1 posts

#13

Posted 19 March 2012 - 07:28

A long time ago I had a few flights in an R22 (that is, I was flying it, with an instructor of course). Since then I haven't flown at all, but I recently heard about TKON and thought I'd give it a go. The demo has been quite fun, though it doesn't seem to perfectly match my experiences (though, as I said, they were a long time ago).

I'd think quite a lot of the issue is that I'm flying with the keyboard only. I can easily manoeuvre through the training and missions, but I find it to be quite difficult to maintain a perfectly steady hover.

So, I'm in the market for a good joystick (preferably with some kind of collective and pedals; even if the collective is just a plane throttle). The thing I'm wondering, is if there are any joysticks out there that respond like a helicopter cyclic - from what I can remember, the cyclic didn't spring back into the center if I let got of it - rather, if I were to let go of it, it would slowly fall away and could potentially cause a dangerous situation if allowed to fall too much. I tried the only joystick at the local computer store and it sprung back to center after I moved it.
So, the question: are there any joysticks that don't do this? I know that it's not a huge issue, since I don't plan to let go of the joystick anyway, but I was just wondering if there were more authentic helicopter-oriented joysticks.

Thanks,
Matt


Outside of spending a lot of money on full scale controls, I find the controller I'm using to be very enjoyable. I use a 6 channel USB I-controller (radio control dummy controller) from a well known RC sim company. It is very precise and allows you to do coordinated heli flying in a smooth and exact way. I fly real and rc heli's and it's a blast to do autos with this setup. I myself left the centering spring in because it would be too loose otherwise. In a real heli you get stick shake and, of course, force feedback from the rotors, engine and wind. So the spring at least gives you some resistance. I don't know if anybody else uses these for flight sims but for me it's my favorite to use because of the cost, simplicity and convenience. You can pick them up pretty cheap and once you use it you may never go back to a regular joystick. I use it for all my sims and I love it.

zentaos
zentaos

    Sergeant

  • Members
  • 102 posts

#14

Posted 19 March 2012 - 15:50

Hungo...your products are top notch! Easily the best and most endorsed choice by real pilots! I am just on a very limited budget and have been forced to get creative.

rainman_simulators
rainman_simulators

    Suspended Member

  • Banned
  • 5 posts

#15

Posted 29 April 2012 - 08:51

I build the Rainman brand controls, all the cyclics that I produce are only ever fitted with high grade industrial robotics sensors, the cyclic is also available as a standalone unit.I can also fit it with a budget version grip which will also drop the cost a little further.

Max Power
Max Power

    Mr. Angry Face

  • Members
  • 12828 posts

#16

Posted 29 April 2012 - 08:56

As a preventative measure, I would just like to remind everyone of §4:

§4) Advertising commercial products
Do not advertise any commercial products other than those of BIS/BIA on the forums without prior BIS/BIA approval.


That said, it's very nice to have a specialist hardware manufacturer among us :)
Posted Image
Posted Image
My inbox is fill and won't be emptied. If your PM is regarding requests to use my work, unfortunately I choose not to grant such permission. My work is for use with CWR2 only.