Focus on gameplay not games, please.

[Misconduct 99]

I would like to encourage BI to focus on the development of vanilla gameplay.

We have recently been sold DLC content that is a specific use of existing game mechanics, when there are larger issues to work out.

I understand that BI needs to make money to produce, I just think that improving game functionality will increase the player base and sales more than Laws of War.

If BI want to sell us the ability to jump, I would buy that - before I ever buy Laws of War.

 

In short, we are currently playing a game where climbing a fence is an impossible task - but being eaten by a rock isn't.

 

 

[ProfTournesol 956]

Vanilla gameplay development is over. The next DLC about tanks will be the last for ArmA3, then you'll have to wait for next game installment. Btw, LoW is one of the most enjoyable dlc i've played.

[lex__1 422]

I like DLS, I have them all, I do not intend to return anything. But the problem of the game process must be solved.
I would like, for example, to play on Tanoa, but today this is not possible, nerves are more expensive.
I want, for example, to compete in Kartinge, but they have wheels for drift, not for speed and good grip.
In many moments - like a movie in half a session.

In my signature spoiler, with a list of hot issues, for me, , or maybe the dreams of millions of players.

[Misconduct 99]

1 hour ago, ProfTournesol said:

Vanilla gameplay development is over. The next DLC about tanks will be the last for ArmA3, then you'll have to wait for next game installment. Btw, LoW is one of the most enjoyable dlc i've played.

 

Thats the part I don't understand.

Why would BI bother to release LoW before completing the game itself? I think Arma 3 is already just shy of being the best game ever made, with a few tweaks (which I assume would take less effort than creating LoW) and some clever marketing - BI would sell more copies of Arma and DLCs by improving game mechanics over storytelling.

If I were unaware of Arma and was considering purchasing it, I would look at Laws of War and think "hmm... that looks interesting, they must have put a lot of work into this"

and then watch Arma gameplay and think "can't hop a fence, and can glitch through floors, I guess this game isn't out of BETA yet"

 

I realize that I will have to wait for the next one, in the meantime I think BI should hire me - or anybody - for the apparently open position of Marketing Strategist.

[teabagginpeople 398]

13 hours ago, Misconduct said:

I would like to encourage BI to focus on the development of vanilla gameplay.

 So you want bis to focus on the vanilla base gameplay. understandable.

 

13 hours ago, Misconduct said:

My hope is to encourage Bohemia to create a DLC which allows players to attach any weapon/object to any vehicle/object in any configuration, along with other improvements like shooting varied mounted weapons from vehicle interiors

e.g. - Attach any vehicle weapons like tank guns to different tanks/vehicles

       - RPGs from helicopter or primary weapons from copilot through windshield.

       - Attach anything functional to anything and it remains functional

 

Then sell it to us.

 

This is you. asking for a bis to make a dlc .wait what? what happen to focus on vanilla game?? yes you ask them to make a dlc in the very same breath as "encouraging" bis to focus on the base vanilla game. fml.

 

11 hours ago, Misconduct said:

in the meantime I think BI should hire me - or anybody - for the apparently open position of Marketing Strategist.

Hire you?    you have polar opposite conflicting opinions in the very same hour and  pitched both ideas hell even started with the same you encourage bis...bahahah  holy shitty delusions batman.  

 

 

 

 

[haleks 8204]

13 hours ago, Misconduct said:

I think Arma 3 is already just shy of being the best game ever made, [...] BI would sell more copies of Arma and DLCs by improving game mechanics over storytelling.

 

Although I disagree with the 1st part of your sentence, I think you're right about storytelling and gameplay. Their latest efforts on narratives and immersion are spoiled by the limits of both gameplay, animations and AI behaviour : you can only do so much when dealing with NPCs acting like broken automats.

[lex__1 422]

2 hours ago, teabagginpeople said:

This is you. asking for a bis to make a dlc .wait what? what happen to focus on vanilla game?? yes you ask them to make a dlc in the very same breath as "encouraging" bis to focus on the base vanilla game. fml.

The basic Arma3 package has many problems that continue to exist and be played back in Arma3 and DLS.
There is a feedback tracker, where a ton of open tickets, with messages - "thank you for your feedback, we'll look at it."
Thanks of course, for thank you)))
This creates a tedious wait for users.
I would prefer to see three answers there:
- "Thanks for your feedback, this will be fixed in the next release, or you can change in the future"
- "Thanks for your feedback, this will be fixed in the next DLS"
- "Thanks for your feedback, this will not be fixed." How much can you ask for this?))) "

I remember discussions about the problem with RAM and the fall of Arma3, they
were reduced to not being able to rectify the situation.  This was beaten by the heavy "birth" of BIS))).
Only for the birth of arma3_x64 - I can continue to buy any DLS))).

[Private Evans 498]

Shooting from vehicles. weapon resting and deploying, advanced flight system, sling loading, vehicle in vehicle, sensor overhaul, dynamic loadouts... just to name a few gameplay features that came as free plattform updates with the dlc's...talking about vanilla gameplay features :)

What you mean are game core mechanics like a new character skeleton, new renderer, better animation system, better ui and inventory systems, better AI etc. These will come with the new engine tech and it would have been an absolutely waste of resources working on this stuff earlier, using the old and outdated game engine. So BI did the right thing...improving the Arma plattform on one side a good as possible  and developing a new game engine at the same time ( DayZ), which will allow all the sweet things like melee combat, stealth systems, climbing jumping ...women...etc.

 

[lexx 1331]

Back when A3 was released, you couldn't even walk and reload at the same time. Or was it walk and switch weapons? That in any case. Not sure anymore about the first one. Anyway. The game we have right now is not even close to what it was a few years ago.

[drebin052 323]

@lexx Just switching weapons on the move. It's always been possible to reload on the move since A2 (only OFP and A1 forced you to stop).

[teabagginpeople 398]

4 hours ago, lex__1 said:

The basic Arma3 package has many problems that continue to exist and be played back in Arma3 and DLS.
There is a feedback tracker, where a ton of open tickets, with messages - "thank you for your feedback, we'll look at it."
Thanks of course, for thank you)))
This creates a tedious wait for users.
I would prefer to see three answers there:
- "Thanks for your feedback, this will be fixed in the next release, or you can change in the future"
- "Thanks for your feedback, this will be fixed in the next DLS"
- "Thanks for your feedback, this will not be fixed." How much can you ask for this?))) "

I remember discussions about the problem with RAM and the fall of Arma3, they
were reduced to not being able to rectify the situation.  This was beaten by the heavy "birth" of BIS))).
Only for the birth of arma3_x64 - I can continue to buy any DLS))).

Did you quote my post by mistake there lex_1??? I don't see the correlation to what I said in the quote to your replying. 

[froggyluv 2130]

On 12/6/2017 at 6:27 PM, Misconduct said:

 

 I think Arma 3 is already just shy of being the best game ever made, with a few tweaks (which I assume would take less effort than creating LoW) and some clever marketing - BI would sell more copies of Arma and DLCs by improving game mechanics over storytelling.

 

 Hear hear!  A little BadBenson type movement, some C2 type AI control,  some actual AI class- based behaviourable (yes i made up that word)  playbooks and its by far the best game made.

7 hours ago, lexx said:

Back when A3 was released, you couldn't even walk and reload at the same time. Or was it walk and switch weapons? That in any case. Not sure anymore about the first one. Anyway. The game we have right now is not even close to what it was a few years ago.

 

 Yes this also true -many of the advancements since Arma2 are almost unfathomable - hard to believe we couldnt switch weapons or reload while moving, or walk over 6 inch steps, or have a 3d editor to turn placing objects from a nightmare into a pleasurable experience and of course Fire from Vehicles. Then we have the Visual & Sound dept Upgrades...

[Private Evans 498]

not to forget....seeing  holstered pistols

[LordJarhead 1721]

On ‎07‎.‎12‎.‎2017 at 12:27 AM, Misconduct said:

I think BI should hire me - or anybody - for the apparently open position of Marketing Strategist

 

Oh well that escalated quickly^^ Trust me, there are many people out there that think they need to be hired to make something better. Doesn't that makes the whole thing better. I'm going to address the Devs a little here!

 

If we go back in time, just a little bit, 4 years maybe, we had a game - in my feeling - no one was happy with. There were so many things to discuss and change. As some mentioned, no walking and switching weapons, no 3D Editor, no decent sounds, no interior sounds or distant sound effects at all, no decent graphics or water reflections, no 64bit, no mod content, not much actually but a basic raw game... or platform if you want. Now we have a really good game, its not perfect, I know, but it's way better than what it once was. In fact, I don't think you can even compare...

 

Yes I'm missing some things back from the old game but also new things, things that I think belong into a game like ArmA, for it wants to be a simulation. Why in earth is there no ability to recharge my half used magazines? Why is PhysX applied but vehicles feel like a brick? Why is there no real ammunition, Ball, FMJ, FHM for handheld weapons, and why can I not load my single magazine by hand in my own chosen order (like every 5 rounds a tracer, or maybe every 10, or 5 FHM, 5 FMJ, 5 so and so)? Why are there no real 3D optics and scope that other games handle so well and make this whole immersion thing going to new level? Why can't I disguise myself in an enemy uniform to be undetected for a while as you showed in your E3 videos if I'm not mistaken?

 

There are more things I probably could count up but I can't get them into my head right now. And yes I know you can do most things with mods. Guess we can be glad BIS allows modding and also seems to COUNT on it, otherwise they'd make "Ubisoft-like products" that aren't touchable at all. We have a giant platform of freedom here, fellas, and that's something we can all count on! ArmA is always going to be a mod-platform so to speak, because that's what made this thing so popular. Did ANYONE, ever, played ArmA3 for a rather long time WITHOUT any sort of mod? I can hardly think so.

 

In fact, they kind of use that principle for them self. The AAF APC, the Mora or what's it called, don't tell me its NOT a warrior model from ArmA2? And besides, I think most models where just recycled but that a whole different topic now. It's fair if they do that, damn its their stuff anyway^^

 

For now, even if they don't touch ArmA3 any more or not as intensive as usual, don't you ask yourself what they'll do with their employees? And still having open jobs going? Yes they focus already on a complete new game... and this is my bloody honest opinion for the Devs: Don't waste any more time in ArmA3 and trying to make it "better", that horse is out the barn, dude! You did what you could and I honestly think that engine came to its Apex! If you think about it, its the same engine from OP, just improved to a level where you just can't stretch it any more! So I'd say learn from that, do something better than that, prepare for the next couple of years by investing into a stable running, smooth working and powerful engine that ALLOWS you to make your dream game come true. And LISTEN for f*ck sake! NO ONE wanted a 2035 sci-fi like game in the first place when we were all still talking about Takistan or Afghan! Get your ears out, look what are the most used mods and kind of adapt yourself to the "benchmark" of gameplay and style. You see RHS and its popularity and success, that should give you an idea what the average user wants!

 

I mean honestly, EA tried that once with Battlefield 2042 or what it was and that game died rather quickly while people TODAY are still playing BF2 or PR. We want current events in a "Simulation" and I think you should get that word "SIMULATION" tattooed on your forehead so you get remembered what the heck you are supposed to do next! For a developer making simulations like VBS, ArmA3 is a shame! Or at least it "was"! But hey, no hard feelings! ArmA survived its own "Battlefield 2042" and now it's time to get back where you belong. I really hope, by all that's worth, the Devs make the right choices! Yes the DLC's are about making money, but I really hope they'll invest that money into the right direction, because if so I'm happily paying 5 bucks for a bunch of missions!

 

Sry I drafted away a little, I guess...

 

LJ

[lex__1 422]

Spoiler

41 minutes ago, LordJarhead said:

 

Oh well that escalated quickly^^ Trust me, there are many people out there that think they need to be hired to make something better. Doesn't that makes the whole thing better. I'm going to address the Devs a little here!

 

If we go back in time, just a little bit, 4 years maybe, we had a game - in my feeling - no one was happy with. There were so many things to discuss and change. As some mentioned, no walking and switching weapons, no 3D Editor, no decent sounds, no interior sounds or distant sound effects at all, no decent graphics or water reflections, no 64bit, no mod content, not much actually but a basic raw game... or platform if you want. Now we have a really good game, its not perfect, I know, but it's way better than what it once was. In fact, I don't think you can even compare...

 

Yes I'm missing some things back from the old game but also new things, things that I think belong into a game like ArmA, for it wants to be a simulation. Why in earth is there no ability to recharge my half used magazines? Why is PhysX applied but vehicles feel like a brick? Why is there no real ammunition, Ball, FMJ, FHM for handheld weapons, and why can I not load my single magazine by hand in my own chosen order (like every 5 rounds a tracer, or maybe every 10, or 5 FHM, 5 FMJ, 5 so and so)? Why are there no real 3D optics and scope that other games handle so well and make this whole immersion thing going to new level? Why can't I disguise myself in an enemy uniform to be undetected for a while as you showed in your E3 videos if I'm not mistaken?

 

There are more things I probably could count up but I can't get them into my head right now. And yes I know you can do most things with mods. Guess we can be glad BIS allows modding and also seems to COUNT on it, otherwise they'd make "Ubisoft-like products" that aren't touchable at all. We have a giant platform of freedom here, fellas, and that's something we can all count on! ArmA is always going to be a mod-platform so to speak, because that's what made this thing so popular. Did ANYONE, ever, played ArmA3 for a rather long time WITHOUT any sort of mod? I can hardly think so.

 

In fact, they kind of use that principle for them self. The AAF APC, the Mora or what's it called, don't tell me its NOT a warrior model from ArmA2? And besides, I think most models where just recycled but that a whole different topic now. It's fair if they do that, damn its their stuff anyway^^

 

For now, even if they don't touch ArmA3 any more or not as intensive as usual, don't you ask yourself what they'll do with their employees? And still having open jobs going? Yes they focus already on a complete new game... and this is my bloody honest opinion for the Devs: Don't waste any more time in ArmA3 and trying to make it "better", that horse is out the barn, dude! You did what you could and I honestly think that engine came to its Apex! If you think about it, its the same engine from OP, just improved to a level where you just can't stretch it any more! So I'd say learn from that, do something better than that, prepare for the next couple of years by investing into a stable running, smooth working and powerful engine that ALLOWS you to make your dream game come true. And LISTEN for f*ck sake! NO ONE wanted a 2035 sci-fi like game in the first place when we were all still talking about Takistan or Afghan! Get your ears out, look what are the most used mods and kind of adapt yourself to the "benchmark" of gameplay and style. You see RHS and its popularity and success, that should give you an idea what the average user wants!

 

I mean honestly, EA tried that once with Battlefield 2042 or what it was and that game died rather quickly while people TODAY are still playing BF2 or PR. We want current events in a "Simulation" and I think you should get that word "SIMULATION" tattooed on your forehead so you get remembered what the heck you are supposed to do next! For a developer making simulations like VBS, ArmA3 is a shame! Or at least it "was"! But hey, no hard feelings! ArmA survived its own "Battlefield 2042" and now it's time to get back where you belong. I really hope, by all that's worth, the Devs make the right choices! Yes the DLC's are about making money, but I really hope they'll invest that money into the right direction, because if so I'm happily paying 5 bucks for a bunch of missions!

 

Sry I drafted away a little, I guess...

 

LJ

All right? Or are there dependencies?
It can be written by any of us, everyone will put an emphasis on their favorite genre (character) of the game in Arma3.
Here everyone finds something their own, which is closer to him, this is the main feature of the possibilities of this project for many years.
But it will be like a story from how a lover is no longer able to pay attention to all of his women))).
I think in BF2 or PR do not have such feelings))).

[lexx 1331]

3 hours ago, LordJarhead said:

And LISTEN for f*ck sake! NO ONE wanted a 2035 sci-fi like game in the first place when we were all still talking about Takistan or Afghan!

 

I was alright with your post until you had to write this. Please, speak for yourself, because I sure as hell wouldn't have wanted yet another Takistan, or Afghan themed game, nor would I have wanted the Operation Flashpoint theme back. A3 did the right thing with doing something that wasn't done before (in the series).

Besides, as has been said about a million times already, the A3 setting is anything but Sci-Fi. Heck, in parts it isn't even "modern times" anymore.

[LordJarhead 1721]

5 minutes ago, lexx said:

 

I was alright with your post until you had to write this. Please, speak for yourself, because I sure as hell wouldn't have wanted yet another Takistan, or Afghan themed game, nor would I have wanted the Operation Flashpoint theme back. A3 did the right thing with doing something that wasn't done before (in the series).

 

I think you got me wrong there a little or I made a mistake, I wouldnt have wanted another Afghan scenario either, I was talking about the Sci Fi future scenario, it was suddenly not ... well not real anymore... it made a great step from simulation to fps shooter... or tactic shooter or what ever we wanna call it. I was just frustrated back then.

 

I adapted tho and got used to it. I gotta tell you, I kinda like it now, honestly... But also I miss some hardcore military gameplay and I just couldn't get into it when I see alian helmets and weird weapons that didn't had real names and such...

 

After all, just my opinion :/

 

LJ

[teabagginpeople 398]

1 hour ago, lexx said:

 

I was alright with your post until you had to write this. Please, speak for yourself, because I sure as hell wouldn't have wanted yet another Takistan, or Afghan themed game, nor would I have wanted the Operation Flashpoint theme back. A3 did the right thing with doing something that wasn't done before (in the series).

Besides, as has been said about a million times already, the A3 setting is anything but Sci-Fi. Heck, in parts it isn't even "modern times" anymore.

I think we all know what jarhead is saying here. And I think lexx you are in a series minority here.

 

If they had of continued being Mil sim like arma 2 but added drones. Ti, and all the other stuff it would have tilted a different way.

 

It would have had more impact on sales. From a purely business perspective I have no doubt about this. You can disagree but the knowledge is out there. 

 

 

Rhs and all them mods.... pubg???  didn't get so popular for no good reason... Squad.... 

 

If you want to go future create a separate ip. even a juggernaut like Cod even has proven this. 

 

Arma had it's identity. 

 

[LordJarhead 1721]

Damn straight mate! 

 

People still need to identify... Sci-fi works like Mass Effect but only for the great story telling and letting the player identify themselves with Shepard or Raider or whatever they are called. In ArmA you could count on things you know and things that are real kinda. 

 

Everyone knows what to expect when a T90 comes around the corner... But when a Varsuk is coming.... Ehm... Weird. Hehe

 

Bohemia gave away a chance to improve further into an ultimate military simulation. I honestly think, and call me crazy, but Squad would never have made if Arma 3 had catched up after Arma 2 and kept going with authentic military experience... Just saying... 

[lex__1 422]

6 hours ago, LordJarhead said:

I adapted tho and got used to it. I gotta tell you, I kinda like it now, honestly... But also I miss some hardcore military gameplay and I just couldn't get into it when I see alian helmets and weird weapons that didn't had real names and such...

Why do you think BIS removed the original names of weapons, cars, tanks and aircraft?

[Grumpy Old Man 3540]

11 hours ago, LordJarhead said:

Damn straight mate! 

 

People still need to identify... Sci-fi works like Mass Effect but only for the great story telling and letting the player identify themselves with Shepard or Raider or whatever they are called. In ArmA you could count on things you know and things that are real kinda. 

 

Everyone knows what to expect when a T90 comes around the corner... But when a Varsuk is coming.... Ehm... Weird. Hehe

 

Bohemia gave away a chance to improve further into an ultimate military simulation. I honestly think, and call me crazy, but Squad would never have made if Arma 3 had catched up after Arma 2 and kept going with authentic military experience... Just saying... 

 

By the time A3 came out basically every vehicle in game is being used by military anywhere in the world.

Basically every hollywood war movie features cold war era/wwII scenarios, that's why folks everywhere complain about arma 3 being futuristic when it's actually up to date on currently used military technology all around the globe.

 

6 hours ago, lex__1 said:

Why do you think BIS removed the original names of weapons, cars, tanks and aircraft?

 

Licensing.

You'd get a pretty nice lawsuit when using real world manufacturer names for models in a video game.

To use real weapon/vehicle names in a game you'd have to get/purchase permission and go through some legal hoops and most likely need to adjust models/change models if the manufacturer requests it.

Not really worth it, even for multi-million dollar game companies.

 

That's the main reason for the in game opfor trucks to be named zamak, with the real life counterpart kamaz.

Goes on for basically everything in game that has a name. Ifrit is the Ansyr MRAP, the Hunter is an Oshkosh M-ATV.

All of these things are not science fiction or

List goes on.

 

Cheers

[drebin052 323]

One of your complaints is that the majority of stuff in vanilla A3 don't have their real names? Seriously?

 

And wow...

 

11 hours ago, teabagginpeople said:

Rhs and all them mods.... pubg???

 

Oh come on, you can do better than that...

 

PUBG came from a gamemode that primarily utilised vanilla assets (not including servers that used mods of course, which were the minority not the majority). RHS on the other hand, is a total conversion mod. Do tell me how many high population servers exclusively use RHS or any other real equipment addon.

 

11 hours ago, teabagginpeople said:

didn't get so popular for no good reason...

 

People play PUBG because it has fun team-based gameplay without being too arcadey on the same level of Battlefield, not because it uses "real" stuff.

 

11 hours ago, teabagginpeople said:

Squad.... 

 

Yes, the definition of popularity:

 

 

11 hours ago, teabagginpeople said:

If you want to go future create a separate ip. even a juggernaut like Cod even has proven this. 

 

You know full well that Infinite Warfare's problems didn't stem exclusively from its sci-fi setting.

 

And besides, both Ghosts and Advanced Warfare on the other hand were quite well received (the complaints stemmed from other gameplay issues) despite being set in the same near future setting like A3...except that A3 doesn't have exoskeletons and 3D printer guns that reload via phlebotinum.

 

11 hours ago, teabagginpeople said:

Arma had it's identity. 

 

You mean what you perceived as its identity. Don't confuse your own idealism with reality:

 

Quote

[...]

 

After Operation Arrowhead, Bohemia decided to do something quite different, something science fiction, combining the talents of the acquired Altar Games studio in Brno (UFO trilogy) and Arma. "Fighting aliens, that was the concept," he says. "It was not a direct sequel originally but we wanted to experiment a bit - to crossover between the two genres we had in the company."

 

That's when Španel picked the Greek island of Lemnos for the setting, albeit for something called Arma Futura rather than Arma 3. The design apparently changed towards something more RPG but still science-fiction and apocalyptic, rather than fighting aliens in real-time strategy battles on smaller islands. It could be a one-man show on a big chunk of land, the team decided. But as time wound on, it became less and less science-fiction and more and more Arma 3.

 

[...]

 

[Grumpy Old Man 3540]

2 hours ago, drebin052 said:

RHS on the other hand, is a total conversion mod.

 

No, it's not. It doesn't overhaul any of armas systems, gameplay, configs or other mechanics. It's a mod with units, weapons and vehicles, a glorious, excellent one at that.

Total conversion would be to turn arma 3 into a top down view sims emulator.

 

Personally I'd like the arma series to go more towards the authentic direction that A2 was heading to.

Instead we got no more female civilians, no more battlefield clearance and wound modules, no more permanently broken legs which forced you to crawl unless a medic took care of you.

Now we have official missions that encourage you to loot stuff, give you ammo crates with tens of first aid kits in them so you can shrug of as many non lethal bullets as you have FAKs...

 

 

2 hours ago, drebin052 said:

You mean what you perceived as its identity. Don't confuse your own idealism with reality:

 

So tankbuster has to see arma the same way the devs were seeing it when they were experimenting with a potential successor prototype, no matter if he had any part in it or not?

What's your point?

 

Cheers

 

[462cid 28]

I find jumping a strange omission

 

But I'm an OFP guy, and the fact that the player can swim instead of drown is still amazing to me

[stburr91 994]

On 12/6/2017 at 4:16 PM, Misconduct said:

I would like to encourage BI to focus on the development of vanilla gameplay.

We have recently been sold DLC content that is a specific use of existing game mechanics, when there are larger issues to work out.

I understand that BI needs to make money to produce, I just think that improving game functionality will increase the player base and sales more than Laws of War.

If BI want to sell us the ability to jump, I would buy that - before I ever buy Laws of War.

 

In short, we are currently playing a game where climbing a fence is an impossible task - but being eaten by a rock isn't.

 

 

 

 

Put simply, this is a for profit business venture for BI. There is no money in making some improvements to some of the gameplay, the money is in providing DLC.

 

If we want an Arma 4 someday, BI needs to generate revenue for the development. Of course they also need to generate enough profit to justify the effort, it's that simple.