Reflector sights?

I'm surprised at how many people don't know sights such as AimPoint or EOTech work this way. I guess it's because most people these days base all their military opinions/facts on video games as opposed to experience in the military.

@Alex72

This is the thing i posted on page 2. I did not use any headtracking device this moment. But in clan training we make trainings and challenges, e.g. having to shoot down 20 targets at different times (less time for rising prestige). So i had 22 seconds but if you think you aim correct and then the bullets go anywhere, its horrible Then it would be better to have no red dot and aim with the bead sight of the M4...

So close to getting it working in Arma2. Not to bore people outside of the o2 editing section, but there is something very different and bugged about the way a gun's pilot view lod uses alpha channels. The very geometric shape and texture coordinates of an object using alpha channels can make the gun draw BEHIND the soldiers hands. I can make flat panels that use alphas, but if I make a cone/cylinder, it craps up the whole thing. This is a very specific bug, so specific its almost like they built the engine to intentionally make these sights impossible. I really don't understand why it works the way it does, but I have locked down most of the rules for making gun sights properly. I should have a workable test release soon!

Nice to hear your on it Sakura Chan and hope you sort it out eventually. Wish i had those skills of yours so i could help...

Appreciating your efforts mate. :)

That Eotech demo looks awesome, thanks for keeping at this. Truth to be told it never really bothered me that much, but I'm all for more realism and easier time hitting targets.

I never noticed, maybe if you can draw BIS attention they will fix it for OA?

I'm just about ready to delete this whole thing. There is absolutely NO LOGIC to this bug!!! Nothing makes sense!!! There is no common connection between geometry that works and geometry that doesn't work. Even duplicating identical geometry will break it, so I thought "maybe its a polygon count restriction!" so I reduce the polygon count and it still breaks!!! Its not the size, surface area or textures/rvmats, so WTF can it be? I some how managed to get something working in the tiniest sliver of random luck, but as soon as I add any new geometry (just need enough to cover the last little bit of the recticle that is visible outside of the sight) it breaks down completely. I'm going to take a day or two off from this because it is driving me insane.

Perhaps you could let BIS know about the method you're using, maybe they can do something about it in case you can't figure it out? I remember a very early ArmA2 video where they had tried proper parallax sights, but they had to drop them because of the alpha bug. Maybe using your method they could implement them in Operation Arrowhead.

Yep they say that they simply can't do it because it is an engine limitation and it seems that BIS don't know a work around. But this stiff dot combined with fidgety animation makes it impossible to aim. Playing a training with my clan, first i had aimed correctly but i did not hit the target until i remembered that there is no realistic sight. :(

If you just lower the aiming deadzone the dot will be more in place, i dont know why do you need that much deadzone...

Anyways, shaku, that looks awesome.

for most of us its just that when kneeling down,the gun twists about and the dot becomes useless because it doesnt point where the bullets go. doesnt happen when standing or prone afaik. i guess if the dot was implemented correctly then all would be well but why not just stop the stupid kneeling gun movement. make it the same as standing at least.

Perhaps you could let BIS know about the method you're using, maybe they can do something about it in case you can't figure it out? I remember a very early ArmA2 video where they had tried proper parallax sights, but they had to drop them because of the alpha bug. Maybe using your method they could implement them in Operation Arrowhead.

Found one of the vids I was talking about.

http://n-joy.cz/video/arma-2-tiscali-gc-video-1/ocxguqaDqXS1TsJy

You can also see the bug in its full glory.

Found one of the vids I was talking about.

http://n-joy.cz/video/arma-2-tiscali-gc-video-1/ocxguqaDqXS1TsJy

You can also see the bug in its full glory.

Couldn't they for instance render the dot invisible when it jumps outside the lense with a transparent texture or something? Anyway I could have lived with that bug rather than have the current kind of sights because the current aimpoint sights don't serve their purpose for crying out loud. I hope they'll have another look at this issue sooner or later.

Edited October 9, 2009 by King Nothing

Mhh, posted in the editing section, should have searched up front. Sad to see even someone not as incompetent in modding as me has the same problems. Please BIS, fix this for Arrowhead :pet5:

I agree we really need working parallax free sights. Anyone who wants to see the difference can use this test addon.

I've found an interesting Named Property that is applied to the View Geometry:

CanOcclude=0

switches off occlusions, used for objects which cannot act as occluders because their view geometry is not representative of their real shape, like foliage

Maybe it's just simple lead...

Are there any news? Has this bug been reported in the bugtracker already?

Mhh, posted in the editing section, should have searched up front. Sad to see even someone not as incompetent in modding as me has the same problems. Please BIS, fix this for Arrowhead :pet5:

I agree we really need working parallax free sights. Anyone who wants to see the difference can use this test addon.

Anyone tested the above addon yet?

I don't think it's as easy as just "changing" something in a patch to get true aimpoint/eotech sights. Even MW2, and OFP2 don't model it correct.

DR and MW don´t need to simulate the sights properly because they have no viewbob as Arma 2 does. I think if the issue with the collimating sights can´t be resolved, it would be best to just remove that viewbob for weapons with reflector sights.

Another solution I´ve already seen suggested somewhere else on the forums would be to use the already existing crosshairs, except tying them into the respective weapons config (So a weapon with an Eotech displays the ring instead of a dot), and only make the crosshair appear when one is aiming trough the sights, and change when NV goggles are used, for example.

DR and MW don't need to simulate the sights properly because they don't care. They just need to look cool to sell more copies.

But yeah, like I said, doing it properly is a very difficult task.

DR and MW don't need to simulate the sights properly because they don't care. They just need to look cool to sell more copies.

But yeah, like I said, doing it properly is a very difficult task.

Well, it depends, I guess. IL-2 or FSX are perfectly capable of pulling collimating sights off with texture trickery. Perhaps in the case of Arma, some thinking outside of the box is necessary.

I´ve tried a little to understand how the whole modding process with BIS games works since I began playing OFP in 2001, but I´ve never figured it out.

Maybe one of those who were able to could enlighten me as to wether it would be possible to do this by using the GUI crosshairs, instead of a texture on the model?

Maybe one of those who were able to could enlighten me as to wether it would be possible to do this by using the GUI crosshairs, instead of a texture on the model?

This.

How about aimpoints and reflex type sights have a GUI crosshair that is visible (only) while 'aiming' down the sights? Then alter said crosshair to have the proper reticule.

Something like that would surely be possible. Sure it might not always be 100% accurate (crosshair might be visible outside the bounds of the sight; but isn't that the point of the holo-sights in the first place?

-k

The problem is i think you really cant fit the "crosshair" to show only in the aimpoint area (if you try you end up with a seconf crosshair all over the place most of the time) and there are issues with the viewpilot rendering. Arma2 really uses different system than other games do. Everything you see from 1st person is looking the same as from 3rd or 4rth person view only a bit more detailed as opposed to other games which use the 1st person cool weapon model attached to flying camera / 3rd person weapons which look like crap. And since the Arma way is identical to the real thing you will have to model real world physics (mainly optical physics) at a very very high level. Which is not possible/optimal for current gaming assets

Are there any news? Has this bug been reported in the bugtracker already?

There is a feature request on the CIT (with only 17 votes so far, so vote everyone). Mondkalb had an idea to use the mirror effect (see barracks bathroom for example, north from Utes tower) but that didn't work very good and only when facing north.

Maybe ACE2 will at least tune down the "shaking" again as in ACE1, but that only helps a bit with the symptoms and not the cause.

Maybe one of those who were able to could enlighten me as to wether it would be possible to do this by using the GUI crosshairs, instead of a texture on the model?

I think it's hardcoded to remove crosshairs when aiming so far.

This.

How about aimpoints and reflex type sights have a GUI crosshair that is visible (only) while 'aiming' down the sights? Then alter said crosshair to have the proper reticule.

Something like that would surely be possible. Sure it might not always be 100% accurate (crosshair might be visible outside the bounds of the sight; but isn't that the point of the holo-sights in the first place?

-k

Yes, it seems only BIS can do something. I guess seeing it outside would be not a real problem as the parallax is never so extreme when aiming. Another way would be a seperate pilotLOD only for aimed view, but again nothing a modder can do.

So again: Please BIS, at least fix this for OA :pet5: