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The simple way to resolve this in a realistic manner is for people that want 3rd person view to do what soldiers do in real life and move their head A LOT. Nobody relies on peripheral vision to save them from an enemy threat.
The simple way to resolve this in a realistic manner is for people that want 3rd person view to do what soldiers do in real life and move their head A LOT. Nobody relies on peripheral vision to save them from an enemy threat.
I cant beleive ppl are arguing FOR 3rd person view in a mil sim!.. I shall just switch to the camera I have stuck on top of a pole taped to my back to get a better view! crazy!
3rd Person View has it's realistic advantages with a sim. It also has an arcadish side that can be exploited for it's gaming potential.
First Person View is not as realistic as people think and claim it is. It is far more of a claustrophobic interaction with the world around you then you would normally have. Your field of view is only, at most, 90 degrees and you have no peripheral vision. You also lack the natural sense for your personal space.
Third person view creates a more natural sense of situational awareness.
The downside, because no "system" or mode is without compromises, is that you can "peek" around objects. You can also get a great deal more situational awareness then perhaps you should. Like when driving a vehicle.
However, this is a game with a limited interface through which you can interact with a virtual world. There have to be compromises. Try driving a car in the real world with a neck brace on and your peripheral vision locked out to a 75 degree field of view. Try parking your car like that. I can throw a ball into the air from my left hand and catch it with my right hand all without looking at my hands, I just "know" where my hands are in relation to the ball at all times. I just typed out this post without looking at the keyboard at all... I just know where my fingers are in relation to the keyboard. Try modeling that into a virtual 3D world displayed to you on a flat 2D window in which you only get so many buttons to push to accomplish whatever it is you want to do in the game world.
People who decry the virtues of realism in a video game often ignore the fact that the very premise of trying to emulate reality in a fake virtual format requires all kinds of compromise. It just comes down to which compromises they're prepared to ordain and accept or ignore for the sake of their fantasy.
It's always interesting debating "reality" in a video game with hardcore armchair commando's. Fortunately ArmA is customizable... it caters to everyone.
PS: I can peek over a wall or from around a corner without exposing a full third of my body you know. However, I have never known how to respawn myself after having been shot dead.
Last edited by Spamurai; Jul 6 2009 at 16:01.
Actually, in another thread someone measured the FOV in 1st person, and it was ~80-90deg. Zoom out and you will have more, I wouldn't be surprised if it's the full 120deg FOV.
The thing is, you can't have a realistic view on a computer monitor, simply due to pixel size (and to a lesser degree, physical size). The bigger your FOV, the smaller each object is to the point where it becomes invisible due to it being represented by too few pixels (or a too small silhouette). That's why games don't give you 120deg realistic FOV by default.
Note that 3rd person does NOTHING to help this issue. You still have to choose between a biger FOV to better visibility of distant objects. The only thing 3rd person does is allow you to see things that you cannot physically see in any way IRL. It's a 100% realism killer.
1st person IS the realism mode. Not perfect realism, but with proper zoom features it is the best a computer monitor can give you. 3rd person doesn't give you anything that you would've had IRL that you can't have in 1st person.
The only real issue is the fact your head is nailed to the chair when in vehicles, but most are still perfectly manageable. Tank drivers don't see jack s!@# IRL either. I've driven an APC, and my vision was definitely s!@#, you pretty much HAVE to have someone telling you where to go and warn you of certain obstacles, not to mention guide you step by step when you want to reverse. This is all implemented in game by the commander-driver quick commands. In helicopters/airplanes I'm not sure how much being allowed to realistically move your head/body would help - it'd definitely not help nearly as much as the 3rd person view helps.
Last edited by galzohar; Jul 6 2009 at 17:15.
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That indeed means that you are saying that it is realistic to turn your head constantly from one side to another during the whole game to - that way - gather the real field of view (FOV).Originally Posted by galzohar
While you concentrate on the monitor - right now ! - you sure realize a person or a thing that moves behind a straight line of your both shoulders, i.e. that is 90 degree right and left of you. The FOV therefore is more than 180 degree.
To reduce this to the egoshooterviewingangle you have without 3rd view ... you use blinds on horses ... and ... you can use a gasmask to do the same.
You would never like to get in a dangerous combat situation that way or - as shown above - try to get your car in a parking lot.
Before we were forced to use "just another datacollecting and advertising imposing machine on users machine like steam" my signature went like this for many, many years:
"There was once a dark age when players were herded like cattle down rigid gaming paths - and Bohemia Interactive Studios were the Che Guevara types who set them free."Watch n' listen: Thank you, Bohemia for fascinating games since 2001. Engine: Win8 32-Bit on AMD64 6000 X2 (2 x 3100 MHz) * NVidia 9600 GT 1024 MByte * 1920 x 1080 pixels * 27'' TFT * RAM 3 GByte - it all works very smooth especially because of SSD!
Online i want 1st - in SP on my own i love the 3d for the reason that i love to see my guy. He looks so damn cool.
The good thing about a2 is that it gives options to use. If somebody prefers 3rd view its not my place to say you play the game wrong way. If its more fun, more power to them. After all guys this is a game, and lot of things are done to make it fun for example, in a2 you can get in a chopper and be airborne within 5 sec. Can you do that in real life? I don’t think so. But that’s fine, its good the way things are in a2, its got good balance between being realistic and still maintain that fun factor. Would anybody want to fly choppers if you had to get in the chopper and go through 45 steps checking that all your systems are working, making sure everything is in place every time you want to fly? For me it would be boring. I want to get in. get the bird airborne and focus on mission and tactics.
Like I already explained, 3rd person does not solve FOV problems. It doesn't increase your FOV - all it does is let you see stuff that are in your character's vicinity - most of which you wouldn't have been able to see IRL, and most of the stuff you complained about not seeing in 1st person are not visible in 3rd person either. It's a net realism LOSS. Zooming out for extra FOV does solve FOV problems, so if you still think you don't have enough FOV after zooming out you should cry some more so BIS fixes it.
It seems like the zoomed out FOV is 120deg (which is more or less as far as your eyes can see IRL without moving them), though I hadn't measured it directly yet (look at one of the ACOG threads for similar FOV measurements). They should just fix it so that you can use it anywhere and not just when using a weapon with non-magnifying sights, and also make it go up to 120 degrees if it doesn't already.
The only reason the default FOV is smaller than the realistic FOV is becuase a realistic FOV would reduce your visibility distance (distance to which an object is visible rather than a pixel), and with a monitor you simply can't have both. 3rd person doesn't let you have both either, it just gives you other cheats in its place so that you can play it like it's World of Warcraft.
I doubt its anything but the standard 80-90 FOV. 120 is alot for a game. IMO any FOV other than 90 translate poorly to a monitor. In the worst examples you get a fisheye lens which makes one dizzy and nauscious.
The standard FOV is definitely somewhere between 80 and 90, and you can zoom that out quite a bit more than that. And again, no 3rd person is going to give you that lost FOV back.
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