ArmA Modelling Basics

[blackjack[VS]]

sup everyone, i guess some wiki about normal maps would clarify some of the minds here...the bump map technique u mentioned is the nvidia plugin for photoshop and gimp, that usually works good for hatches and small details. the high poly/low poly normal map capture is always the best option for a quality model.
I use XSI from softimage at work and home, and its really nice and easy to make the tranfer of all the maps from the high/low poly models(ultimapper).
cl10k i strongly advise u to grab xsi 30 days demo fully working, and give it a shot with ur maya models. u can find a short video tutorial on their homepage inside the new features area.

[Delirium]

even better way is to use xnormal, which is free and at times it works way better that XSI or even a scultping app like mudbox or Zbrush.

[Sennacherib]

Ahh, ok.

So you ARE making bump maps... But...

You are aware that they wont work in ArmA right?

ArmA REQUIRES the RGB Normal Maps (the ones that look blue) and wont work with greyscale bump maps...

lol, i'm not stupid, i use the nvidia filter to have the needed rgb normal map.

why i should use the high polys method, just to add 4 or 5 details and to create scrathes on a hull for example?

a quick example:

[cl10k]

i don't think it was ment in a offensive way and since this is MY! topic everybody behave!

but i agree with you d@nte, i think it is totally overkill to build a highpoly just for scratches and stuff

@Delirium: thx for the hint towards xnormal, i read about it some time ago and since maya normal mapping is making trouble on my comp i will definetly give it a try!

[DM]

@ May 26 2007,03:09)]...the bump map technique u mentioned is the nvidia plugin for photoshop and gimp, that usually works good for hatches and small details. the high poly/low poly normal map capture is always the best option for a quality model.

No... it isnt. if you're making a Normal Map you're making a Normal Map, regardless of whether you're hand drawing it using the nVidia plugin, or whether you're generating it from a high poly model. If you're making a Bump Map, then you're making a Bump Map and the methods can be called "Bump Map methods".

lol, i'm not stupid, i use the nvidia filter to have the needed rgb normal map.

why i should use the high polys method, just to add 4 or 5 details and to create scrathes on a hull for example?

Where did I call you stupid? And where did I say you HAVE to generate Normal Maps from high poly models?

I didn't. I simply clarified that if you're making Bump Maps as per the tutorial you used, they will NOT WORK in ArmA. You have to make Normal Maps, and how you do that is up to you, whether you hand draw them or generate them from a high poly model, it doesnt matter as long as its a Normal Map and NOT a Bump Map.

Edit to add: And no, it wasnt meant in an offensive manner, but since this is meant to be a "help about the basics" thread, I want to make sure that there is 100% NO ambiguity. And throwing around phrases like "bump map" and "normal map" doesnt help.

[blackjack[VS]]

hey deadmeat i'm sory if sound pretensious or anything with my 2cents... i just sayed what i've read/listen from the many professionals around the gaming world. having a high poly model as a base usually is the best way. for small details u have "handpainted" method, but for gears, uniforms, faces and other "organic" shapes u need the high poly reference like or not.
My point was to give cl10k a "hand" on this subject and since u seem to domain this subject so well, i'll keep silent...
Good luck cl10k and i hope to your work soon!

[DM]

@ May 26 2007,14:09)]hey deadmeat i'm sory if sound pretensious or anything with my 2cents... i just sayed what i've read/listen from the many professionals around the gaming world. having a high poly model as a base usually is the best way. for small details u have "handpainted" method, but for gears, uniforms, faces and other "organic" shapes u need the high poly reference like or not.
My point was to give cl10k a "hand" on this subject and since u seem to domain this subject so well, i'll keep silent...

Nah, thats cool. I actually agree with you 100%

Its always technically "better" to generate normal maps from a higher detail model, but in a lot of cases its simply too time consuming (especially for the hobbyist) to do for every single model you make.

ArmA requires LoDs, to make a QUALITY LoD set, you should aim to have 7 LoDs, add to that a high poly normal reference, and you've got to re-model everything 8 times, as well as ensuring the UV set remains the same. Now multiply that by the number of things you actually want to create for the game, and you can see that there is a hell of a lot of work ahead of you.

And its certainly not about dominating the subject. I know for a FACT that there is a HUGE amount I can still learn from other people. My point so far has been to make sure the terminology is correct

[Nephilim]

well both methods are quite valid.
it just depends on what you want to achieve

if you have a very detailed model that just needs to have surface detail it sure would be stupid to create high poly model for irt and scratches or small bolts.
this can easily be done with the photochop plugin using greyscale images (bumpmaps :P ) as height reference.

the other method using high poly reference models and applying the normals of the high ref model onto the low poly model has the advantage that it actually captures surface geometry.
you cant really paint thise with photoshop as it will always look very arkward due transistion steps.
the only disadvantage that normal maps have is that they are perpendicular and the actual low poly geometry will always be visible at the edges :/

http://www.view4u.com.br/Nano_map.jpg

indeed thats a very good example.
this kinda of normal map captured geometry you cant paint.
or at least it would take ALOT of time and effort that simply doesnt do any justice in my eyes

but actually to heat up the turmoil abit *grin*
those arma normal maps kinda look like simple bump maps dyed in pink..
whereas pink = valley, white = peaks.

cheers

[DM]

but actually to heat up the turmoil abit *grin*
those arma normal maps kinda look like simple bump maps dyed in pink..
whereas pink = valley, white = peaks.

You'll be talking about the Specular maps there then...

Lets put this one to bed for good shall we:

ArmA UH60 textures

Diffuse map (uh60_2_co)


Normal Map (uh60_2_nohq)


Specular Map (uh60_2_smdi)



Can we please stop this pointless BS now? Thanks

[Nephilim]

oopps! my fault XD
sorry