If everything was created ~10,000 years ago, then how are we seeing 20,000,000 year old light from distant galaxies? Wouldn't you have to refute trigonometry in order to disprove any rough measurements of the distance to the light source?Originally Posted by [b
#102
Now, that is a proof - you make up an explanation and you show the explanation you made up is wrong. What if the whole thing was something different? What if only the sun appeared not moving (for exaple by changing refracting characteristics of athmosphere)? ... What if it was something completely else, unpredicted by you? (For anyone reading this: I am not claiming it happened, and I am not claiming I am able to prove it happened. What I am trying to show is that "It is entirely possible to prove it ... " is an overstatement).
There are many things in the history on mankind which happened, but nobody recorded it. Again - what you offer here is no proof, only a theory.
Ondrej Spanel, BIS Lead Programmer
Science and Beliefs are looking at the same fact.
Science will explain the How
Belief will explain the Why
Science and Belief are not the opposite in the mind of a believer. They are in fact very complementary.
Some scientifics are believers, some are not.
For the atheist , there is no why for a fact, for the believer there is a why for a fact, and that is the same for every people , from the simple minded to the scientific with high knowledge.
That is why no discussion are possible, and we can see the unfortunate result in this thread as in all other thread like this already made.
Now, for the content of this thread : i respect atheists view , as i have lot of atheists friends despite i am a believer, because they have the right to make this choice and i have no right to force them to share my view.
But i do not respect atheist that has no respect for my beliefs, especially in this thread.
...Because there wasn't a creation
In fact it does explain a lot of things. There is nothing except a lack of information stopping science knowing what happened at instant zero; it's not impossible for it to be found out. You are not very up to date with the latest theories: one such theory describes the entire event.
No, because they are not bringing nothing.
The same thing that happened to you before you were born.
Answered much more satisfactorily that religion, whose answer is.... we don't know. Maybe you'll go somewhere nice. But with absolutely no evidence behind that.
It is not a satisfactory answer. Which religion? Which part of which religion? Etc.
No, it was created to answer legitimate questions, like the one above.
[/quote]Which it never did.
A tool which has served its purpose and is now completely useless.
One of which suceeds, the other fails totallyWrong.
The fact of gravity is never going to change. Etc.
Religion. Not race. For his religion.
Banned.
Ever heard of Occams razor?Now, that is a proof - you make up an explanation and you show the explanation you made up is wrong. What if the whole thing was something different? What if only the sun appeared not moving (for exaple by changing refracting characteristics of athmosphere)? ... What if it was something completely else, unpredicted by you? (For anyone reading this: I am not claiming it happened, and I am not claiming I am able to prove it happened. What I am trying to show is that "It is entirely possible to prove it ... " is an overstatement).
You are also confusing two different definitions of theory: the mathematical and the commonly used one.
I'm using 'prove' as in 'establish beyond reasonable doubt.'
Its far far far far more probable that the sun did not 'stop in the sky' than it did.
But not when there were thousands of people writing down concurrent events at the time anyway, who would certainly have noticed large scale events such as these.
Again, its far more likely that the dead did not rise from their graves, the sky didn't turn black, etc and that someone simply embellished the story.
Getting tired of dealing with the same crap again and again.
What does belief actually explain?
It explains NOTHING.
All it does is answer a question with another question.
Science and belief are opposites, regardless of what deluded people think. Already posts by Denoir as to why.
And once again, atheism is not a belief.
I cannot choose to believe in something that is untrue.
That is simply not true. Religion such as Hinduism and Buddhism as well as even our religion do give clear answers to ***questions. or do you believe the 10 commandments arent clear instructions.
What is so stupid about that? You may question the existance of god but have you never read the one or other interesting chapter in the bible. Dont you think for example the story of the "lost son" is one that is realy worth thinking about. Would the story become clearer if the bible would explain why this or that happened. Sorry but I prefer to think about the reason myself.
And usually the best way to make someone understand the solution to a problem is to ask him the right question so he finds it himself.
If you would have lived in Asia as I did then you would know how beautiful the religion shapes the lifestyle and culture of people, their way of respecting each other, to be honnest, friendly and modest and to relief themselves from stress through meditation. Have a look at Burma for a few weeks and then come back and tell me again into my face "religion is stupid because it cannot be proven by science".
I didn't need the commandments to know that murder is wrong. I didn't need the commandments to know that stealing is wrong.
Okay, I've been stumbling through this whole thread somewhat bewildered. Am I the only one here who believes in God, yet at the same time, craves science? I believe (can I not say believe in conjunction with science? Too bad.) in evolution, and the big bang, and new theories excite me. I take the Bible lightly, more as a moral guideline than historical fact (I find 3,000 year old men afraid of their own shadow to be untrustworthy historical sources). Until reading this thread, I was not aware that science and religion were apparently incompatable. Neither can prove everything, and IMO, the world (at least my world) would be somewhat empty without one or the other. I find too many things left unexplained by science, or as somebody mentioned earlier, incomprehensible by humans, to not believe in God. But (brace yourself, hardcore science athiests) most people are not religious simply to prove things, or explain history and theories, etc. They are religious because it makes them feel better, it makes them feel they have a purpose. That needs to be understood. Only the extremists (I'm going out on a limb here and going back to the original topic) use religion to explain everything, and damn everybody that disagrees. Extremist athiests do the opposite. Both are annoying.
\"Fryman, we're full of religion now. Everyone, bow your heads and pretend to be serious.\" - Ignignokt
Ah yes? and where does sense of right and wrong come from? Did you eat it, were you born with it? If so, why did nature give you the feeling of what is wrong and what is right? What would be the use for our species? NONE! Still you got it!I didn't need the commandments to know that murder is wrong. I didn't need the commandments to know that stealing is wrong.
In case you werent born with it. What in our culture has created this sense of community rules. So you have because you are so much smarter than the Atztekes who regularily killed for fun. Religion shaped our way of respecting and dealing with each other
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