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drebin052

Next DLC and Expansion Speculation

Which DLC do you like the most?  

21 members have voted

  1. 1. Which DLC do you like the most?

    • Helicopter DLC
      13
    • Marksmen DLC
      7


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With A3's campaign finished and Zeus almost ready for release, where does BI intend to set the next expansion in? My conclusion would be that this inevitable expansion would be set in none other than the Pacific! Or more specifically, East/South-East Asia. Why Asia you ask? There are obvious hints throughout the entire vanilla campaign that are thrown at you, from idle chatter, to the intro video for the first mission and all the way to one of the epilogues.

Note that this is about the campaign and the setting for the next "island", not features and whatnot.

Without further ado, let's breakdown what information you can scrounge from official media:

DRAWDOWN 2035 Intro

Summary

- Roughly 30 seconds into the news report, a map of SEA is shown with reporters commentating about the U.S. shifting its focus from Europe to Asia "...in light of CSAT forces stepping up joint military exercises in the Pacific, the US is keen to re-orient its conventional forces, reinforcing battalions in the east" (much like in real-life but to a greater degree) following the drawdown of NATO peacekeeping operations in the Mediterranean.

- Another report that follows mentions the U.S. government reverting cutbacks to its Navy, along with the ticker newsbar at the bottom mentioning bases in Cyprus in the process of being shut down by 2036, and 12 seconds later mentioning China gaining full blue-water navy capability (which isn't too surprising considering CSAT's reach in the Armaverse).

- Followed by polls of public opinion shifting away from providing defense to Europe and a statement from a U.S. senator that can be interpreted as a middle finger directed towards NATO and the rest of Western Europe.

Intro map (Larger version here):

CSAT2.png

DRAWDOWN 2035 Ambient Chatter

Summary

- LZ Connor

1: I thought we were supposed to be broke, though? 
2: I don't follow, man.
1: I mean... the military - we're staring down the barrel of a conflict in the Pacific - and we're junking our vehicles?
2: True.
1: How's that meant to make any sense?
2: Well, it's not that simple. It probably costs more to ship this shit anywhere. Plus - you gotta admit - it's kinda dated, too. At this point, it's worth more as scrap. And we're sure as hell not about to hand it over to the Greenbacks.

- Camp Rogain

1: If it's their goddamn problem, where the hell are they?
2: The Brits are broke, man. Everyone knows it. They can't even afford to defend their pointless little islands any more.
1: So why do we get stuck with them?
2: Why d'you think we're shipping out? We did our time. We kept our peace. Now we get to go play with the big boys in the Pacific.

STATUS QUO BRIEFING

Summary

- Situation report

However, NATO's invasion - albeit swift and, ultimately, successful - has stirred a new round of debates over the funding of military forces in this region. The conclusion was clear: there is no way NATO can maintain their position here while tensions in the pacific region rise. The decommissioning will continue and NATO will abandon this region.

With all that in mind, I've composed a rough layout of what SEA might look like in A3 (Not to scale and is an approximate based on the official in-game map):

SEAsia_2035.png

So basically, which countries are affiliated which factions:

CSAT

- China obviously.

- Taiwan

- North Korea

- All of the south-eastern peninsula and islands (i.e. Vietnam, Malaysia, Indonesia, etc).

U.S.

- 'Murica

- Australia

- New Zealand

- Japan

- South Korea

- Philippines?

Independents

- Russia

Why is # country in # faction?

Where'd Taiwan run off to?

Most likely assimilated into China prior to 2035, or has become an SAR. The flag is placed just to the right of it, so it's safe to assume that Taiwan is no longer an independent nation.

The Dear Leader still lives!

BOW DOWN YOU WESTERN IMPERIALIST PIGS!

The most likely scenario is that North Korea no longer exists as they too were probably absorbed by China (which wouldn't be too surprising if BI makes it so).

What about the Philippines?

I'm a little iffy about this one since the intro map itself doesn't clarify exactly whether it's apart of CSAT or is still an American ally due to the flag placement. It is JUST in between it and the rest of the southern islands. But I guess you could say that they were pressured or otherwise abandoned by the U.S. into joining CSAT perhaps?

Why's Russia independent?

It isn't stated specifically that they are apart of CSAT (contrary to what most people might think) considering their main focus in the Armaverse (and in real life too) is on Eastern Europe, not Asia. They are just probably involved in a partnership with CSAT, and do not have actual membership. Any involvement in the expansion would probably be very limited and in the form of the Raven PMC, not their actual armed forces.

THE SETTING

With the geopolitical situation mapped out, where exactly is the next flashpoint going to be set? There are obviously many locations in the region that could be the setting, but here's my two guesses (obviously renamed or independent):

Philippines_Flashpoint.png

Philippines

Pros

- Disputed region in real life

- Terrain ranging from villages, urban areas, marshes and steep mountains

- Lots of water both inland and with ocean access.

- Perfectly matches the news reports as it's in the South China Sea.

- Spratly and Paracel islands are fairly close by and are just the right size for a Utes-style island (12 sqmi combined).

- Could be the setting for a Sahrani-style conflict, with the northern part of the Philippines under CSAT influence and the south still American.

- Main combatants would be AFP/USMC vs. CSAT/PLA forces with independents being ION PMCs and Russians. Civilians and local rebels (if any) are fictional Filipinos.

Cons

- Alliance ambiguity; not known if it's a CSAT nation or still U.S. allied. Would be even more unlikely as a setting if it's the former case as previous games have always been set in disputed regions.

- Even for a fictional island it still needs a basis to be built on, so where would this island be based on? Implementing an entire island that has the appearance and size of the Philippines would be a daunting task, even if downscaled.

Okinawa_Flashpoint.png

Okinawa, Japan

Pros

- Clocking in at nearly 463 sqmi, this would just be slightly smaller than Altis and Chernarus combined (although scaled down like Limnos was).

- Has diverse terrain ranging from sandy and sunny beaches to dense subtropical forests to cities (no skyscrapers, just plenty of apartments and offices taller than the rest). Plenty of ancient ruins and bodies of water around the island perfect for naval combat.

- It has a few civilian airfields and 32 military bases (would be less in-game obviously).

- Main combatants would be defending SDF/USMC vs. invading CSAT/PLAN forces with independents being ION PMCs and Russians. Civilians and local rebels (if any) are of course fictional Okinawans.

Cons

- Might not be technically feasible to make something of this scale within the RV4 engine.

- All that foliage would burn people's rigs to a cinder (Chernarus says hi).

- Large forested areas are always bad news for AI and could also become problematic for players as well. Don't even get started on what those cramped blocks in cities would do to the performance.

- Lack of a smaller Utes-style island close by (although the Senkakus could probably fill this role).

- The news reports specifically mention the South China Sea and Okinawa sure as hell is no where near it.

These are just two of the locations that it could be set in. There are probably more interesting locations to set a flashpoint in that I haven't thought of, so discuss away. :)

Also, do note once again that this is all just speculation at the end of the day. BI might not even set the expansion in the Pacific, or do a 180 like they did with Altis and change the story so take this with a grain of salt while you're at it.

Edited by drebin052

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I think they somehow have to conclude the story around Kerry and Miller first

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Very nicely done and ye i was thinking about Pacific too

as for the island - the Philippines would be great choice

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Yeah, but let's hope 2 things this time:

-a proper longer and more interesting campaign with not only infantry doing guerilla stuff but more being part of actual military operations (and not always in command).

-that BI devs won't get caught and put in jail while doing research in order to model the island - greek prisons are like holidays compared to vietnam or china.

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I think they somehow have to conclude the story around Kerry and Miller first

Yeah, and although I agree that some little pacific archipelago ( probably in the Sea of China ) is gonna be introduced in A3, I'm afraid is gonna be in a possible expansion. The story of Kerry and Miller I guess is gonna end somewhere in the Mediterranean or north of Europe.

An interesting observation about the thread is that you have kill NATO as an A3 side and changed by US...

Edited by MistyRonin

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Vietnam war era would (should?) be a good time period to explore.

Not many games on it.

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Vietnam war era would (should?) be a good time period to explore.

Not many games on it.

Maybe that would go for another game, but I would like to have it as a A3 expansion.

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I would suggest a place like Japan for the already-stated reason of a much lower risk of imprisonment/internment by overzealous governments/guerrillas and insurgents. The tropics haven't been particularly covered by official Arma islands and the foliage sounds ever so slightly more feasible than a snow map. The prospect of more content excites me greatly.

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Well, the NATO forces in vanilla A3 were essentially just U.S. Army with the exception of a few token British units, so no doubt the expansion would have USMC in the limelight (just like how OA consisted primarily of Army units until BAF/ACR came along). Also, don't forget that I'm using the U.S. as BLUFOR's faction "name" only a placeholder example; BI might make ANZUS or some other equivalent faction on BLUFOR when they do release info.

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http://www.arma3.com/news/scanning-the-horizon-arma3-in-2014#.Uz_V9vl_uM8

...Longer term, for example, we'll build a new terrain. Our objective is to produce something truly distinctive: an entirely different feeling to that of Altis, Takistan or Chernarus.

I guess it will be jungle or snow map. Considering the story, a jungle island in Pacific seems quite probable. However, I would prefer snowy terrain with some new weather effects (snowstorms). Nothing against jungle, but I just don't want to see my computer burn :D

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http://www.arma3.com/news/scanning-the-horizon-arma3-in-2014#.Uz_V9vl_uM8

I guess it will be jungle or snow map. Considering the story, a jungle island in Pacific seems quite probable. However, I would prefer snowy terrain with some new weather effects (snowstorms). Nothing against jungle, but I just don't want to see my computer burn :D

Warfare in winter in the nordic countries, for instance in Lapland ( the problem would be how to represent the effects of frostbite and if people would like that ). As vehicles hovercrafts to carry stuff above the snow, tanks that are lost after trying to cross a frozen... it would be an experience for sure, but maybe not for everyone.

If they did Pacific islands, they could add a archipelago with relatively little islands, to focus more on sea, amphibious air capabilities ( specially now that we can even dive and use submarines ).

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Warfare in winter in the nordic countries, for instance in Lapland ( the problem would be how to represent the effects of frostbite and if people would like that ). As vehicles hovercrafts to carry stuff above the snow, tanks that are lost after trying to cross a frozen... it would be an experience for sure, but maybe not for everyone.

If they did Pacific islands, they could add a archipelago with relatively little islands, to focus more on sea, amphibious air capabilities ( specially now that we can even dive and use submarines ).

Stockholm archipelago!

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A Korean map could cover both jungle and snow. Very mountainous terrain with plenty of tree cover in the summer, and pretty cold and snowy in the winter.

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I'm definitely feeling the south east Asia/pacific islands theme. I think it would be awesome, maybe a WW2 styled island hopping campaign of sorts? Or a CSAT pre-emptive strike on Oki, that would be pretty awesome! Just hope they put a little extra emphasis on naval warfare and add several more boats, ships and subs.

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I'm definitely feeling the south east Asia/pacific islands theme. I think it would be awesome, maybe a WW2 styled island hopping campaign of sorts? Or a CSAT pre-emptive strike on Oki, that would be pretty awesome! Just hope they put a little extra emphasis on naval warfare and add several more boats, ships and subs.

^this would do me nicely. It'll be a good reason to get us the ability to walk and drive (properly) on moving decks (and inside aircraft too)

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Dan;2660752']^this would do me nicely. It'll be a good reason to get us the ability to walk and drive (properly) on moving decks (and inside aircraft too)

And make us of the SEA! That was supposed to be the huge improvement in A3. Submarines, divers, little ship that can throw mines, other ships to be used as support artillery, etc. Maybe even hovercrafts to deploy vehicles fast.

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Vietnam war era would (should?) be a good time period to explore.

Not many games on it.

Even less games set in Korea, though!

Speaking of which, Jeju, an island off the coast of South Korea, looks similarly sized to Altis and would make an interesting flashpoint, yes? In the map OP created, South Korea is even still aligned with NATO. Also, maybe Busuanga island amongst the Phillipines would be an island CSAT would use as an entry-point to the rest of the Phillipines, but it's clustered with a bunch of other smaller islands. Then again, it would be nice to have an island off the coast to launch invasions from. Looking back at the map again, on the Eastern side of Korea, there's still the island of Ulleung-eup which might be a better match size-wise.

I still feel it's too hopeful to ask for large ships that aren't statics though. Especially for a functioning submarine, because if you pay careful attention, trying to dive down and stay down in an SDV without a rebreather has fatal results, regardless of whether or not hatch is closed.

Edited by Kilroy the Nerd

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I still feel it's too hopeful to ask for large ships that aren't statics though.
Unfortunately, thanks to Eliteness I took a glimpse at what BI did with the Astute-class submarine (aka "Submarine_01_F")... its model is essentially a giant tube with one 'skin' texture, three materials (only one of which is calling the submarine-specific maps), and one named selection besides the Geo LOD components (and of all LODs to find it in, it was a ShadowVolume!), with a mostly blank model config... and config-wise it inherits from "FloatingStructure_F", the Astute-class has destrType = "DestructNo"; and it even lacks its own icon (using "iconObject_1x5" and scaled up to mapSize = 98.82).

Oddly enough, the Trawler (aka "Boat_Civil_04_F") also inherits from "FloatingStructure_F" but is closer to a normal vehicle -- far more config lines (including, interestingly enough, capacity for seven passengers and holding eight FAKs) including some movement definitions, its own armor / damageResistance entries, exhausts, position lights (and AnimationSources for them), engine effects, and even sound entries (albeit all using 'dummy sound'), but no damage materials in the config. On its model, it has two 'skin' textures, several materials (including a basic metal penetration material used by the View Geometry LOD), the resource LODs have five named selections (the position lights, traw1, traw2, and glass), its memory LOD has both driver and passenger getIn/getOut positions and memory points for engine/water effects, and of all things it even has a Roadway LOD... but no Fire Geometry LOD. It also has a 'fuller' model config, but the only animations are for hiding/showing of the position lights.

The SDV situation is because the hatch isn't actually watertight.

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So basically the Astute is just a prop and can´t be used or moded for anything else.

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I would point out that right from the first screenshot (back in 2011?) speculation was that the Astute-class would be just a prop... so it's not like it turned out worse than even that.

As far as modding, I'm sure that a sufficiently detailed config mod could get it into the Editor and drivable on its own (as opposed to Feint's workaround)... the real limitation though is the model, which seems to be just a hollow exterior without even a Memory LOD -- which means no skeletonBones and no Animations in the model config -- much less other View - Pilot or View - Cargo LODs (although this makes sense if it was only intended as a background scenery prop) and no proxies.

EDIT: I just did a quick-glimpse comparison with the Arma 2 Destroyer and Fregata according to the released sources -- both have no model configs (and therefore no animations) or View - Pilot/View - Cargo LODs, but the Destroyer model is... basic (not as barebones than the Astute-class, but not much better), i.e. a memory LOD with only two Points, mostly-identical geometry and fire geometry LODs, and damn near all of the visuals are in the first LOD; the Fregata on the other hand is MUCH more realized a vessel with plenty of selections, a geometry LOD with almost 200 Component selections, a lot of memory points including axes, and proxies for two Harpoon quad-tube launchers, a crane, two radar heads, a static RHIB, and a pair of torpedo triple-tube launchers. Their configs both inherit from StaticShip and are even shorter than the Astute-class submarine's though, with only a model path, a displayName, a vehicleClass and scope = 2 (public), although there's a commented-out entry for a white markerlight calling for a memory point which neither model has.

Edited by Chortles

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I really hope they will make a pacific expansion with content like OA (the factions, island and so on).

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I'm sorry, but the Philippines would be FAR too big, not a choice. Altis, in comparison, is miniscule, and did you see how long that took to make? Something like Okinawa is a much better choice.

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I'm sorry, but the Philippines would be FAR too big, not a choice. Altis, in comparison, is miniscule, and did you see how long that took to make? Something like Okinawa is a much better choice.

That's not necessarily an issue. In Arma 2 Chernarus was much larger than the South Zagoria map that was actually modeled and the Takistan map released for OA only represented a portion of the intended scale of that country. A map representing the Philippines need only model a portion of it, perhaps where a key flashpoint or stalemate occurs in whatever campaign might be written.

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I think they somehow have to conclude the story around Kerry and Miller first

depends... because arrowhead was nothing to do with the first one ;)

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