I'm looking for Proponents and Opponents of the DAYZ mod.

[maionaze]

I don't play Dayz and don't necessarily like zombie games but overall I think it is very good for arma. More players, more money, more support. The only thing I don't like is how it somewhat misrepresents arma, at least to the uninformed player, and how it seems to overshadow the base game. I just hate when the top comments for an arma 3 vid, on youtube or what not, are "DayZ is going to be awesome on arma 3!" - Sometimes it feels like people miss out on the awesomeness of the base game due to Dayz... but I know these people wouldn't be playing arma in the first place without Dayz so really there is still net gain.

Not to turn this into a discussion, but I see the people who say "DayZ is gonna be awesome on ArmA 3" or "I only bought ArmA for DayZ" as a mild version of the ones who say "ArmA is crap" or something along the same lines. The major difference between them is that the DayZ guys might influence their friends towards a buy, while the other group will do the opposite. So in the end, even if it might hurt that deep rooted ArmA fanboy spirit inside some of us, we have to be mature enough to look at the bigger picture, for the sake of the series and it's creators.

[Iroquois Pliskin]

CON: One particular group of (newly aquired) BIS customers gets a polished out-the-box, patch-up gamemode, while there are no official PVP milsim gamemodes included in ArmA II. You can mention Warfare all you like, but it is Benny who had saved it from becoming another generic Death Match, when BIS released it back in Armed Assault 1.

Now, they need to cater to their main playerbase, as well as the MMO crowds.

You can advise people to head to armaholic.com and download the myriad of missions there, but problem is - if you want your REAL game to thrive just as DayZ currently does, then support your own official missions on a regular basis: resolve balance issues, fix bugs - again, Benny, not BIS is doing that in this particular instance. The general public has trouble... even installing a simple mission, let alone a mod.

http://arma2.swec.se/server/list

I rest my case.

[Flash Thunder]

Its just good.

+ More money for BI to expand operations, fixes bugs and increase performance in RV platform, give their developers more beer.
+ More recognition of Bohemia Interactive, more press coverage of Arma franchise
+ Possibility of new Arma modders and mission designers


Actually the only con is that DayZ is overwhelming Arma 2 servers, so once it goes standalone this issue will be gone.

[jerryhopper]

Not to turn this into a discussion,

That is not a problem, when this thread has served its purpose, i'll have it closed.
for now... discuss away!

Actually the only con is that DayZ is overwhelming Arma 2 servers, so once it goes standalone this issue will be gone.

Good point.
but marketing wise, you loose the potential playerbase that 'could' buy another ArmA DLC.

CON The general public has trouble... even installing a simple mission, let alone a mod.

Are you saying it's too hard/user-unfriendly/unclear for the generic public to install a mod?
So, should the 'client' be more friendly? so this mod wont flood the server-browser?

But then, WHY is DayZ so different?
the only thing that comes up is : Dayz is using one central database, the gameserver actually interact with external datasources - this is (aside from other creativity) the essential part of Dayz that makes this mod different. There are 'mods' that allow interaction with ingame-variables for a while, but Dayz seems to hit the right spot with their concept. And that brings me to the following simplification : STATS. DayZ is using statistics on a creative manner. Using databases to store enviromental information, creates this immense network of servers/players as the swec.se link proves.

Stats...
i learned years ago that, 'stats' was a 'not done' as subject to discuss about on these forums. i wonder, is that opinion still standing these days?

Other factor's

Steam:
Another thing that catched my attention was the steam-sales. The choice of bringing ArmA to steam seemed to be the right one. In my opinion : Without the accessebility of downloading and buying the game, combined with a 'steam client' and its huge playerbase, DayZ couldnt be as big as it is now.

Social media:
Have you been monitoring/searching twitter on the term 'DayZ' lately? its exploding! Try a DayZ search on youtube - massive results. i have no doubt about the effect of social media, and the success and widspread knowledge of dayZ.


Call me crazy, but i think this mod could be quite a change in the 'direction' where the RV engine was originally going..... or is this all part of the 'world domination' plan's of the Spanel bro's?!

[Iroquois Pliskin]

But then, WHY is DayZ so different?
the only thing that comes up is : Dayz is using one central database, the gameserver actually interact with external datasources

Precisely. The people who have bought ArmA 2 + OA regard DayZ as a free MMORPG, they couldn't give a shit about ArmA II and regard this mod as a separate entity from military simulation.

Look at dayzforum suggestion sub-section, they have absolutely no idea what this sandbox is all about, they request features of Rocket that are not in his power to implement, i.e. engine limitations.

http://dayzmod.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=2

Thread "Pending Update 1.7.1 Details" which had been posted just a day ago has 117,038 views, and here's some of the fixes in the DayZ 1.7.1 update,

Infected Behavior

- Infected can no longer see/attack through walls.
- Entirely new mocap'd attack and running animations

Get my drift? If MMO crowd can have quality content, then I expect BIS to recruit Benny at least for ArmA III's Warfare gamemode/mission for us PVP/milsim folks.

[nuttex]

Pro:
it brings a lot of dosh to BI (A2: CO has been in Top 5 (mostly #1) Sellers on Steam)
It brings media attention to BI/ArmA
It brings new people

Contra:
Aforementioned media attention doesn't seem to be well informed about what they're talking about (for example: RoosterTeeth and their overview of DayZ, where they were like "what is Operation Flashpoint?! There was such a thing as ArmA 1?!") - though I wouldn't count this as an important aspect. What bothers me is how a lot of these sites and YT channels seem to build an image for ArmA where it's all about one zombie mod.
New people are mostly only interested in DayZ. In fact, Steam subforums of ArmA 2 and Operation Arrowhead are infested with DayZ threads (and many of them are "I only bought ArmA for DayZ" ones).

I think that what BI gains from DayZ's popularity is worth it all. There is a slight chance that DayZ may have a more quality support that the rest of community because of its fame and the kind of attention it brings.

[Phantom Six]

Pros:
1) BIS deserved more money for this excellent game they have made. Sales skyrocketed by 500% so more money for Bohemia Interactive to do good for ARMA 3
2) It got some of my real life friends actually interested in ARMA for the first time
3) Increases the life of ARMA 2 some more (lots and lots of server, I see plenty on vanilla as well as DayZ <checked with Six Launcher>)
4) Public coverage on youtube from some of the big guys and more media attention on ARMA 2 (I really believed ARMA should of won most user content on that last award over Starcraft 2 on the last E3 award thing but I guess this proves it though theres many other mods out there people had overlook)
5) More attentions and potential consumers for ARMA 3
6) It taught some big companies a lesson that modding can help them make some extra cash and is good for the community

Cons:
1) Most of those guys are some bad apples. Sometimes it'll be COD kids with ADHD just shooting everyone for fun or because they're bored and bad mouthing people (One of my friend already got spoken badly to by some of them).
2) Griefers joining the regular ARMA session to TK people (I usually play on private sessions so I don't have to worry about them)
3) Whiners. I looked through the steam forums and I don't get why people wouldn't buy ARMA 2 CO for $30 and kept begging for a sale when they're so hyped about DayZ, yet they wouldn't hesitate to dish out $60 for the latest COD, Ghost Recon, Halo, Battlefield, etc.

Overview: I find more good than bad in the introduction of DayZ. Of course some of the new guys may be annoying or bad, but like many other aspect of popularity, once something becomes popular, it'll attract many kinds of people. ARMA always have been a mil-sim but it has a very great sandbox aspect and modding potential. Basically, ARMA can be played in any way a person ever felt like. If someone wanted to do some zombie survival open world they could (DayZ), or individual missions with zombies (Celery's Zombies), or play it tactically (all your other coop missions), have some PvP (Warfare, CTI, etc), have revive missions, etc. I'll see whiners from DayZ on the forums sometimes about ARMA but I find it all very laughable and the more revenue for BIS the better, they deserve the money for supporting their community and caring about their games until the end. Plus, more sales for ARMA 3 is always good since now that ARMA 2 CO got public attention from DayZ, more buyers, more money, but at the same time BIS aren't going to just leave the milsim aspect of ARMA for the DayZ mainstream. From what we saw so far with ARMA 3 and E3, its all innovation and DayZ can either be ported over or be worked on as a standalone project. It's a win/win situation for BIS and its community hoping for ARMA 3.

[160thSOAR]

DayZ has increased the sales of ArmA2 by a huge amount, giving BIS much-needed revenue, publicity, and reward for their great work. It has also reinforced BI's views about the excellence of user modification, a view which I hope never changes. Finally, it has opened up ArmA2 to the larger world, getting more prospective sales for ArmA3.

On the other hand, it has brought in a lot of new players who behave very poorly and flooded multiplayer with DayZ servers, but that is a small price to pay for the good things it has brought about.

[gammadust]

I'll not getting too deep in my opinion, and while deviating a bit out of pros and cons theme, i have to say the following:

DayZ feels and plays so fresh, surprisingly, for what imo constitutes an actual novel gameplay genre, it already raises passions typical of matured blends of wine and good music.

The potential is almost literaly to wipe a slate clean in the gaming scene. It makes you think back what exacly is a "game" all over, what exacly means for one to "play" and entertain himself.
The concept is genuinely captivating opposite sides of the pond in the casual/cerebral way of play. These types of opposites are extremely energetic and hold both creative and destructive power. They hint at a change of paradigm. I am not joking, really!

I am watching very closely what will turn out of this. But i am look at very good prospects here, for many reasons. So many opportunities already accomplished that i am for now mostly flabbergasted.

I am a proponent in the sense that Arma will benefit greatly from this mod, weather DayZ is turned into a standalone, be ported to Arma 3, or else... the risks that do exist seem to be properly accounted for by BIS. Great task, great risk, but great results in managing it so far.

While not skeptic at all i would reserve more concrete judgement further down the line.

[Tonci87]

Well I don´t play DayZ because IMHO it turned into a Deathmatch with Zombies as special guests. Most players don´t even try to form teams and cooperate, they shoot each other on sight, or even play the game with the goal to kill as many players as possible. But he whole Mod is still Alpha and maybe Rocket will find ways to make them stick together. I dislike that many of those new players don´t have ambitions to play Arma and that every new report on Arma 3 is has comments like this one: "DayZ will be so awesome with this" all over it. IMHO this shows that many of those players really don´t care about what Arma is supposed to be.


But I still think that DayZ is good for Arma. Here is why:
It has helped to boost sales. More money for BIS=More ressources to develop Arma 3 and improve Arma 2 CO
Sudden flood of Beta Patches
New motivation for the Devs
Public awareness
New players. Although they need to be encouraged to try the original game, only that way some of them will become true fans of Arma.
It shows how mod friendly the engine is
The industry will have to notice that modding is not dead (people who say this are the people who want it to be true so that they can sell more DLCs) and that it can boost sales. This might have an impact on other games we like.