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Thread: Syria - What should we do if anything?

  1. #801
    Quote Originally Posted by Brain View Post
    Never seen so many Bits and Bytes wasted that hard. You could've saved a tree with sparing this.
    If you promise not to kick someone while fighting him, and you still kick him, the referee will jump in because it's illegal.
    Replace kick with use gas and referee with NATO.

    However, I still see no reason why Assad should use nerve gas and provoke a NATO Attack when he's clearly on the winning side right now. Especially with Irans and Hezbollahs support.
    Thanks. It is not to hard to see if you open your eyes.
    Forgot to mention that these war games the elite´s play is from our taxpayers money and it us the people that have to fight and die for them, not the elite´s.

    Of course the war in Syria should have been inter-vented long time ago, from the beginning. That in anno 2013 it is still possible that a regime/power can start wars, manipulate and control the people of their country is not acceptable anymore. Unfortunately our world is still more medieval then we like to think and still it is the elite keeps the world and our civilization in a modern version of a medieval age, but I digress now.

    ---------- Post added at 05:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:45 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwarden View Post

    Syrian gov was what one would consider 'soft dictatorship' , citizen rights were granted as long as you not went against state
    (hell not that much different from west state system)
    Thats so true. Basically every Western ´democratic´ country is like that.

  2. #802
    nvm, delete me.
    Last edited by ProfTournesol; Aug 27 2013 at 18:01.

  3. #803
    Quote Originally Posted by Dwarden View Post
    if You followed news, several chemical storages got overran by rebels in past two years of the conflict
    i'm not saying military storages but chemical, military probably too but i don't remember it's been quite some time

    ask self why would Israel bomb something all of sudden in Syria w/o refusing to confirm it was just because of usual convetional weapons like missiles

    various chemicals are http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f27_1377525772 available in rebel hands for quite some times ...
    Astounding....I thought you were better than that???

    The rebels overan a few chemical factories containing nothing more sinister than large stocks of bleach. The Russians verified that all Chemical weapons were moved to sites near Tartus at the coast. The problem with you IT specialists is you don't know your science - you can overun my kitchen cupboard if you like? I have stockpiled acetic acid, sodium chloride, sodium hypochlorite mixed with sodium hydroxide and hydrogen dioxide. Perhaps later I will realise my plot to create a tasty coating for fish and chips followed by a concentrated attack on the toilet. Lets hope I don't get them mixed up.

    Underground store room:
    Black cylinders are oxygen (white top on the nearest indicates medical grade)
    ampules of atropine and adrenaline
    gas masks provided by the USA and EU for protection from gas attacks
    I don't know what is in the plastic containers but the oily stains indicate diesel to me. If it were chemical weapons the guy with the flimsy surgical mask would be dead.
    Other medical supplies and conventional weapons, LPG gas canisters made into IEDs.

    Looks like the rebels have stockpiled equipment to protect themselves from CW attacks from the government to me - no doubt you would interpret that differently?

    The Israelis have bombed all sorts of things in Syria, at the time it was stated that the target was long range missiles capable of accurately targetting Tel Aviv from Lebanon. The Israelis said that they were being passed to Hezbollah by Assad as an attempt to widen the conflict. You will of course know that Hezbollah launched rockets into Israel the day after the Chemical attack in an attempt to divert press attention. Israel bombed targets in southern Lebanon in response. Can I ask what news you watch? I could do with a giggle?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwarden View Post
    also you need to change your rhetoric cause confirmed chemical attacks are 2 neighborhoods (each next to other) of Syria's capital ...
    next 2 are also bordering them but unconfirmed and the 5th one on opposing side of city is also unconfirmed ...

    also chemical attack in own Capital city would be crazyness especially when you use something as unpredictable as chemical weapons
    next to that all indications shows the Syrian gov is actually winning since early of this year
    (adopting new strategies like pinpoint attacks, combined arms and well though out planning on counter-insurgency)
    That part of the capital was in Rebel control and still is, it was under siege in a combined attack by the Army and Hezbollah - it was the Rebels that escorted the UN around the area and the hospitals. How did you miss that, the videos were all over the news this morning?
    2 neighbourhoods, really?
    Médecins Sans Frontières says hospitals it supports in Syria have reported treating 3,600 people suffering from “neurotoxic symptoms”.
    http://www.euronews.com/2013/08/24/m...oxic-symptoms/
    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ck_map.svg.png
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Ghouta_attacks

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwarden View Post
    Syrian gov was what one would consider 'soft dictatorship' , citizen rights were granted as long as you not went against state
    (hell not that much different from west state system)

    does anyone read history ?
    Why don't you start?
    In 1982 Hafez al-Assad responded to an insurrection in the city of Hama by sending a paramilitary force to indiscriminately kill between 10,000 and 55,000 civilians including children, women, and the elderly during the Hama massacre.
    According to Human Rights Watch, as of 2009 Syria’s poor human rights situation had "deteriorated further". Authorities arrested political and human rights activists, censored websites, detained bloggers, and imposed travel bans. Syria’s multiple security agencies continue to detain people without arrest warrants. No political parties were licensed and emergency rule, imposed in 1963, remained in effect.
    The secret police prevents people from even approaching embassies of foreign countries, making it difficult to get a visa to travel abroad. Furthermore, Syrians can not leave the country without an "exit visa" granted by the authorities
    According to the Syrian Human Rights Committee that there were 4,000 political prisoners held in Syrian jails in 2006.
    German journalist Billy Six spent 12 weeks being held by the Syrian authorities before finally being released on 5 March. German freelance journalist Armin Wertz’s detained by the Syrian authorities since 5 May.
    Syria bans websites for political reasons and arrests people accessing them. Internet cafes are required to record all the comments users post on chat forums.[32] Websites such as Wikipedia Arabic, Youtube and Facebook were blocked from 2008 to 2011.
    Article 520 of the penal code of 1949, prohibits having homosexual relations, i.e. "carnal relations against the order of nature", and provides for at least three-years imprisonment
    While there is no official state religion, the Constitution requires that the president be Muslim and stipulates that Islamic jurisprudence, an expansion of Sharia Islamic law,[23] is a principal source of legislation.
    The United Nations, meanwhile, has documented that Syrian security services officers had gang raped boys as young as 11 years old during the uprising against President Bashar al-Assad.
    Last edited by Mattar_Tharkari; Aug 27 2013 at 20:54.
    "I believe everything. And l believe nothing. I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one. I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before you know it, the case is sol-ved!"
    Arma III http://www.arma3.com/

  4. #804
    I doubt the Islamist filled Syrian Rebels will be any better than the Assad regime, Mattar. It's only a matter of picking the lesser of 2 evils.

  5. #805
    We all know that the Islamists (read al Qaeda) have a history of trying to use gas. Assad might be a ruthless dictator, but neither he nor his father has a history of doing that extreme things. And so far, no one has come up with an explanation for exactly why he would do something as simply stupid as employ it on a single occasion on a small scale, when he's actually been gaining the upper hand for several months now. Not big enough to help, but only big enough to potentially cause a foreign intervention. Seriously, unless Obama can show some more solid evidence than "our intelligence says he did it", he'll be nothing short of a criminal if he decides to launch a military intervention.
    And that's a lot coming from me, who is quite conservative and generally in favour of things like the Afghanistan and Iraq wars, as well as the bombings in Libya.

  6. #806
    Quote Originally Posted by scrim View Post
    We all know that the Islamists (read al Qaeda) have a history of trying to use gas. Assad might be a ruthless dictator, but neither he nor his father has a history of doing that extreme things. And so far, no one has come up with an explanation for exactly why he would do something as simply stupid as employ it on a single occasion on a small scale, when he's actually been gaining the upper hand for several months now. Not big enough to help, but only big enough to potentially cause a foreign intervention. Seriously, unless Obama can show some more solid evidence than "our intelligence says he did it", he'll be nothing short of a criminal if he decides to launch a military intervention.
    And that's a lot coming from me, who is quite conservative and generally in favour of things like the Afghanistan and Iraq wars, as well as the bombings in Libya.
    No history - apart from the small scale CW attack earlier this year, witnessed in Damascus by Le Monde journalists and that secret nuclear reactor which they tried to cover up? The flimsy denials and non-cooperation are habitual:
    http://www.lemonde.fr/proche-orient/...7708_3218.html

    IAEA non-compliance finding
    For nearly three years, Syria refused the IAEA requests for further information on or access to the Dair Alzour site. On May 24, 2011, IAEA Director General Amano released a report concluding that the destroyed building was "very likely" a nuclear reactor, which Syria was required to declare under its NPT safeguards agreement.[93] On June 9, 2011, the IAEA Board of Governors found that this constituted non-compliance, and reported that non-compliance to the UN Security Council.
    Last edited by Mattar_Tharkari; Aug 27 2013 at 21:45.

  7. #807
    And a nuclear reactor equals using WMDs on civ-pop as retribution for a civil war, or any other reason because?

  8. #808
    War is becoming big business. It is more about money now a days more than about what is "right". At the end of the day should the West get involved with Syria's problems.. no.. will we, probably.

  9. #809
    Quote Originally Posted by scrim View Post
    And a nuclear reactor equals using WMDs on civ-pop as retribution for a civil war, or any other reason because?
    It shows similar patterns of behaviour, non compliance with international treaties and similar denials and cover ups. The demolition of the nuclear reactor was one of the quickest in history and the last 5 days of intensive shelling of the areas subjected to gas attack were a similar attempt to cover up evidence.

  10.   Click here to go to the next Developer post in this thread.   #810
    honestly if i was leading rich, sovereign state ....
    i would get nuclear program going , both for energy production and peaceful research and military
    because , in this world ... some states fear only nukes ...

    Israel did what they keep doing for last decades, bombed the reactor just for sure to avoid future problems ...
    i'm pretty sure if Asad told them about it and asked nicely to not destroy it the Israel would consider it

    anyway MT i'm not going to react on your posting reaction on my post ...
    just note that i wasn't defending the regime as being nice, just as being the better outcome than anything produced in past decades in 'peaceful' bombing
    it's waste of typing , You may believe what you want ...

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