How the hell can you place a satchel and touch it off in one move? I would be thinking about kicking the player for grieving if that was happening, it requires two actions to do.Originally Posted by [FHA]Dynamo
It is a pain in the arse having to pick the misplaced satchel back up again and then get in the intact heli with a red face however, if you haven't already been auto-kicked for placing a satchel at base. Which is a problem.
Having a separate explosives hotkey would be welcome.
It has happened to me sometimes while planting a satchel, probably double pressed the use key. Doesn't help that it is the top action on the menu.
What's a real bitch was with one for old addons where you could attach satchels to vehicles, there'd be cases where I'm just wizzing through the scroll menu and plant one while trying to board a vehicle in a hurry. It didn't happen often, but oh god when it did I'd go into a mix of rage and OHSHITOHSHITOHSHITOHSHIT trying to make sure I won't accidentally detonate the damn thing.
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it's a very common issue, when a chopper is bouncing around. once the satchel is on the ground, you have to select to deactivate it.. problem is when the chopper is bouncing around, the menu item starts flickering randomly.. so the selection starts hoping around [Get in] [Deactivate satchel] [Set of satchel]. most of the domination servers have disabled the "kick on planting of satchel at base" feature because of this, and have simply opted to delete the satchel when it's planted. having a dedicated key for explosives would fix that problem. then if someone plants a satchel at base, you know it was on purpose since they have to equip the satchel to place it. could have it set up like "equip explosive, left mouse to plant, right mouse to detonate", and deactivation can be done with a quick action menu. look down at the explosive, deactivate option icon pops up, press your "use/interaction" key.
You can already set satchels by cycling through F and Left-Clicking MB - Set Satchel & Touch Off need to be removed from the Action menu, because this is an accident, which is waiting to happen.
Timer functions could still be retained via Action menu; Touch Off would happen by cycling through F and selecting the placed satchel, then Left-Clicking.
Basically, what I would do: unload the Action menu from similar actions that should not be there and then possibly rework the Action menu system to something like radial selection by one key (middle mouse button, or whatever you bind it to) depress activation -> mouse over -> releasing the depressed key/button will trigger the action.
Last edited by Iroquois Pliskin; Aug 22 2012 at 11:10.
i would rather have the F key solely used as a fire selector for my primary weapon. every time i change the fire mode, i have to go through [grenade][smoke grenade][satchel] then it goes back to [semi].. it sucks, it's slows things down and just gets in the way.You can already set satchels by cycling through F and Left-Clicking MB - Set Satchel & Touch Off need to be removed from the Action menu, because this is an accident, which is waiting to happen.
Timer functions could still be retained via Action menu; Touch Off would happen by cycling through F and selecting the placed satchel, then Left-Clicking.
Basically, what I would do: unload the Action menu from similar actions that should not be there and then possibly rework the Action menu system to something like radial selection by one key (middle mouse button, or whatever you bind it to) depress activation -> mouse over -> releasing the depressed key/button will trigger the action.
thats why grenades should have it's own dedicated key, as well as explosives.
whats more intuitive? scroll down action menu, select M136. use M136, scroll down action menu, select primary weapon.
or - press 4, equip M136, use M136, press 1 equip primary.?
removing the whole command/action menu from the number keys, and using a pop-up rotary screen menu would not only speed up action selection, but also free up the number keys to be used for more useful tasks. the number slots can be inventory slots. that way we would be able to equip any specific inventory item we need at the time, instead of having to go through our gear menu.
i think this is what many people complain about when they say the ArmA series has clunky controls, apart from the animations and the bad collision model when inside buildings.
this is how i currently have my ArmA2 keys set:
WASD - general movement control
E - use/interact
Q - quick swap/last weapon used
R - main weapon sight
T - toggle between main sight and back up battle sight (AGOC and Elcan Specter DR have back up iron sights)
F - fire mode cycle (wish it didn't have grenade-smoke grenade-satchel on this)
G - gear menu
Z - reload
X - prone
C - kneel
V - stand
B - binoculars
N - night vision
Left Shift - lean left
Space bar - lean right (there's a reason why i have used shift and space for lean. i don't like using one of my movement control fingers to lean. it limits my movement options, as i either lean or move. with shift/space as my lean, i use my pinky and thumb to lean and can still move around freely. it makes moving around a CQC environment more dynamic)
i would love to add the scroll wheel as a control for movement speed. scroll up to go into a sprint, and scroll down to dynamically slow down to a slow walk. there are 3 phases in the movement animation, walk, jog and sprint. if you are at slow walk, as you scroll up, the walk animation speeds up. once at a specific pace, the animation changes over to jog. as you scroll up further, the jog animation speeds up until it changes over to the sprint animation. i would still keep key bound to these actions for times where you need to instantly change your movement speed.
in the end it's all about stream lining the players actions. with the current action/command menu system, you cycle through the commands as if they are pages. when something happens that needs your direct attention, you have to spam the backspace key to get out of the menu. a similar thing happens with the scroll menu... you have to press backspace to close the menu, or when you go to fire your weapon, you plant a satchel and get killed instead.
i completely agree on the rotary menu. click & hold middle mouse to open rotary menu, move mouse over the action you want, then release middle mouse to select action. if you want to close the rotary menu just release the middle mouse button in an open space.
I remember the speed-controlled-by-scrollwheel working very well in Hidden & Dangerous 2, it became very intuitive to use. And, IRL you also cannot go from running to snail's pace immediately
In fact - if it were up to me I'd increase on this idea and suggest that the speed controlled by the scroll wheel should go beyond 3 preset speeds, it should be variable beyond that. So that a guy with heavy loadout and a guy with light loadout could match movement speeds instead of constantly stopping/starting etc. I'd have a little onscreen indicator showing roughly my current speed setting (like a small bar or something) and have the scroll wheel smoothly increase/decrease that level. And a scroll-wheel-flick would go to max or min. Something like that, idea needs work obviously but it's just an idea. Not like BIS are going to take it & run with it
Rose GUI FTWBesides mouse wheel is needed for the menu. But why the non-mouse wheel menu won't work is the stuff of the neighboring thread.
Fire And Smoke for ArmA2: JTD_FireAndSmoke v0.2
For better future effects addons, please vote for this ticket.
I'm in total agreement with you there on dedicated keys for unique/often used Actions, such as satchels, grenades. I used F as an example of what is already in-game, but given some thought we could free up a key for this particular Action.
Said radial menu could be positioned in the spot of the current Action menu, bordering the lower-mid right edge of the screen and it shouldn't exceed it in dimensions either - well depending on how big you want the text to be inside each "petal".i completely agree on the rotary menu. click & hold middle mouse to open rotary menu, move mouse over the action you want, then release middle mouse to select action. if you want to close the rotary menu just release the middle mouse button in an open space.
Something like a hexagon-shape with 6 equilateral triangles could be employed, giving you the choice of max 6 Actions to be placed there, but you could then divide the triangles in half, giving you 12 in total, though I'm not sure the text is going to be readable.
An octagon is another option,
North-South parts may present a problem in readability. Another configuration,
Or,
http://archive.ck12.org/ck12/images?id=300645
Last edited by Iroquois Pliskin; Aug 22 2012 at 18:27.
I initally had planned to come again on sunday but I think I did not properly measure up the results of my party on saturday...
But nonetheless there are some really interesting things for us!
You sir have a different definition of "in the evening" than the rest of mortals :P
#3680
This is exactly what I meant (minus the small variability you talk about here). I'm not sure why people consider mousewheel slow and unresponsive. While I'm not advocating 100% Splinter Cell like system, doing the flicks as described above worked really well. Combining a modifier key like Shift, the action menu isn't affected at all, and there's no accidental speed alterations. Technically, Shift becomes your speed modifier key, and mousewheel is the analogue control method for selecting desired movement speeds.I remember the speed-controlled-by-scrollwheel working very well in Hidden & Dangerous 2, it became very intuitive to use. And, IRL you also cannot go from running to snail's pace immediately
In fact - if it were up to me I'd increase on this idea and suggest that the speed controlled by the scroll wheel should go beyond 3 preset speeds, it should be variable beyond that. So that a guy with heavy loadout and a guy with light loadout could match movement speeds instead of constantly stopping/starting etc. I'd have a little onscreen indicator showing roughly my current speed setting (like a small bar or something) and have the scroll wheel smoothly increase/decrease that level.And a scroll-wheel-flick would go to max or min.
I'm not sure why this is considered slow or unresponsive and I'd like to hear some reasoning behind this from anyone that argues that. Idea is that you don't have to stop moving, even for a millisecond, while holding W, and Shift + MW alters your speed without stopping. You're still free to go to any stance from any speed with let's say Y/X/C. In my previous post, Shift + Middle mouse was intended as safe/combat (weapon up/down, currently 2xCTRL on default) mode switch, which might have caused some confusion with stances. Abusing three, possibly more keys for different movement speeds is kinda strange to me.
Also, consider that such system could be used for vehicles to those who do not posses a joystick/gamepad. Let's say initially holding W in a car would eventually accelerate the car to it's top speed if possible, and if you wanted to keep in formation with a slower vehicle or infantry, you'd "dial down" the max speed with Shift + MW, acting as some kind of a limiter (or let's say that A3 cars have gears, and the same would instead control gears). Switching from "Warp 1" mode to "Warp 10" mode would be a flick of the mousewheel.
And to echo what DMarkwick said:
Regardless, from the comments made earlier by devs, it looks like they tried this and abandoned it, reasons unknown. So basically, stay civilized discussing things, all this arguing is probably irrelevant in the big BIS picture.Something like that, idea needs work obviously but it's just an idea. Not like BIS are going to take it & run with it
Ah, imagine if keyboard keys were designed as analogue inputs, we wouldn't even have this discussion.
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