Death of Retail. No future for the High Street and the Mall?

[11aTony]

Although i voted for "I agree the future is digital download!" i still dislike the idea. I even still miss the old game packages (cardboard boxes, anyone remember?).

Recently i had 2 books in my hands which came with a game: DID's F-22 Air Dominance Fighter. One was a manual, explaining all aspects of the game on 180 pages (a real book, the older may remember what a "book" is ). And a additional book, made in conjunction with the World Air Power Journal, presenting all (known at this time) facts about the F-22 including a lot of Photos and schematics and also about other planes and choppers of all sort. This book also has 180+ pages.

What do you get these days? A booklet with maybe a dozen pages and a PDF on the disc (if you're lucky).

At the end, you get ever less while paying more and more.

So as long as ever possible, i will always try to get my hands on a hardcopy. I wasn't pretty happy when i heard the first time about DLC's and although i've bought BAF and PMC through Sprocket, i'm still looking to get my hands on a retail version of RFT.

"cardboard boxes", exacly. And about manuals, I often get just one paper listing default controls one page and install manual on the other. Its pathetic.

[Big Dawg KS]

At the end, you get ever less while paying more and more.

Development costs for games has increased so much since those days, so in a sense perhaps you are getting less, but don't forget it's higher quality (at least technologically).

---------- Post added at 02:40 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:37 PM ----------

Yeah, that's the one thing I dislike about Steam. There is no technical reason why it shouldn't be possible to transfer games between accounts - it would simply be bad business for them, I guess.

Probably because (like anyting good in life) people would exploit it vigorously. There are a select few people in the world who will always ruin things for the rest of us. It's simply what they do.

It's no biggie though since, like I said, Steam has so many deals that most of the time you can get something for dirt cheap when you aren't sure if you'd like it (if you're patient).

[mrcash2009]

BD ... do you work for Steam?

Development costs for games has increased so much since those days, so in a sense perhaps you are getting less, but don't forget it's higher quality (at least technologically)

That being the case then retail should be even more expensive than digital, but they dont raise the price to cover that its relatively the same numbers, so I still dont see why digital should be the "same" price as physical.

To me its just a mind game of convenience. If someone 15 or more years ago said "well, you will be able to get games just through the internet, you wont have anything to hold or look at and it will cut lots of costs than getting it to you through a shop, but it will cost the same as getting it from a shop, plus the cost of being on the internet to get it anyway. Also you will be paying for it to be tied to one account so you cant re sell it or anything" .. I wonder what there face would look like.

I dont think people really think it through of how much a rip things will become based on that.

Steam has so many deals that most of the time you can get something for dirt cheap when you aren't sure if you'd like it (if you're patient).

So does Game.co.uk downloads which I mentioned earlier, and that isn't tied to some bubble you cant escape and additional background tasks and bloat ware.

The pattern is, Steam is the way, which is again what I was wary of about digital only land, when its dominated by a few with lots of hoop jumping and limitations that isn't a time to celebrate in my eyes. As long as there is choices other than the Steam model and its spread nicely with lots of price differences, but .... (for me) not the exact price as physical. I will happily be patient and wait for over a year or more for patches and updates and mods to come and let the price drop to a more realistic level and wont buy bran new digital if it became digital only and at the same as physical price-tag.

The other way to look at it is this, if digital is saying that's the price even though you know costs have been cut than physical way to get it to you just how much is profit? Im happy to support, but im always wary of making rich people richer.

[Wolfrug]

Steam is particularly insidious in that even if you buy games from other online retail outlets, they might still have to be activated on steam- in that sense Steam is less a service for games and more a form of DRM (although Steam's 'DRM' has of course also been broken). I recently bought Fallout: New Vegas from D2D, and only found out as I was installing it that it needed Steam. Same thing for Dawn of War II. It's not terribly annoying as I do use Steam a lot, and you often can't beat their deals (especially around holiday times), but I can imagine it being very very annoying indeed for anyone who prefers NOT to use services like Steam.

OT: Digital distribution is the way of the future. Just don't allow any one store a monopoly, and things should be going ever into a golden and happy tomorrow!

Regards,
Wolfrug

[mrcash2009]

Those things you mention are what I mention a few pages back, nice little deals with publishers sucked into buddying up with a narrow field of an online distribute so they can shove their badge on everything to reel you in pretty much without choice.

Its true though, that Steam are a "perpetual DRM with a shop front".

Thats where the digital only creepy side comes in, I dont like that one bit.

[Big Dawg KS]

That being the case then retail should be even more expensive than digital, but they dont raise the price to cover that its relatively the same numbers, so I still dont see why digital should be the "same" price as physical.

Like I said it's all about demand. Most people (yes, most people are fine with Steam) will pay full price for a downloadable game, and the distributors will charge whatever people will pay. It has nothing to do with the cost, it's just economics.

That said, the amount they can offer for that price is probably not the same as it was years ago, since it costs much more to develop games. And they probably can't raise the prices because of the same reason: demand (not as many would buy).

Its true though, that Steam are a "perpetual DRM with a shop front".

Steamworks is a DRM, Steam is not. Learn the difference. Steamworks as a DRM is IMO a much better approach to DRM than something that limits your installation.

BD ... do you work for Steam?

No, but I'm not a brainless idiot who thinks Steam is the devil because of made up horror stories from Steam bashers. I have facts and more importantly I have my own reasons to like Steam. I know what the difference is between Steam and Steamworks, while it appears 90% of the Steam haters don't. I also understand fully the limitations of Steam games, but it doesn't bother me one bit. It just makes me angry when people hate things because they are uninformed or because they have no desire to attempt to understand them.

[Jeza]

Although i do believe the future is a digital download, due to it being easier to click and play rather than go to the shop, but personaly i like having the dvd in its box. However saw that a big company like EA in the uk are offering exclusive ingame stuff to people which go to the store and buy the dvd disc which kind of tells me there's still life left yet, which is good, as i said i like the box in hand, but dont get me wrong im sure over the past few months iv bought most of my games on steam.

[ChiefRedCloud]

Although i voted for "I agree the future is digital download!" i still dislike the idea. I even still miss the old game packages (cardboard boxes, anyone remember?).

Recently i had 2 books in my hands which came with a game: DID's F-22 Air Dominance Fighter. One was a manual, explaining all aspects of the game on 180 pages (a real book, the older may remember what a "book" is ). And a additional book, made in conjunction with the World Air Power Journal, presenting all (known at this time) facts about the F-22 including a lot of Photos and schematics and also about other planes and choppers of all sort. This book also has 180+ pages.

What do you get these days? A booklet with maybe a dozen pages and a PDF on the disc (if you're lucky).

At the end, you get ever less while paying more and more.

So as long as ever possible, i will always try to get my hands on a hardcopy. I wasn't pretty happy when i heard the first time about DLC's and although i've bought BAF and PMC through Sprocket, i'm still looking to get my hands on a retail version of RFT.

I agree with Myke. And yes, I am older (63 pushing 64). All this digital download stuff is well and good. BUT, as someone mentioned ealier, it's only good if you got the download capacity.

American ranks number nine (9) in the worlds Broadband capabilities. Korea is at the top, I believe. So even though I'm fairly happy with my up/dl speeds. To become completly digital (which I appose) you have to have the infastructure in place to use this.

All the arguments, for the most part, in this thread are good and valid. And most of the pro digital arguments are from the younger members. But I still like the idea that I can install a game and play a game without a broadband connection. Especially when it's a single player game.

Yes we of this thought are a dieing breed. Or rather WE are being transposed by a newer mindset. I will do what is required to enjoy my chosen entertainment, but I will most likely be draggin my feet all the way.

[Big Dawg KS]

like EA in the uk are offering exclusive ingame stuff to people which go to the store and buy the dvd disc.

Sort of makes me think of the "exclusive" GameStop content... man do I hate that shit. But I hate most forms of marketing...

---------- Post added at 10:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:27 AM ----------

it's only good if you got the download capacity.

American ranks number nine (9) in the worlds Broadband capabilities. Korea is at the top, I believe. So even though I'm fairly happy with my up/dl speeds. To become completly digital (which I appose) you have to have the infastructure in place to use this.

No doubt however that this infastructure will only expand in the future. Hell I'm skeptical that anything in the near future will ever really be offline.

[Baff1]

I don't think there is enough competition in the digital download marketplace yet for PC games.
You still have to pay up to double what you pay for buying the disc.

Plus, since they have no advertising power in the same way as a shop shelf does... you might as well publish it digitally yourself as use GamersGate, or Sprocket or something. Using them is just giving away profit to other people pointlessly.


Online retailers however do not have to be digital services. I buy discs online from companies such as Play or Amazon.



The market for consoles I think will remain strong. People want games that are user friendly. There is a big big market for this.
Not just user friendly to play, but also user friendly to buy.
Just walk into the shop and hand over some notes and I have a present for little Billy.

As opposed to learning how to use a PC, registering an account. Validating an account. Entering my credit card details.... downloading and installing a game...

When I give some one a present, I want to place it in their hands. Gift wrapped so that they can open it. Not send them a link by email. That just doesn't cut it.

If I am to go through all the palava of Steam for example.... downloading all that crap and all the rest...having to run a second party software to get the game to run.... I might as well just pirate it from a torrent. Why pay for a service that is worse than what you get for free?