FADE Question

[Jester OC]

I am using my Original version of the Game to start 2 games on two machines to play a LAN game from within my house. After playing a mission a few times, one player's game crashed and when he returned we got saw the message "Original Games Do not FADE." Please let us know if what we are doing is considered wrong.

I read a lot of posts here and no where does a developer mention that this practice (using one CD to start multiple games) is wrong. Please answer me.

Jester_OC

[Jester OC]

*BUMP*
Please this deserves an offical reply.

[unholy chosen one]

sounds like the definition of fade to me. basically the copyright law limits you to one working copy per cd per machine.fade would detect the second copy of the game as an illegal copy.but hopefully one of the guys from bis will confirm or deny that.

[RN Malboeuf]

lol, they just get dumber and dumber

you can use 1 CD for EACH Computer
thats it
you dont need an offical responce

it's illegal how about that?

Now both your machines and have FADE
SUX to be you, your OFP is Toast

if you want an Offical responce READ box on Piracy and it will CLearly show you that 1 CD on a MP LAN is Illegal




(Edited by RN Malboeuf at 8:44 pm on Nov. 24, 2001)

[RN Malboeuf]

<<<<<but hopefully one of the guys from bis will confirm or deny that

this has been confirmed about a thousand TIMES

[unholy chosen one]

well badmeat(closest translation i can come up with) some of us do have lives outside our gaming so trying to read thru 50,000 posts and replies aint gonna happen. at least he had the sense to realize it might be fade related rather than just asking if it was an update problem. i think you need to back off mixing chocolate syrup in your jolt cola bro. you are way to high strung. and i didnt notice anywhere around here
where it says you are the head monkey in charge of hostile replies. lighten up some.
also do me a favor if you are going to qoute me keep it in its original context will ya.

(Edited by unholy chosen one at 2:07 am on Nov. 25, 2001)


(Edited by unholy chosen one at 2:08 am on Nov. 25, 2001)

[Renagade]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from RN Malboeuf on 1:51 am on Nov. 25, 2001
lol, they just get dumber and dumber

you can use 1 CD for EACH Computer
thats it
you dont need an offical reponce

it's illegal how about that?

Now both your machines and have FADE
SUX to be you, your OFP is Toast

if you want an Offical responce READ box on Piracy and it will CLearly show you that 1 CD on a MP LAN is Illegal


[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

yeah lol his OFP is toast haha until he reinstalls it.
It would be nice if they made a workaround for mp lan games like some sort of delayed fade so that u could have a game of ofp with your friends then it would self corrupt a while later.

[RN Malboeuf]

dont actualy Tell him how to fix it http://www.flashpoint1985.com/ikonboard3/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

--------

Calling me Bad meat is MY NAME
it's a Great! name, thats how I became the MAD Cow on other Gaming sites

My Rude nastys posts to idiots and my name!

other wise I AM the Head monkey!

[unholy chosen one]

bad meat is your name? no kiddin really??? i always get a chuckle out of people who think poor behavior is something to be proud of. you shouldnt include yourself with avon ,from what i have seen , her posts are direct , polite , and professional. in other words she actually helps those in need. you seem to pick and choose those whom you deem worthy and then you provide the info she and others have made available. other than that you seem only to contribute to individuals frustrations. how does that help anyone but you?
as for being head monkey i have no doubt that would be true. but i still dont see your name in the credits on the ofp box. enjoy your time in the forums it as close to fame as you will ever achieve. you keep saying you dont flame anyone
but all your posts have a very confrontational theme to them. and thats the same thing. i only hope your as good as you keep telling everyone otherwise i foresee a lot people looking to jack you up and post the screenshots on a daily basis. guys like you will always be entertainment for people like me.

[KillorLive]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from unholy chosen one on 2:04 am on Nov. 25, 2001
well badmeat(closest translation i can come up with) some of us do have lives outside our gaming so trying to read thru 50,000 posts and replies aint gonna happen. at least he had the sense to realize it might be fade related rather than just asking if it was an update problem. i think you need to back off mixing chocolate syrup in your jolt cola bro. you are way to high strung. and i didnt notice anywhere around here
where it says you are the head monkey in charge of hostile replies. lighten up some.
also do me a favor if you are going to qoute me keep it in its original context will ya.

(Edited by unholy chosen one at 2:07 am on Nov. 25, 2001)


(Edited by unholy chosen one at 2:08 am on Nov. 25, 2001)
[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

If you mean he's over hyped, uhh, Jolt only has caffiene, that doesn't hype someone, that pumps more blood into your frontal lobes, giving you better perception and helping you think, as for chocolate syrup (sugar), that is what the brain uses as "fuel" your brain will burn that and it keeps you thinking well, eating breakfast in the morning isn't just to keep yer gut full... when your blood-sugar levels are low, you think wors**e
st, get it?

[edit] WTF? You can't say wors**e
st? W-O-R-S-E-R-E-S-T?

(Edited by KillorLive at 4:56 am on Nov. 25, 2001)

[unholy chosen one]

uh ok kill now can you translate the purpose of that reply?
made absolutley no sense.

[RN Malboeuf]

he flamed your flame and corrected you

[ScreamingWithNoSound]

Maybe I'm just harsh, but I feel it was right for Jester OC to get flamed for being imbecilic!

To have a problem and DEMAND a responce from the developers, especially when it concerns the in-built COPY PROTECTION SYSTEM, when trying to use the SAME CD ON TWO COMPUTERS!!!

Obviously, as there is no mention of this in the FAQ section of this forum, one must assume that BIS believe that their consumers have at least some intelligence. Which is an attitude that I applaud!

[unholy chosen one]

he flamed my flame. you dont get around much eh mal? if you think that was a flame you are either very nieve or exceptionally thin skinned. that my friend was merely fact.
and as for his "correction" he obviously is misinformed in regard to sugar and caffiene and its effects on the human nervous system. so i will treat him like anyone lacking the education made so readlily available to them i will ignore him. the only flaming i see is you guys flaming a guy who doesnt know how the fade applies or maybe unlike you two future attorneys(bahaha when pigs fly thats a flame and a minor one at that) he doesnt understand the law. if you guys cant be helpful save your petulant replies for recess.

[Jester OC]

Sorry guys but I have not found one confimration by a developer. I looked into the FAQ's and on the official trouble shooter forum. I have read non developers confirm stuff, but no developer. Since I have read people claim stuff is FADE related, only to have a developer post a reply that contradicted that members "facts" I feel justified asking for a rep to guide me on this.


I understand that part of the FADE system relies on people not knowing what triggers it. Perfectly acceptable, I understand, I am a game developer myself. But I am not asking for the exact trigger, just if what I have clearly layed out is a supported practice by the games users.

I don't pirate software, but I do try to entice my friends into buying games I like. I use the games multiplayer capabilities to do this. I have sucessfuly encoraged my friends to buy many games (C&C, Total Anh, SWAT 3, Delta Force,Rouge Spear, No One Lives forever, Combat Mission, etc.) by doing this.

And for clarity, most of the games I mentioned allow you to use the same CD on two computers. OP Flashpoint is bucking the trend in multiplayer games in not supporting it (still I can't find an Official Answer).

Also, if there is an official answer out there, please Avon put it in your FAQ, that is the best place for info on this game and it is much easier to access than these forums for this type of question.

Thanks for everyones replies, even the ones I don't agree with. I just want clarity, nothing more.

[RN Malboeuf]

any excuse to run illieagl LAN is just not good enough

every one knows it BAD, you Bad boy!

ScreamingWithNoSound I'm on your side
to #### with em, every one knows using 1 CD of any thing on more then 1 computer is concidered Ilegal UNLESS the copy right or Share Ware Licence says soo

Last time I check OFP was void of the SHare Ware Stamp

[Jester OC]

Malboeuf,

Your arguement is unfounded. Saying "Everybody knows" is not confirmation, and thus not helpful. I realize you are having a hard time with this but I don't understand your anger. It is a simple question, is what I mentioned above supported or not. I'm not talking about piracy, I'm not talking about Shareware, I'm talking about support.

Jester OC

A sense honor should define the way a Roughneck member acts: help those who need it, and treat others with respect.

[RN Malboeuf]

any one trying to find a valid exuse no matter what reason will not change the law, give it up

Ignorace is not an excuse

[unholy chosen one]

jester, i think mal is basically trying to say ingnorance of the law is no excuse. but if you dont understand something and you dont ask how are you expected to know. but he is right the laws on copyrights for software havent really changed much in 10 years. you basically are entitled to one
working copy of the program off any one cd. if you installed it on one machine thats your one copy. if you want to switch to another system you have to delete the first one. usually if you are allowed to make multiple copies the cd will have multiple licences like windows nt or windows 2000 does. you probably shopuld try e-mailing bis if you want them to answer you , i just doubt they will.

[RN Malboeuf]

any one trying to find a valid exuse no matter what reason will not change the law, give it up

Ignorace is not an excuse

[Shodan]

Strange, I thought this Forum was a place for inexperienced people to come and ask questions of the more experienced people ....... seems I was wrong.

RN Malboeuf, you said that 'Everyone knows' that you can't run MP on a home network without buying multiply copies... the simple fact that the original poster asked proves that the be false.

I have played any number of games over my home network, and the thought of it being illegal never even occured to me.... and no, it may shock you to know that I have never read the multi-page terms of a piece of software (I wonder how many actually have).

I love Operation Flashpoint, it is easily worth the Ł30 I paid for it ... but do I believe that I should pay Ł60 to play it at home with my son ? Definately not !

The law may have been the same for the last 10 years but it is a completely unenforceable law, that much should be plain to all.

I thought the original question was valid and politely worded. I find your continual snide replies to him to be unworthy.

Fortunately, I have not tried OFP over my network because my son is not interested in it...... thanks to the original poster I shall now not bother.

Thank you Jester for raising the question.

Regards

Shodan

[RN Malboeuf]

any one trying to find a valid exuse no matter what reason will not change the law, give it up

Ignorace is not an excuse

[amos m]

hey. this reply is actually to the original poster concerning the original post.
Yeah. I noticed the same thing. I also started having problems after this, though I contacted cust.service and they said that my problems could not be due to fade as I did nothing wrong. And when I got the newest ver. of dx my probs were fixed.
Also, if your game were fading I think that only a reformat would be able to fix the problem due to the fact that they would probably hide a file on your pute somewhere with a name you couldn't associate to ofp.
Hope I've been of some assistance dude. What's up with that malbeouf fulla. What a knobjockey.
Maybe you should contact custservice@<hidden> your self.
cya when your a pigeon dude.

[stikman]

i've been using one cd for two computers on my home network to play multiplay over the LAN, i think the fade copy protection was meant to deter piracy of CD's in the extent of selling copies, not so the original purchaser couldn't use it on two computers. However, we play a lot of games (buy alot of games) and there are plenty that allow swapping the cd from one to the other. If the good folke at Bohemia or the Codemasters object to me doing this even though in the fine print they say "the original purchaser" well fine. I will not buy another CD from them. And yes even if you un-install and reinstall it remembers that it's not an "original game" it has obviously puts something in my registry. I think OFP could be the best war game so far, i had thought of buying another CD but i can't tell if it's fade or the game is just glitching. Oh well, in just a bit someone else (hopefully not BSI, with the fade crap) will be coming out with another newer game.  O<-<  stikman

(Edited by stikman at 10:30 am on Nov. 26, 2001)

[ufo_hk]

stikman - I agree with you I also think the intent of fade was more to deter pricay, and BIs/ CMs stance is different than other game suppliers, in that you need separate copies to play on a network.

However if you look at it from a developers point of view, if you do have two or more PCs and you are multiplaying then obviously other people are involved. So others are sharing in the fun of the game therefore there is reasonable agruement to consider that they share the cost by having to buy another copy.

Sure there are other games coming out and if other developers see merit in what CM/BI have done you could well see them implementing similar schemes. So it may well be that developers stance will change and it will become accepted practise for multiplayer games to have the need for multiple copies.

Lets remember BI have released a non CD version for dedicated servers. Therefore they are showing a different approach to mutliplayer support.

Guess time will tell, what direction developers will take, but be ready to accept change will occur.

[Jester OC]

This may seem weird I think I'm going to try to answer my own question using logic.

Despite Malboeuf's simple view of the situation (which is a strict interpretation of Copywrite law). I think that the way in which the developers created their multiplayer scheme, may hold the final answer to this question.

Unlike many other titles, OF does not have a master server that regulates CD key interactions. Thus they MUST implement their CD key security system clientside on the every game, not just internet games.

Other titles that rely on Master servers, often allow players on LAN's to play their game without checking the CD key for many of the reasons I stated earlier. They allow and encourage this behavior to let fans have fun on LAN's to encourage more purchases. As I said I work in the game development field and these talks go on all the time, it is a constant struggle to balance ease of use with piracy protection.

That said I guess I can not fault the developers in their choice of protection. Without a master server infrastructure it would be too simple to spoof the CD key system without something as sophisticated as FADE.

So what does this all mean, well I still want a direct answer because I feel that the public deserves a direct answer. Also I guess I would like a new question answered, considering how uninstalling and re-installing does not seem to help, is it worth it for me to purchase another copy, or would it fail.

Thanks again for everyone's input.

Jester OC

(Edited by Jester OC at 6:01 am on Nov. 26, 2001)

[stikman]

yup, i really do like the game it just hurted me feelings that it won'tlet me play. and yes i wonder now is it really toasted and two copies might be futile

cya O<-<

[RN Malboeuf]

asking a question that you all ready know the answer to is in no way going to help you find a loop hole

asking BIS if it's ok that you use use CD on two machines is moronic

Saying that just because BIS released a Stand Alone with no CD needed will allow you to run more copies is also moronic

The Ded server does not have any one playing and in it's self is free ware as long as you own a legit copy of OFP

it's used as a tool to allow better game play

it's not used as a tool to allow loop holes against copy right laws

any one trying to find a valid exuse no matter what reason will not change the law, give it up

Ignorace is not an excuse

(Edited by RN Malboeuf at 12:24 pm on Nov. 26, 2001)

[Jester OC]

Malboeuf,

I still do not know the answer.  I simply am trying to deduce the limitations of the games architecture.  Asking BIS  if their game works like many other games on the market is not moronic, it is a valid honest question.  After I wrote the original statement, I reflected on the games design and deduced that it may have limitations  that prevent the use of CD Keys in the way that others in the industry are currently practicing.  Rather than keep that to myself, I offered it up to the people here that are also looking for the same answer.

I'm not looking for loop holes, I am looking for solutions to a stated problem.  Your constant assumptions of some sort of guilt is uncalled for.  Like I and many other people have stated, many games with the same copy write wording on their packages allow and encourage the installation of their game on multiple machines.  Does this mean that those companies are actively encouraging people to break the law? And therefore should be prosecuted? If so the makers of Total Annihilation, and Rouge Spear should all be jailed. Both had representatives explain on their forums that it is OK for consumers to use their game on multiple machines as long as they had a CD to start them up.

Jester OC

(Edited by Jester OC at 11:36 pm on Nov. 26, 2001)

[RN Malboeuf]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from Jester OC on 11:58 pm on Nov. 23, 2001
I am using my Original version of the Game to start 2 games on two machines to play a LAN game from within my house.  After playing a mission a few times, one player's game crashed and when he returned we got saw the message "Original Games Do not FADE." Please let us know if what we are doing is considered wrong.

I read a lot of posts here and no where does a developer mention that this practice (using one CD to start multiple games) is wrong.  Please answer me.

Jester_OC
[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

what you are doing Wrong is that you are only allowed ONE working installation per CD

you have installed your CD onto two computers, which is by the agreement statment you klicked OK to says that you only have the right for 1 install on 1 machine at any time

why do you need to ask some thing that is RIGHT on the box, right on the Copy statement

you have your answer all along, and it's is Official

why don't you get it, BIS wont bother with a idiotic questions as to WHY must I have Fade!

lol@<hidden>ass

(Edited by RN Malboeuf at 6:27 pm on Nov. 26, 2001)

[Jester OC]

Malboeuf,

You know, you remind me of Javert from Les Miserables. You believe in your convictions so strongly that your quest for what is just and right leaves no room for interpretation.

With that, I'll leave this discussion.

Jester OC

(Edited by Jester OC at 1:10 am on Nov. 27, 2001)