PROPER projects - game tweaks of all sorts [Archive]

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 4 2009, 08:46

~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~ PROPER projects ~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Welcome to PROPER projects!

Read about major releases in the news section (http://dev-heaven.net/projects/proper-projects/news) and follow
minor releases and general progress in the activity view (http://dev-heaven.net/projects/activity/proper-projects).

Feel free to recommend small tweaks in the issue tracker (http://dev-heaven.net/projects/proper-projects/issues).
Make sure to post one suggestion per ticket via new issue (http://dev-heaven.net/projects/proper-projects/issues/new).
Please leave your feedback for releases in the forum (http://dev-heaven.net/projects/proper-projects/boards).

Looking forward to your ideas!

by kju

Enjoy. :cool:

----

List of PROPER project releases. Please follow the links for more details each.
The list will be updated with new releases once available.

Object drawing distance tweaks released

Make structures and units drawing way further and get them seamless
flow into view. Read more (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects/PROPER_projects#Object-drawing-distance-tweak).

Reduced model complexity released

Try the different performance and visual tweaks made for vegetation
and buildings. Your feedback will determine the final version. Read more (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects/PROPER_projects#Reduced-model-complexity).

Also try the version from HeinBloed: GDT Mod Plants (http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?p=1448473).

Buildings/Terrain only Chernarus/Utes released

Good for long range armor and air combat, as well as to test or enjoy
great FPS for Utes/Chernarus. Read more (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects/PROPER_projects#BuildingsTerrain-only-ChernarusUtes).

Almost 90 new tweaks released

Various gameplay, visuals and sound tweaks out. Make sure to read
the readme for each and check the demo images. Read more (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects/PROPER_projects#Unsorted-releases).

Jingle

Sep 4 2009, 11:13

Just tried the low setting, hats off again Kju works nicely. If this was implemented for buildings it would make the game even slicker.

Alex72

Sep 4 2009, 11:22

What is the real difference between low and very low? Sorry for being a bit daft if its obvious, but i saw no explanation between them both.

And thanks Kju. Your addons are superb. :)

Alex

TheRookie

Sep 4 2009, 11:41

Vegetation_VeryLow_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z: 28 MB.
First three and last resolution LODs removed. -> so even if you stand right in the bush, you see only the 4th LOD.
First two and last two mipmaps removed.

Vegetation_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z: 102 MB.
First two and last resolution LODs removed.
First and last mipmap removed.

Nice addon kju, my PC will be happy about this :)

Alex72

Sep 4 2009, 11:45

Thanks TheRoookie. Too early here for understanding i guess. :)

So this can/should be used with Kju's draw distance addon?

Alex

MEDICUS

Sep 4 2009, 11:55

Thx kju!

Rogue_Trooper

Sep 4 2009, 12:07

Good work Kju:)

Nazul

Sep 4 2009, 12:25

Amzaing work again Kju!

GLeek

Sep 4 2009, 13:02

finally ! THANKS !

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 4 2009, 13:05

The overall goal is better FPS, less LOD switching and better visual look for ArmA II vegetation!

VERY good!

Another step in the right direction!

MfG Lee

vasmkd

Sep 4 2009, 13:09

I hardly noticed any fps improvement with this. maybe 1 fps with lowest download.
Something is telling me its those buildings that are hurting fps

With the other addon for view distance tweak the fps didn't go down either and things are better visible at distance, great addon.

In chernarus with lots of ai and vehicles in chernagorsk i'm averaging 25-30fps (21 lowest) on editor mission i made but gameplay is smooth

Alex72

Sep 4 2009, 13:32

Im running this and draw distance and im playing some missions that was heavy before.

Much better performance with this! And the grass isnt popping back and forth anymore so its a smoother experience overall.

Alex

Walker001

Sep 4 2009, 13:41

Allright i hade brief testing session and here are my results:

Test:
Runnig around in forest and open fields, checking framerate with FRAPS.

My specs:
Core 2 Duo E6400 2.13Ghz
Geforce 8800GS
3MB Ram

I usually play my game on low-normal.

Result:
ArmA2 whitout vegetation mod:
-FPS ~25-30
-much noticable LOD swiching

ArmA2 with vegetation mod low visuals:
- FPS ~35-40 (increased 30-40%)
-little noticable LOD swiching
-no other diffrence in the graphic detail on my video settings

ArmA2 with vegetation mod very low visuals:
- FPS ~40-45 (increase 50-60%)
-no noticable LOD swiching
-the trees looks reallly bad, and you can walk trough them

Conclusion:
This addon is really great and really improved my FPS. I will be using the low visual version since I was not happy with the looks of the very low version, even if the FPS reached the sky

Thanx! Kju. Great work again!

Cionara

Sep 4 2009, 14:00

Awesome finally someone did it work :D
Now only the stutters in big cities have to be fixed.

Foxhound

Sep 4 2009, 14:25

Sounds awesome, will try this when I get home :)

Release frontpaged at the Armaholic homepage (http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=7253).

http://www.armaholic.com/datas/users/3-animation.png (http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=7252)
PROPER - Vegetation Tweak Visuals - Low (http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=7252)

http://www.armaholic.com/datas/users/3-animation.png (http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=7251)
PROPER - Vegetation Tweak Visuals - Very Low (http://www.armaholic.com/page.php?id=7251)

Richieb0y

Sep 4 2009, 14:27

can someone post a SS of the Low setting does it look ugly and all?

BoxiouS

Sep 4 2009, 14:52

There's a link to screenshots in the first post. It does look a bit ugly but it's so hard to tell unless it's on your own rig. I do however have a midnight mission i've made around Stary. there's plenty of trees in it but you can't see tehm so the lod is irrelevant. It's a hectic mission with loads going on so if this can give me a boost i will be very pleased:)

Thanks kju.

Dr.Pulp

Sep 4 2009, 15:39

Awesome mod...optical and performance wise!

But i also saw one bug and one ugly thing:
bug: no collision with trees! I used the low mod, and can't collide on foot and with vehicle with trees and bushes anymore. bullets still get stopped by the trees.

ugly thing: up close the fir trees looks really ugly, cause they are triangular. if you are 10m away the look fine...but when using one for cover...its not really beautiful.

Buliwyf

Sep 4 2009, 15:49

Nice .kju ... thanks!!!

:cheers:

MQ-9 Reaper

Sep 4 2009, 16:01

Good mod, thanks.

bug: no collision with trees! I used the low mod, and can't collide on foot and with vehicle with trees and bushes anymore. bullets still get stopped by the trees.

Same here. Player, airplanes, helicopters and wheeled vehicles don't collide with trees anymore (I am not complaining though). Tracked vehicles don't seem to be affected.

Mr Burns

Sep 4 2009, 16:04

Good effort, but the lack of bisign & key sadly makes it worthless for MP players.

zGuba

Sep 4 2009, 16:22

Very needed pack. Can't wait for other proper addons :)

whisper

Sep 4 2009, 17:23

Good effort, but the lack of bisign & key sadly makes it worthless for MP players.

Patience is virtue :)

Kremator

Sep 4 2009, 18:24

Excellent kju..... downloading now. Can't wait to try it !

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 4 2009, 18:28

Pretty embarrassing "fault". :D
I set model mass to 1 for each. I will update it tomorrow.

If you find ugly looking models, please make a sample mission placing the soldier just in
front of the object looking at it along with the pack used. Cheers!

thales100

Sep 4 2009, 18:45

Thanks kju, keep up the awesome job.

Kremator

Sep 4 2009, 19:04

kju .... it would be a good idea to test if EVERY tree was set on the high LOD constantly to see how our systems perform.

Could you release a version that does this please ?

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 4 2009, 19:08

What do you mean with high LOD? Only highest resolution LOD?
What would that tell you?

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 4 2009, 19:45

What do you mean with high LOD? Only highest resolution LOD?
What would that tell you?

It would tell if the higher lod's are part of arma2's "permanent low fps" problem.

Long time ago in OFP, setting LOD values to the highest possible(via config) made the game running faster because of close to ZERO lod switching.

Such a version would be great!

Thank you.

MfG Lee :)

Kremator

Sep 4 2009, 20:01

^^ What he said. I didn't explain myself properly.

Possible?

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 4 2009, 20:25

Not yet. Maybe. We will see.

---------- Post added at 22:25 ---------- Previous post was at 22:05 ----------

Fixed the mass and you can find sign files on the site.
Please redownload if you want to have the issues sorted.

Kremator

Sep 4 2009, 20:28

Thanks kju. Just interested to see if the same thing works as in OFP.

Binkowski

Sep 4 2009, 21:24

Thanks kju, as always. Good work! Improved performance on my end.

Inkompetent

Sep 4 2009, 21:27

Nice with such a rapid update! The mod definitely helped my performance :)

xmongx

Sep 4 2009, 21:45

Thanks so much Kju and T_D,
This is awesome, very little loss in IQ, a good boost to stability around foliage and less lod switching overall...very nice.

mils

Sep 4 2009, 21:47

heya I tried to run this with fps helper and the lodding system didn't work with it.

Any chance you can chat with the fps helper author and come up with a solution so both can work (I hate arma2 grass and like that fps helper pretty much negates it)

I did an FPS check

FPShelper 25 fps
Nothing 15
LowLOD addon 18.

so fps helper still does some amazing work to keep the fps up. I just hate how the lod is so drastic between trees and would love something more static like your mod.

xmongx

Sep 4 2009, 22:01

Use proper vegetation but define grass clutter yourself.

try terraingrid=25 in your 'arma2profile'

may help that push that 18 a little closer to 25

Also if you hate arma2 grass you could always set terrain detail to very low to remove it completely

Nazul

Sep 5 2009, 01:32

Kju awesome work again! Could you please put a version number or date into the Archive filename so i know if I already am using the latest version please?

xy20032004

Sep 5 2009, 01:48

For those with high-end PCs, I prefer releasing another version which removes low level LODs and keeps high level LODs, especially for the ugly trees and grasses after patch 1.02/03 to get better visual quality.

Or in another way, please release a tool or a batch file to let users make their own choices, removing certain LODs for speed or quality.

Anyone has the same idea?

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 5 2009, 06:07

Buildings Tweak Visuals added to the first post.

Technically the same approach. Not sure if that makes perfect sense for buildings.
Maybe different number or type res LODs or mipmaps are better removed.
Not much testing done. Feedback as always very welcome!

@<hidden> mils

No idea what that pack does. Try to leave out the plants2_Clutter_*_R_PROPER.pbo or
ask the author nicely to adopt his pack. I can't really see what else could be done on this side.

@<hidden> Nazul

Sorry no. Technically possible, yet causes too much trouble for the casual guy.
Just use the timestamp of the file or look at the latest sign file:
http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/

Moosed

Sep 5 2009, 07:12

Hi.

Ok im not very clued up with regards to what anyone is talking about in this thread, and im not sure if this mod will benefit me.

Basically what i want is a mod which increases the draw distance of vegetation and also a mod which gets rid of the grass textures constantly changing (is this what LOD is ?). I run the game at High/Very High settings, will this mod benefit me ? I want the game to look as visually impressive as possible and in this thread i have read about people using this on low/very low settings which makes me think it's not going to be much use to anyone running on high settings.

Sorry if i sound like a noob but im not technically clued up about stuff like this.

I used your viewdistance mod btw and that was great :)

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 5 2009, 08:54

BuildingsOnlyChernarus, BuildingsOnlyUtes, TerrainOnlyChernarus, TerrainOnlyUtes added.

@<hidden> xy20032004

I tried to remove only the last 9 or 5 mipmaps only. The results were not promising:
http://www5.picfront.org/picture/8AW3bn9He5/img/0001.jpg
http://www5.picfront.org/picture/Hkp1KarDtUj/img/0002.jpg
http://www5.picfront.org/picture/FjkAvpSRMU/img/0003.jpg
http://www5.picfront.org/picture/zq4G2wW8MQ/img/0004.jpg

As I am by far no experts in this area, my assumption is that the engine is expecting
a certain number of mipmaps. Or some mipmap counter needs to be reduced.

Another possibility is that mipmaps are always generated down to a given resolution
from the actual resolution like
1024 source => mipmaps: 512, 256, 64, 32, 16, 8, 4, 2

In addition it seems the ingame texture setting in video options make the engine not
draw the highest or second highest mipmap at all.

Defunkt

Sep 5 2009, 09:46

I honestly didn't expect to like it (say 'NO' to visual compromise) but, without having done any controlled testing, Vegetation_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER feels vastly better, I'm only very vaguely aware of any diminished IQ but it just feels so much smoother. Free lunch on kju!

Cionara

Sep 5 2009, 10:16

I tested the buildings tweak. It's looking ugly and buggy in chernogorsk now. I would prefer to have the first LODs and you will
need 'em because otherwise it's bugged like you see on my screenshots below. Just remove the last mipmaps and LODs and
not the very high res ones, because for me performance is good in cities, it's not like it was with the performance draining trees...
Only the stutters are anoying. Try to remove as many LoD-Levels as possible to let the stuttering disappear but keep the nice look :)

Buildings Tweak (Low) From outside:
http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/9130/arma22009090512082109.th.jpg (http://img193.imageshack.us/i/arma22009090512082109.jpg/)

Buildings Tweak (Low) Buggy inside:

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/7594/arma22009090512083309.th.jpg (http://img140.imageshack.us/i/arma22009090512083309.jpg/)

http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/8462/arma22009090512084110.th.jpg (http://img269.imageshack.us/i/arma22009090512084110.jpg/)

TBuck

Sep 5 2009, 10:43

Hi,

I tried the Low version of Buildings2 Tweak Visuals and on Utes in Kameny the small grey huts (pit latrines?) are on very low detail.

Tino

MessiahUA

Sep 5 2009, 12:12

I set model mass to 1 for each. I will update it tomorrow.

Is it possible to bring back mass also for bushes and such stuff? I just want to have more FPS, but currently it's not fair, that I can get inside them and others can't.

Dead3yez

Sep 5 2009, 13:04

First of all, nice work. Good to see someone beat my laziness to it. :D

heya I tried to run this with fps helper and the lodding system didn't work with it.

Any chance you can chat with the fps helper author and come up with a solution so both can work (I hate arma2 grass and like that fps helper pretty much negates it)

I did an FPS check

FPShelper 25 fps
Nothing 15
LowLOD addon 18.

so fps helper still does some amazing work to keep the fps up. I just hate how the lod is so drastic between trees and would love something more static like your mod.

Once I get my PC back up and running then I can spend some time working working with FPShelper. I will be happy to check out what is going wrong / if something is going wrong when I can.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 5 2009, 14:00

privet Messiah :)

the fixed version is already up or do you still experience the problem?

MEDICUS

Sep 5 2009, 14:42

Thx P-Team!
Will try this asap. Hopfully i'll now be able to at least enter the 2 big towns :D

MfG, Medicus

Cionara

Sep 5 2009, 14:45

I give you the advice to not enter the cafe or some black windows and invisible walls will scare the shit out of you :'D

andersson

Sep 5 2009, 15:48

+1 for keeping the first LOD. If you would be kind and release a version like that it would be appreciated.

MessiahUA

Sep 5 2009, 15:49

privet Messiah :)
:yay:

the fixed version is already up or do you still experience the problem?

Yep, you're right... Strange, i've checked it one more time and everything is fine now. Probably i was using the old version. Sorry. :rolleyes:

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 5 2009, 15:58

If you find ugly looking models, please make a sample mission placing the soldier just in
front of the object looking at it along with the pack used. Cheers!

Good to hear Messiah. :)

NoRailgunner

Sep 5 2009, 16:08

Good idea + work! Got ~5 fps more.
There are buildings and trees/bushes which need some tuning. This big cow barn (eg in Grishino) looks very odd.

Wonder what kind of Proper A2 mods+tweaks will surprise us next! :)

Cionara

Sep 5 2009, 23:04

The animal-tweaking.
First two and two last LODs of rabbits have been removed.

;-D

Oh_Heck

Sep 6 2009, 00:58

I think this thread deserves a sticky

xy20032004

Sep 6 2009, 05:58

Kju, can you release a tool or a tutorial for us to batch cut the LODs to meet each one's own taste?

Someone wants quality, just cuts some low LODs. Someone wants more FPS, then cuts some High LODs.

year1970

Sep 6 2009, 08:47

kju,
does it possible to increase/decrease distance at which lods switch?

Kremator

Sep 6 2009, 09:10

year1970,

That would be the ideal situation but I'm not sure how hard coded it is.

Alex72

Sep 6 2009, 09:37

year1970

Sep 6 2009, 11:50

year1970,

That would be the ideal situation but I'm not sure how hard coded it is.
I think so too. Let's wait for kju's answer :j:

Defunkt

Sep 6 2009, 11:58

Just a wild idea, I don't suppose it would be possible to alter the lowest LOD (which now has the same model/textures as the one up) such that the maps have a 50% alpha channel added as a pseudo fade-in effect?

Shadow NX

Sep 6 2009, 13:33

Thanks a lot for these lil addons with big impact, just played a typical stress test mission ( sp scenario "counterattack" ) and along with the fix for vegetation the building fix works superb there.

Only downside i saw so far is that the lil sheds -for example in the counterattack mission next to the hospital with the chedaki recruit in is one- always look very blurry and wont change texture to a better variant.

And on one house i had the off problem that because it didnt use the highest lod i could open the doors and it did but also stretched a long polygon wall texture with it, looked bit odd but nothing dramatic compared to the gain.
Didnt took a pic but it was in the last part of the mission in the industrial complex.

MEDICUS

Sep 6 2009, 14:45

With the building LOW version i also have many types of buildings in very very low textures. This is when i am close to the buildings. 50m - 1m it looks very blurry.

Guess thats being worked on, but just reporting it. :)

Have the same problem. The cow-shed for example (Land_Farm_Cowshed_a, _b and _c) seems to have only the "very_low" lod (some smaller sheds, like the Land_Shed_M01, too). I also don't have any stay ropes on the water tower (Land_Farm_WTower).

Apart from this, it works really nice for me.

MfG, Medicus

Cionara

Sep 6 2009, 15:01

You said the BIGNS are on the site but I can't find them =(

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 6 2009, 18:05

Key-and-sign-files (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects/PROPER_projects#Key-and-sign-files)

Cionara

Sep 6 2009, 18:27

Thank ya

randir14

Sep 6 2009, 19:03

Nice job, in Chernogorsk I gained a few FPS when running around, and flying over it isn't as stuttery. The biggest improvement for me are the red bushes and trees. With AA enabled they used to bring me down to 30 fps, now it stays around 40-45 fps. Maybe this could help BIS when it comes to optimizing the game in the future.

Cionara

Sep 6 2009, 19:42

Yea they definitely should ask modders or just include their addons in Arrowhead.
I think they don't have to ask because they made the platform for this all :D

Kremator

Sep 6 2009, 19:46

I'm still keen to see how having only the most detailed LOD affects performance, both for trees/veg and buildings.

Cionara

Sep 6 2009, 19:47

Hm which keys and signs do I have to download when I use low vegetation tweak ?

Edit: ah ok i got it, plant2_low bisigns and the proper .bikey

What is this "preload vegetation textures" ? :)

SuperRat

Sep 6 2009, 20:08

i was waiting for something like this thanks to you kju
good job man
pat u're self on back lol

Sep 7 2009, 00:57

Great job Kju.

I'm using the "Vegetation_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER" and the visual difference is very minimal and not really noticable when playing. I did a quick test on one of the small tree clusters/forest on Utes and got about a 25-30% increase in fps. My guess is there will be at least the same or more in the denser areas of Chernarus.

This ones a definite keeper. You rock!

Alex72

Sep 7 2009, 03:50

Hm which keys and signs do I have to download when I use low vegetation tweak ?

Edit: ah ok i got it, plant2_low bisigns and the proper .bikey

What is this "preload vegetation textures" ? :)

Dont know if you mean for your server? But you dont need the key to run an addon. You only need the addon PBO and it's signed PBO.

Addon.pbo
Addon.bisign.pbo

The key's are for servers. They add an addons key so that people can only connect with the addon they added keys for.

Alex

xy20032004

Sep 7 2009, 05:41

Now I do hope that a high qualiy version will be released. I have a high-end pc so FPS is not a problem. By comparing origin v1.01 trees (the best quality) with Kju's mod trees, if first two high level LODs are removed, visual difference is very clear at close distance, but at medium and far distance then no difference.

Kju, please release two versions, high quality version (removes most Low LODs) and low qualiy one (removes some high LODS).

Limbless

Sep 7 2009, 06:16

I don't know if anyone has pointed this out already, but the interiors of some buildings, especially those with stairs, can look weird. I tried to take a screenshot, but it came out as a blank square. :bored:

Specifically, looking up at what should be the underside of the second story's floor shows a transparent surface, that allows one to see through the wall.

I was using the "Low" version at the time of observing this. If you want more information on what I mean, try it yourself - enter some of the house-like buildings in Cherno.

Otherwise, lovin' the FPS boost. :D

randir14

Sep 7 2009, 08:26

GLeek

Sep 8 2009, 00:03

i personnaly prefer playing without proper building . though , the FPS boost of proper vegetation LOW is incredible. thanks guys for resolved something BI seem not to be able to . maybe they have parts @<hidden> and @<hidden> ...

anyway , here is 2 full quality screenshot comparing nearly same picture. (i was not exactly at same spot . 1 meter difference actually )

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/5071/arma2defaut.png

http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/3039/arma2properplantlow.png

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 8 2009, 07:00

@<hidden> year1970

Some expert in this area could answer it better I guess. In general not possible I think.
What is possible is to trick the engine, like SgtAce did:

Either you replace the first res LOD with the second. So the first two are the same.
This way the engine should use the same res LOD for two different distances/areas.
This approach removes some res LOD phases though.

The other approach I could think of is instead of replacing, is just merging into between
two the copy. This would need to alter the res LOD values I think.
Not sure if that works though. I am not aware of any real evidence how the engine works based on the res LOD values.

---

If you spot bad res LOD, please post a sample mission as explained here (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects/PROPER_projects#Reduced-model-complexity).

---

At the link you also find a little FAQ on the tools and first-res-LOD-only questions.

---

Thanks GLeek for the screens!

JTS_2009

Sep 8 2009, 10:58

hey, when come Water Tweak Visuals? ))

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 8 2009, 11:46

Like no water? Or ice only? :P

MEDICUS

Sep 8 2009, 13:04

---

If you spot bad res LOD, please post a sample mission as explained here (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects/PROPER_projects#Reduced-model-complexity).

---

Missions submitted.

MfG,
Medicus

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 8 2009, 14:22

Cheers

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 9 2009, 07:18

Anyone tried the Terrain or Buildings only Utes or Chernarus?

WindsorGamer

Sep 9 2009, 17:12

Thaks Kju.

I can finally run my desired setup with these mods... (ie. High shadows FINALLY!!)

I just hope that the servers I frequent allow them!

andersson

Sep 9 2009, 21:33

Anyone tried the Terrain or Buildings only Utes or Chernarus?

When I tried to DL them yesterday I couldnt for some reason.

I must say that your work is good kju! I have a laptop that I bring with me when I work and without your addons arma2 would be too slow. Now I can edit, build missions and test scripts. Not playable but usable :)

Is it possible for you to make some kind of "as low as possible" addon? I dont care if the wheels are blocks and the man looks like lego. Makes it easier for slow laptops like mine to test scenarios (to be used on my gaming rig when I get back home).

Thank you!

T_D

Sep 10 2009, 20:24

I released the tools now btw for those who want to try different settings:

Release thread (http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=86215)
DevHeaven site for my tools (http://dev-heaven.net/projects/list_files/tdt)

xy20032004

Sep 12 2009, 00:23

Alex72

Sep 12 2009, 01:46

Kju
Will there be some special updates or something new with the release of T_D's tools? Or maybe you have been using that before it was released?

T_D

Sep 12 2009, 03:18

excellent job,man! I love those tools, finally I can tweak the pbos myself.

Thanks a lot!

Are these tools for AA2 only? Can they be used on AA1 P3D models?

---------- Post added at 12:23 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:18 AM ----------

T_D, can you make a GUI interface for your tools? When I want to edit lots of p3d files I have to do it one by one, how do you deal with so many files? Thanks in advance.

A1 p3ds should work too (ODOL of course). I am probably not gonna make a GUI but maybe I add the possibility to process whole folders. For now you would need a batch file to process a bunch of p3ds.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 12 2009, 07:02

Added the process to the PROPER wiki page (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects/PROPER_projects#Projects) as well as my batch files.

There will be an update, if (more) people report LOD/texture issues. ;)

NoRailgunner

Sep 12 2009, 09:12

Arent the buildings in Buildings_Low(orVeryLow)_R_Proper the same like in seperate files BuildingsOnlyChernarus/Utes_World_C_Proper?

Is it possible to look and find issues with objects/buildings/vegetation textures ingame via objectbrowser like this one from Kronzky?

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 12 2009, 10:12

Yes they are. After all objects are not integrated into a world file.

The object browser might work. That said you need to make it show the different Res LODs
and mipmaps by distance (and FPS).

Cionara

Sep 12 2009, 12:30

Has someone used that tool to remove mipmaps and has a nice conclusion ?
Because I would love to use that Build-Tweak if the first mipmaps would be there so it would no longer be bugged in some buildings.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 13 2009, 09:06

Cionara you mix both. The resolution LODs of the p3d are responsible for missing
walls etc. The mipmaps are more about the look - at least for buildings.

Extreme and very high vegetation test versions
===================================

Here is are two new versions for vegetation to test.

Please download ONLY, if you want to test - these are NOT recommended for
normal play. Please do NOT make a news item about these.

Only highest Res LOD. No texture changes:
Vegetation_VeryHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/Vegetation_VeryHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z) (370 MB).

Only highest Res LOD, only highest mipmap/texture:
Vegetation_ExtremeHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/Vegetation_ExtremeHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z) (270 MB).

Notes
====

This is how it looks by default: ResLodAndMipMapsUnmodified (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/misc/ResLodAndMipMapsUnmodified.avi)
Very high: HighestResLodOnly_NoMipMapChanges (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/misc/HighestResLodOnly_NoMipMapChanges.avi)

Extreme has the issue of mipmaps/textures not pre/loaded correctly. You
need to get close first for the texture to be shown correctly:
HighestResLodAndMipMapOnly_Issues (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/misc/HighestResLodAndMipMapOnly_Issues.avi)

Once loaded, it does look quite nice:
HighestResLodAndMipMapOnly_AfterTexturesLoaded (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/misc/HighestResLodAndMipMapOnly_AfterTexturesLoaded.avi)
HighestResLodAndMipMapOnly_InMotion (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/misc/HighestResLodAndMipMapOnly_InMotion.avi)

Conclusion
========

ExtremeHigh looks quite good once loaded.
It migth be better to use the 2nd Res LOD and/or 2nd mipmap, as in the
current version the trees flicker a bit due to the thin / very detailed drawing
and therefore high alpha part.
It seems that not mipmaps are removed, instead it is about subtextures.
The mipmaps are said to be generated on the fly. So if the subtexture is no
longer found, no mipmap can be generated, hence the one colored textures
look (fallback / default value).
For this reason T_D might try a different approach. Might get too complex though.
The very high version (first Res LOD only, no texture changes) looks worse on my setup.

In addition you may wanna try these two preloading addons:

PreloadVegetationModels_Visuals_C_PROPER.7z (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/misc/PreloadVegetationModels_Visuals_C_PROPER.7z)
Seems to have no effect or does not work.

PreloadVegetationTextures_Visuals_C_PROPER.7z (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/misc/PreloadVegetationTextures_Visuals_C_PROPER.7z)
Might work yet freezes the game on world loading here.
Seems like it is unable to preload that many textures or is the problem
of not being able to preload some referenced in the model (see rpt).

So for the later you could try to remove some references to try to get it
to work.

Kremator

Sep 13 2009, 09:52

Thanks for all this work kju ! Testing now.

EDIT: After doing some testing on the VERYHIGH visuals I am about to try the EXTREMELYHIGH visual.

I have found that there seems to be NO FPS hit at all on veryhigh and the game looks better. I can still see a little switching so I hope that extremelyhigh will sort this. Some trees have no substance to them at all, however. When you walk right up to them they look paper thin.

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 13 2009, 11:01

I have some problems with the extremhigh, but veryhigh runs GREAT so far!

I'm going to test a little more but I can say one thing right now:

You are a HERO kju!

MfG Lee :D

Edit:

As expected, it cost a little FPS but runs smoother overall. Just like good old OFP.

It's so fantastic to NOT see the tree lods switching in front of your eyes all the time.

Thank you so much for fixing this annoying problem! :cheers:

MEDICUS

Sep 13 2009, 13:59

Don't know if this was reported, but i just realised, that i don't have any ladders with "Buildings_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER" at all.
And with "Vegetation_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER", the trees and bushes don't have a collision anymore. They stop bullets, i shot at them, but i can run and drive trough them.

MfG, Medicus

Cionara

Sep 13 2009, 15:41

That was the old version without colliding. Redownload the newer one.

MEDICUS

Sep 13 2009, 19:23

Oh ok. Thx ,Cionara! :)

Manzilla

Sep 14 2009, 00:03

In addition you may wanna try these two preloading addons:

* PreloadVegetationModels_Visuals_C_PROPER.7z
Seems to have no effect or does not work.

* PreloadVegetationTextures_Visuals_C_PROPER.7z
Might work yet freezes the game on world loading here.
Seems like it is unable to preload that many textures or is the problem
of not being able to preload some referenced in the model (see rpt).

So for the later you could try to remove some references to try to get it
to work.
_______

Alright sorry about this guys. This is an absolutely retarded question for me to ask as I should know the answer by now but what do you mean by preload? Do I just use the .pbo in a Mod folder(with it in target line obviously) or is there some sort of "preload" set up that I just never heard of before.

Sorry about this.

randir14

Sep 14 2009, 00:13

I just tried very high and all the trees are 3D until I get within a certain distance and they turn into 2D sprites. Is this supposed to be happening?

xmongx

Sep 14 2009, 00:44

Alright sorry about this guys. This is an absolutely retarded question for me to ask as I should know the answer by now but what do you mean by preload? Do I just use the .pbo in a Mod folder(with it in target line obviously) or is there some sort of "preload" set up that I just never heard of before.

Sorry about this.

I may be wrong but I think the goal is to preload all vegetation into memory. Nothing to do with how you load the mod.

Manzilla

Sep 14 2009, 01:34

Thanks xmongx! That's what I was thinking but I tend to miss major concepts sometimes when it comes to AddOns and Mods. Not sure why. :D

Binkowski

Sep 14 2009, 02:47

I just tried very high and all the trees are 3D until I get within a certain distance and they turn into 2D sprites. Is this supposed to be happening?

Mine have always looked like that, even before using these modifications. So maybe it's built into the game?

Alex72

Sep 14 2009, 03:26

Mine have always looked like that, even before using these modifications. So maybe it's built into the game?

Yep. The horrible jagged weird 2D trees has been there since day 1. Not this addons fault.

Maddmatt

Sep 14 2009, 05:19

I just tried the "Very High" vegetation and I get what looks like the complete opposite - all low LODs. Maybe that's what's being reported above. I cannot reproduce the "2D trees" mentioned in the posts above with standard A2.
I double checked to make sure I wasn't running the wrong addon, and I'm definitely running the "very high" one.

Edit: I see your video shows the same problem. You sure something didn't go wrong with the files? Because that certainly isn't the highest LOD that's showing up.

Alex72

Sep 14 2009, 05:50

I cannot reproduce the "2D trees" mentioned in the posts above with standard A2.

Wow. What version of ARMA2 do you have? :D

Seriously though the 2D trees are everywhere when your by these orange/red/yellow trees. Always been there since 1.00. Im playing normal textures & obj. detail though. Maybe is that.

Maddmatt

Sep 14 2009, 06:17

Wow. What version of ARMA2 do you have? :D ...
Running the build 59025 beta. My settings are all on 'Very High', except video memory on 'Default' and AA on 'Low' (don't need more due to 3D res at 125%).
I tried, and I couldn't get the trees to turn 2D.
Although I didn't see this issue when running on low settings with my old Geforce 7800GT either :confused:

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 14 2009, 07:46

How about some screenshots or videos - otherwise no one really knows whats been talked about. :)

Maddmatt

Sep 14 2009, 08:20

Ok here's a pic:

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/Maddmatth/th_veryhighplants.jpg (http://s179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/Maddmatth/?action=view&current=veryhighplants.jpg)

That's the "Very High Vegetation" for me :confused:

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 14 2009, 08:35

Compared to what?

Maddmatt

Sep 14 2009, 08:45

The mod is suppose to leave only the highest LOD according to the description, but all I see when I use it is a low LOD.

Without the mod:
http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/Maddmatth/th_veryhighplantsnomod.jpg (http://s179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/Maddmatth/?action=view&current=veryhighplantsnomod.jpg)

With "Very High Vegetation" mod:
http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/Maddmatth/th_veryhighplants.jpg (http://s179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/Maddmatth/?action=view&current=veryhighplants.jpg)

Isn't that the opposite of what it's supposed to do? And I checked to make sure I wasn't running the "low" version.
Using "Vegetation_VeryHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z".

RoME

Sep 14 2009, 13:37

Same problem here.

When i use veryhigh lod, i have only very low lod everywhere.

.. Not nice effect atm ^^

Alex72

Sep 14 2009, 14:09

Ok here's a pic:

That's the "Very High Vegetation" for me :confused:

Ok i dont know if that was somehow directed to me and those who see 2D trees? But the flaw in that pic is that those trees are too close. The 2D trees are further away.

Will post screen when im fully awake.

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 14 2009, 16:40

Same problem here.

I first didn't noticed it, because of flying all the time with helicopter & aircrafts and there are no trees near the runways.

Then, testing with ground units, I have this:

http://lee.plankton.ch/A2_Tree_LODs.jpg

MfG Lee :)

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 14 2009, 16:43

Good news is you are correct. Here is the fixed versions:

Vegetation_ExtremeHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/temp/Vegetation_ExtremeHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z)
Vegetation_VeryHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/temp/Vegetation_VeryHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z)

That bad news, at least for my testing, is that in my rather simple test scenario
it made the Res LODs of other units like tanks show in very low Res LOD unless
very close. It seems only highest Res LOD for vegetation adds a high strain
on the system - which makes sense.

Give it a try and report back.

So 2nd or 3rd Res LOD might be better to use.

The texture issue is still there though.

PS: I put bit of blame on T_D making opposite logic here and my failed reading skills of course. :)

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 14 2009, 16:48

Downloading now, thank you!

MfG Lee

Edit:

It looks FANATASTIC, but it's unplayable. ;)

What ArmA2 should look like:

http://lee.plankton.ch/A2_Highest_k.jpg (http://lee.plankton.ch/A2_Highest.jpg)

zGuba

Sep 14 2009, 17:52

Looks like BI made their shadow LODs incorrectly - they should be nonconvex so even lower LODs wont get hurt.

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 14 2009, 18:52

Did some more testing.

Best results are:

- plants2_Bush_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER.pbo

- plants2_Clutter_VeryLow_Visuals_R_PROPER.pbo

- plants2_misc_VeryHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.pbo

- plants2_Plant_VeryHigh_Visuals_R_PROPER.pbo

- plants2_Tree_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER.pbo

=====

LOD changings are visible for trees and bushes, that should be fixed.

I think we need some sort of "mediumhigh" LOD settings for trees and bushed, not too ugly but no frame killer like veryhigh but also with NO lod switching!

Tree with low pbo:

http://lee.plankton.ch/A2_tree_low.jpg

Note the half-missing trunk, could look better for infantry fighting.

I tested flying @<hidden> viewdistance on "high" arma settings and it worked like a dream! Stable fps even when piloting a chopper at ground level between the trees at ~250km/H.

==========

This addon could be THE KEY to a playable good looking ArmA2!

Support this guy, he is doing a HELL of a job!!

MfG Lee :cool:

Mad-h

Sep 14 2009, 22:44

Maybe keeping the highest res lod and one lower res lod would do the trick, it would work as the speedtree technology, but well thats not posible with T D-s tools, right? But my guess is BIS already tried all the possibilities, and they settled with this "many lod for one object thing", because this was the best in performance and image quality wise.

Kremator

Sep 14 2009, 23:10

Ouchie. My system is running at 3.9GHz and with the new VeryHigh visuals it is really slowed down. I think I would need to have a low VD to get the best out of it (which I'm not willing to do!)

noobiewarrior

Sep 15 2009, 00:58

my moniker tells it all and I am not embarrassed to appear (prove?) I'm an idiot: what folders do the pbos go in and how are they invoked?

Alex72

Sep 15 2009, 01:32

If your asking for how to simply use a mod then in the ARMA2 root directory create a folder named @<hidden> (for example that is. Call it what you want, but keep the @<hidden> in front as its easier to see the modfolders that way). Inside of that folder make another folder called Addons (< very important) and add the mod PBO's in there. So @<hidden>/Addons/the addon PBO's in here.

After you done that right click your shortcut that starts ARMA2. Properties and in the TARGET field where you see the path to ARMA2.exe make 1 space at the end of that path and add the command to activate mods. Add the addon you want to be activated so it looks like this: -mod=@<hidden>

Start the game and voila.

You might want to add -nosplash as well so that target field should look like this: "C:\Program files\Bohemia Interactive\ArmA 2\arma2.exe" -mod=@<hidden> -nosplash

EDIT: For more than 1 addon/mod you add a ";" (semicolon) between each mod like this: -mod=@<hidden>;@<hidden>;@<hidden>;@<hidden> -nosplash

Alex

noobiewarrior

Sep 15 2009, 02:46

thanks. I'm on my way

---------- Post added at 10:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:48 PM ----------

Fabulous! significant improvement in FPS with low visual vegetation without any decrease in quality of experience. Now if I can just find someone who has figured out how to reduce the grossly overstated effect of brighter light - in forest, if even a slight bit of sky becomes visible, the light dims so much in the the rest of the scene that it becomes very hard to see anything. this happens even with post-processing set on low (and kegytes says his blur and bloom tools are no longer necessary in 1.03). please excuse me if this comment violates some posting protocol - I would gladly post it in the appropriate thread if I could find one.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 15 2009, 07:56

Gdt hdr

Radnik

Sep 15 2009, 09:59

one noob question for kju. Is it for vehicles used same technique as for plants and buildings?...in that way is it possible to apply it on them to?

noobiewarrior

Sep 15 2009, 23:20

Gdt hdr

what does Gdt hdr mean

GLeek

Sep 15 2009, 23:39

change dynamic exposure in something quite static. but you must often change value with action menu , as time roll ...

suhsjake

Sep 16 2009, 00:42

For the best FPS performance on my rig, I used Oswald's suggestions plus VF FPS Saver. Thanks kju.

xy20032004

Sep 16 2009, 01:27

Hi, everyone, I think that the best way is not to only use the highest LOD or the Lowest LOD but to only make small changes in LODs. Just like Kju did in the first version, its a good balance for quality and performance, no sharp visual loss in medium and far distance.
What I did was to romove the last 2 lowest LODs from all p3d vegetations with 5 or 4 LODs, and for 3 LODs, set them to 2 LODs. In short, 5/4 to 3, 3 to 2. Removing 1 or 2 lowest LODs can bring your better image quality and keep you at good FPS.

Bushlurker

Sep 16 2009, 01:55

@<hidden>

GTD HDR Mod HERE (http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=77142&highlight=hdr)...

Read the first post real carefully, then download and give it a go... might help tone down the light/dark extremes...
Also search this "addons and mods complete" section for sakura chans sun addon - tones down the glare...

B

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 16 2009, 17:49

...to only make small changes in LODs...

The problem is, the different "level of details" of many trees are so different in look that the changing in front of your eyes is a pain.

As long as no one is going to remodel the existing tree model lods or creating complete new trees and makes a "tree replacement pack", I prefer the "1 medium/high LOD" solution.

MfG Lee ;)

Mad-h

Sep 16 2009, 18:26

yes a tree remodel would be nice, these trees are too complex, eats up a lot of fps, and who really give them a closer look? Kinda like fallout 3 bushes, i got 30-40 fps overall, but when looking at the bush from close it drops to like 10.
This tweak is good for reducing lod changes, but the performance issue can only be solved with less complex trees.

kklownboy

Sep 16 2009, 18:31

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 16 2009, 20:28

...but bigger faster hardware is the real fix to FPS.

Or doing a proper job programming a game, so it works on "normal" hardware...

http://lee.plankton.ch/A2_TheHunter_k.jpg (http://lee.plankton.ch/A2_TheHunter.jpg)

Like "The Hunter", a hunting sim.

This game works since it's release and it plays super smooth with fantastic graphics.

Oh, and the screen is from the FREE* version.

MfG Lee ;)

*=Full game, but you can hunt only one species.

Mad-h

Sep 16 2009, 22:37

well you really can't compare a hunting sim to arma 2, but it's true that arma2 engine is not optimized really well.

-=seany=-

Sep 17 2009, 01:03

Or doing a proper job programming a game, so it works on "normal" hardware...
pic
Like "The Hunter", a hunting sim.

This game works since it's release and it plays super smooth with fantastic graphics.

Oh, and the screen is from the FREE* version.

MfG Lee ;)

*=Full game, but you can hunt only one species.

Woah, that looks really similar to Arma2's engine. I thought it was Arma2 when I first looked at it.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 17 2009, 06:41

@<hidden> Radnik

It can be applied on any p3d or texture.

I will do a test with vehicles, infantry and weapons.
Also will test more with 1 Res LOD only for vegetation. Maybe 2nd or 3rd is fine.

It would be great to come to a conclusion to release a pack and sign it.
The summary of Lee_H._Oswald was a great one. Any other recommendations?

Especially for buildings only one member reported issues for object so far.

IceBreakr

Sep 17 2009, 07:51

kju: can you give me a tip how to change the water color, I've inserted that two rgb lines in Water {}; but it seems that it doesn't change in A2?
I hate this shitty looking A2 water, looks like in Netherlands :)

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 17 2009, 08:40

Try this thread (http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?t=84956) IceBreakr. :)
I assume it is still done the very same way.

Mad-h

Sep 17 2009, 11:04

Well the buildings are the same for me, weird transparent walls, ceiling, and the doorways are whole black.
The same problems as reported. Should use a higher res lod.

The low vegetation worked fine for me, the only problem is that most servers don't allow mods, so i have to play without it.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 17 2009, 12:40

@<hidden> Mad-h

Please read again Report bad models (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects#Projects).

IceBreakr

Sep 17 2009, 13:27

kju: compiling right now, just got home ;)

Update:
Yaaay, tnx kju! It works ;)
http://www.shrani.si/f/U/Zf/2ARTAIbG/newwatertnxkju.jpg
http://www.shrani.si/f/J/u8/2kGDewgB/newwatertnxkju2.jpg

DMarkwick

Sep 17 2009, 16:41

Using the Buildings_Low, I noticed that many large buildings in Sahrani (CAA1) simply no longer show ingame. Probably connected to the various "unable to open xxx.pbo" errors ;). Hangars, castles etc. Probably more than that, but they're the most immediately obvious from the test scenarios I'm using. :)

*edit*
Also, I am getting mega-slowdowns when in very dense vegetation in Sahrani. (Like those dense copses north-north-west of Badango level with the castle) I guess this is a separate issue to the above, if it is even an issue and not merely a consequence :)

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 17 2009, 17:31

CAA1 merges a2 and a1 buildings. Of course if you load an a2 only buildings addon,
that you will get missing objects for a1 worlds.

The vegetation is simply the a1 vegetation. Remember what was said about its performance?

Radnik

Sep 17 2009, 18:05

@<hidden> Radnik

It can be applied on any p3d or texture.

I will do a test with vehicles, infantry and weapons.

Thx for info and time on efford to do all this things to make comunity happy and satisfied!.Just take your time...and keep up the good work!

DMarkwick

Sep 17 2009, 18:48

The vegetation is simply the a1 vegetation. Remember what was said about its performance?

Well, in that case I don't know. All I can tell you is that with the addon, lots of slowdown, without the addon, no slowdown. But only when among the dense vegetation.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 17 2009, 20:24

DMarkwick you need to state precisely which addon you are about please.
There are dozens out there. ;)

DMarkwick

Sep 17 2009, 21:35

Hah :D the ones I have are:
Buildings_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER
Vegetation_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER
both downloaded 12/09/09.

DesertJedi

Sep 17 2009, 22:50

Mad-h

Sep 18 2009, 00:50

Great work on the mod! I'm using Vegetation_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER. I combined it with turning Terrain Detail to Very Low and am also using SAP Clutter. If that combination doesn't make sense for any reason, please let me know.

Even with the above, IMHO, there's still too much vegetation in A2 and I really don't like the look of any of it. Maybe you could come out with the "Chernarus - Smooth as a Cue Ball" mod and then I could finally SEE what the hell I'm doing. :D

Hm on very low terrain level i have no grass at all, do you have?

@<hidden> Mad-h

Please read again Report bad models.

Do you mean i have to upload a mission? Isn't that enough that i have the same issues as cionara, with the same building? Well maybe i should test it with other builings, but i think it's the same, since that lod doesent meant to be used while the player is inside the building. Ok lets just say that it is the same with buildings that have interiors...

Flash Thunder

Sep 19 2009, 00:26

Great Work Kju with the Proper_Low Visuals, I can get around 10FPS more with the mod and the graphics look better, keep up your stellar work. :yay:

CuDa

Sep 19 2009, 07:37

hmm..can anyone else walk thru trees with this mod ?...1.04..is this why u get a 10FPS boost ?

r3volution

Sep 19 2009, 08:43

Mad-h

Sep 19 2009, 09:44

Where do you people get that old version? kju should really change the links to the new one...

evilfury

Sep 20 2009, 06:46

Yeah was going to say I've noticed that all trees and fallen logs can be walked through, I'm using the low replacement. Don't know if this is because the distance lods don't have a physical presence or not, they seem to stop bullets but I'm not 100% sure.

Its possible even without kyus mods. With original unmoded game. It happens to me in multiplayer though. SP is fine.

Could somebody tell me where can I download bisign keys? I cant play multiplayer with proper mod. But it gives me 10fps more.

[DirTyDeeDs]-Ziggy-

Sep 22 2009, 16:54

I can confirm a 10 to sometimes 20 fps increase around foliage while using Vegetation_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER :cool:
( 20 on those red bushes !)

Wolfrug

Sep 23 2009, 12:45

These addons are great! Thanks to them I can actually play Arma 2 on my ancient rig (AMD Athlon 64 X2, 3800+ (@<hidden>), 2GB ancient DDR, 8600 GT 512MB). I've tried both the Very Low and the Low versions (of both the buildings and vegetation stuff). Most of my settings are on Low anyway, except I can't stand Object Detail on less than Medium since that makes all the soldier/vehicle models LOD waaaay too close.

My two complaints: 1) Trees Very Low.pbo makes certain trees 2D, even when standing right next to them. You can see a whole slew of these trees on the beach between Komarovo and Balota - usually these are thick and nice for cover. They're still there, they just....don't look very nice. If these particular trees could be fixed, that'd be great! The other visual oddities (such as certain clutter having a 2D decal for a bit too long) isn't gameplay breaking in any way. I can "fix" this by having the rest Very Low and leave the trees as Low, but the trees are generally the biggest FPS eaters, so....

2) Both buildings low and very low make the cow shed-type buildings (ex. Mogilevka, 076101) completely unusable: they basically remain in a very low LOD even when entering. In Low, you can see the iron railings etc. inside, but in Very Low you can see through the walls etc (like no-clipping into a non-enterable building) when you manage to find the door. In both cases there's no animation etc. for the doors and you sort of have to guess where to enter. Problem is, the cow shed is a part of the largest pbo file (buildings2.pbo), otherwise I could've chosen not to load it.

Aside from this, this addon is excellent! If someone could tell me how to fix the two complaints above, I can be on my merry way. Apologies if this has been mentioned before/is not within the scope of this project.

Regards,
Wolfrug

evilfury

Sep 24 2009, 17:19

Does anyone play online with these mod? I keep getting kick out due to using it. I copied proper.bikey in my key folder and it doesnt work.

Inkompetent

Sep 24 2009, 17:52

Does anyone play online with these mod? I keep getting kick out due to using it. I copied proper.bikey in my key folder and it doesnt work.

The bikey is only for servers. What you need as a user is a pboname.ofpec-tag.bisign file in the same folder as the PBO itself

Maddmatt

Sep 24 2009, 21:21

And remember that not all servers will allow it anyway. But maybe they could be convinced if you asked.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 25 2009, 07:26

Please try GDT Mod Plants by HeinBloed (http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?p=1447579) and give him feedback. :)

Ringhejm

Sep 26 2009, 06:18

Please try GDT Mod Plants by HeinBloed (http://forums.bistudio.com/showthread.php?p=1447579) and give him feedback. :)

Well I must say that whit your 2 mods.

PROPER - Buildings Tweak Visuals - Low
PROPER - Vegetation Tweak Visuals - Low

I dont get any notic in my FPS I dont know if i ned to have more than those 2. But if i combine it whit GDT Mod I have some of 10 FPS and it loads the world much fast when i flush my memory.

I dont know if I can combine those 2.

I will try just the GDT mod and tjeck that by it self.

Mad-h

Sep 26 2009, 11:12

Does anyone play online with these mod? I keep getting kick out due to using it. I copied proper.bikey in my key folder and it doesnt work.

I used to use the low veg mod online, but since the best serers(ping/players wise) do not allow this mod i had to say goodbye to my great fps boost. There are servers though that have no mod restrictions, you just have to search. It more likely be a high ping low populated server, with people who does not speak english at all. :p

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 26 2009, 17:22

Updated first post:

Various gameplay, visuals and sound tweaks out. Make sure to read
the readme for each and check the demo images

Also signed versions of the object drawing distance tweaks are finally available.

---

There will be a 'final' release of the 'reduced model complexity' tweaks the coming
days. Without more detailed feedback I will make the vegetation pack based
on Lee_H._Oswald suggestion.

Unfortunately only Medicus has reported three types of buggy buildings. Without
more detailed information, no more fixes will be added.

TAW_T-Bone

Sep 26 2009, 17:30

Whoow kju good job.

But this is so big i have no clue what to do with this all.
Can you explain it a little? I don't know where to start reading.:butbut:

Nazul

Sep 27 2009, 01:22

Thanks Kju for all the tweaks!
Is there a way to make the compass smaller so it can be left on screen all the time? Its not unrealistic, i have a compass on a watch band i use for diving and bush walking.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 27 2009, 06:32

Open that pbo, modify it and repack it.
x and y are for position. Size is scale.

Lee_H._Oswald

Sep 27 2009, 07:52

Has anyone tested if there are "fps killer" buildings in A2?(like the orange trees)

It would be nice to know if the higher LODs could be used for them without much LOD changing ingame.

MfG Lee

NoRailgunner

Sep 27 2009, 09:47

Thanks for all Proper tweaks!
Just wonder why you didnt make a page like wiki Proper:Mod for ArmA? Imho you get a better overview and you are faster instead of clicking: on readme, on <propertweak>addon, on bisign.
Wouldnt it be more userfriendly if you make a "A2_ProperTweak_Pack" incl. all addons, bisigns and one readme + images? :idea:

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 27 2009, 09:54

After all the point is that you are do choose what you like.
Sign files are not needed most of the time anyway (SP or server not having added the key).
The readme should be possible to view online via the browser.
Once Sickboy has fixed the display, it will look good.

That said, you and anyone else is welcome to make packs, add them to the wiki page or
more. There is a reason for using an open wiki. :)

NoRailgunner

Sep 27 2009, 10:02

Great if its going to be a DH Proper-site like your "old" one:
http://community.bistudio.com/wiki/PROPER:Mod :)

btw are there addons which need CBA/XEH?

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 27 2009, 21:12

Hm so how is it different to the a2 PROPER wiki page?

NoRailgunner

Sep 28 2009, 09:54

A2 ProperDH is with registration, bit unsorted/plain and with more clickclick (to get infos and downloads).
A1 Properwiki much better overview and easier to use.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 28 2009, 10:27

Did you read the wiki page. ;)

You can use the dummy account: guest//guest.

> bit unsorted

It is a wiki. You/anyone can improve the grouping.
Currently it is alphabetical. Least work for me.

> plain

It is a wiki. You/anyone can add more screens.
Least work for me. The addon naming, readme and
sometimes screen should be enough, no?

> more clickclick

One click to read the readme, one click to download the pbo - optional one click to get the sign file.
vs
Download, extract, open readme, remove extract folder and zip pack.

> A1 Properwiki much better overview and easier to use

The difference is that the docu is in the readme now vs on the overview page itself.
Far less work for me and once Sickboy has fixed the display of txt for Redmine/DH,
it will look good again.

How is it easier?

NoRailgunner

Sep 29 2009, 10:09

*memo-to-me: dont try to convince a programmer that he could make a better presentation of his work + dont say "easier to use". :D

Ok one last suggestion:
If you make updates highlight them on your DH ProperOverview site - something like: Kju'sgreatPROPERTweak (update/version, <insertdate>)

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 29 2009, 11:43

It is not a programmer case. It is someone doing this in his free time.
At the same time seeing little to none community / user contribution.
So I decided to spend my time in a compromise of usability and efficiency
for my needs.

You can find out about update by signing up on the feed of the activity page
best or/and news page for major releases.

DesertJedi

Sep 29 2009, 18:49

Please try GDT Mod Plants by HeinBloed and give him feedback. Kju, can you tell me what "vegetation" mods should not be used with HeinBloed's?

I'm currently using:

- Terrain Detail = Very Low
- SAP Clutter mod
- Proper Low Vegetation Mod

I'm thinking that HeinBloed's would be incompatible with the Proper mod?

BTW, thanks for your work/time. IMHO, the Proper "playability" mods are the most important ones for Arma 2.

.kju [PvPscene]

Sep 29 2009, 19:00

Proper Vegetation Mods contains modified versions of the five vegetation model container pbos:

plants2_Bush
plants2_Clutter
plants2_misc
plants2_Plant
plants2_Tree

The names tell you about their content obviously.

So you can load all of the low pbos or just one/some.
You can also combine them with the very low.

Important is to load only one of a given type.
Not: clutter low AND very low.

If none proper vegetation is loaded, the BI pbo is loaded.

Now HeinBloed's GDT Mod Plants modifies the very same five.
While I modified all in the same, did he take more time to tweak each pbo
and even each model/texture individually it seems.

I would have expected a better visual result for HeinBloed's version.

Most people so far report not as good FPS like the Proper low gives em.

Bottom line. It is up to you to try what fits you best.

---

Terrain detail very low already removes clutter anyway.
So both the clutter pbo from proper/gdt, nor the SAP is needed.

That said in MP the server sets the terrain detail for all.
(unless the mission or an addon allow setting it yourself)

Hitman

Oct 1 2009, 10:11

Hey Kju I didn't read trough the thread but here's a question:

Are you planning on making the Anims Fast Forward Transition to A2? That was the most best PROPER tweak in A1 and crucial to the game, in my opinion.

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 1 2009, 10:45

I am not sure, if it is necessary or meaningful. Instead I am doing single anims speed up
anims. So far released grenade lob and step over.

In the queue are stance and weapon switching.

For PvP play less getting exhausted by running/sprinting (aka less enhance weapon
sway), instead little more weapon sway even when fully recovered.

What anims/other aspect do you think need tweaking Hitman?

Hitman

Oct 1 2009, 11:01

For PvP play less getting exhausted by running/sprinting (aka less enhance weapon
sway), instead little more weapon sway even when fully recovered.

That sounds a good tweak also.

I don't know what you did to enchance the anim transition in A1 but that was essential for CQB play. I don't know any other way to decribe it other than the running to stop and to crouch was far more fluid. Also the sidestepping was alot better with the PROPER tweak. Basically all the movement animations were more fluid.

And I can't repeat enough how crucial this is. :)

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 1 2009, 15:41

Well there is transitions speed, anim speed and broken transitions.
If you can name them, I can look into them.

Solus SLX is said to have tweaked anims - you might wanna try it.

Dogmeat of Finland

Oct 1 2009, 15:45

I have been trying to download Terrain only Chernarus for days now and even made an account to dev-heaven but I keep getting the "404 not found" page.

Hitman

Oct 1 2009, 16:14

Well there is transitions speed, anim speed and broken transitions.
If you can name them, I can look into them.

Solus SLX is said to have tweaked anims - you might wanna try it.

I think it's the broken transitions mate, could also have something to do with the speed. I can't find any videos of it, that would surely clear things up. :(

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 1 2009, 17:52

Fixed links for Chernarus. Thanks Dogmeat of Finland!

neokika

Oct 1 2009, 17:58

Hello Kju, first I want to thank you for sharing your great work with the comunity!
Is there any problem with the PROPER mod file for buildings called buildings2_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER? When I put it On, some buildings like a warehouse in stary Sobor and for exemple, the factory and the sculpture in the town of Chernogorsk are really ugly, the warehouse dont even have windows or doors....Is this a known issue? if it is sorry....
When I take that file out, everything is OK!

Thanks

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 2 2009, 06:37

Yep it is. :)
From the wiki:

Report bad models

If you find a model with too low resolution LOD, like ugly looking on close distance
or missing parts of the object like walls, make a simple mission placing a soldier
unit in the editor look directly at the said object and attach the mission here:
Reduced model complexity - resolution LOD issues. Sample mission ticket (http://dev-heaven.net/issues/show/4383).

neokika

Oct 2 2009, 11:11

Tankbuster

Oct 2 2009, 21:14

Kju,
The commanders gun isn't stabilised in a lot of the MBTs. If you're in the tank as commander and want to let rip with the gun, the moment the gunner moves the turret, you aim goes to pot. Is this the sort of thing a PROPER mod might be able to fix?

edit hang on....
KeepCommanderViewOnTarget Gameplay C PROPER:
Is that it?

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 3 2009, 07:08

I guess so.

Tankbuster

Oct 5 2009, 16:16

Confirmed. That mod does indeed stabilise the commanders gun. Nice job, thanks.

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 13 2009, 13:25

Yay. Thankfully Sickboy fixed the formatting.
Now you can actually read the documentation online (http://dev-heaven.net/repositories/entry/proper-projects/addons/EasyFly_Planes_by_Celery_Gameplay_C_PROPER/readme_EasyFly_Planes_by_Celery_Gameplay_C_PROPER.txt).
(dummy acc: guest/guest)

http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects

Scruffy

Oct 13 2009, 17:42

Thank you very much for these addons. I don't use many, but can cherry pick what I like. MoveActionIconTextPositionToActionMenu was on my to-do list for my pack, but now I just use this and recommend your addons.

One question though, what do the "HDR" and "Shading Details" control? I guess HDR changes HDRPrecision=8; in the Arma2.cfg, but I remember Suma saying it doesn't change anything anymore. Either way, I can't see a difference with both. Shading doesn't seem to have the same effect as in Arma 1, at least not nearly as obvious or I'm just blind.

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 13 2009, 18:33

Shading details are called 'postFX=0;' in the arma2.cfg.
The default value is 2 or 3 (aka normal).
I didn't do much testing, yet it seems to give more FPS to use 0.

HDR is HDRPrecision right. Valid values are 8, 16 and 32.
I dont recall Suma saying that. You still may be right on both
accounts. Hopefully someone else can comment from testing himself. :P

For the action icon I have a few more tweaks .. just need to finish up
stuff .. like text only or completely hidden.

KeyCat

Oct 13 2009, 18:36

Lots of new goodies to test! Love your tweaks Kju and the way ppl can pick what they want to use..

Big thanks to you (and everyone else involved) for making and sharing!

/KC

Horus

Oct 13 2009, 21:25

Shading details are called 'postFX=0;' in the arma2.cfg.
The default value is 2 or 3 (aka normal).
I didn't do much testing, yet it seems to give more FPS to use 0.

Didn't shadingQuality=X is for shading details?

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 14 2009, 06:31

Ah yes I think you are right. Anyone remembers what postFX was. :P

MadDogX

Oct 14 2009, 10:18

Ah yes I think you are right. Anyone remembers what postFX was. :P
PostFX is post processing isn't it?

Horus

Oct 14 2009, 14:40

PostFX is post processing isn't it?
Yes and Kju when we can expect new version of CBA?

CBA addon is not compatible with latest ARMA2 version (1.04)!
You're replacing Functions module init.sqf with your own init_functionsmodule.sqf! While original file was updated, the one in CBA stays old. To ensure forward compatibility and prevent unintended errors, please find cleaner solution than altering official files.
Same for another files you're altering, if there are any.

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 14 2009, 19:06

I am not involved in CBA. :)

whisper

Oct 14 2009, 20:06

Is there any other dedicated server admin having issues with the PROPER.bikey?

I installed it on my key subfolder, and the dedicated server hangs up for long after saying the dedi launched and before saying the server identity is created.
There's like 2 minutes between the 2 messages (during which windows tells me the server process doesn't respond anymore).

Then, any player connecting will make the server crash?

Is there other people with the same issue, or is it my server only having something wrong?

Chunk3ym4n

Oct 20 2009, 05:21

Hey Kju could you make a mod that has all the nice looking post processing effects except for the motion blur?

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 20 2009, 08:10

Not possible from what I can tell.

Maybe via shader modification - no expertise in that area.

WYZe1

Oct 20 2009, 22:54

normally i would go through the whole thread to find out what download i should use here, but i just dont have the time today for that, so my question is, what should i download for the best performance and best look?

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 21 2009, 19:16

... forgot the most important one in terms of stutter issues:

structures_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/structures_Low_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z) - 218 MB
(1st Res LOD removed, 1st and last mipmap)

structures_VeryLow_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z (http://proper.arma-creations.com/download/structures_VeryLow_Visuals_R_PROPER.7z) - 78 MB
(1st two Res LOD removed, 1st two and last two mipmaps)

Untested. Feedback needed which objects look bad.
Please provide a simple sample mission standing in-front of the problematic object.

geloxo

Oct 23 2009, 19:26

Hi,

I just tested the Object drawing distance tweaks and the result is amazing. I got a smooth performance and a great gameplay because you can see action from far away, mainly when using optics.

This is a must have to get better balance between landscape and units in the scene :D

Congratulations and thanks for the job!

Cheers

ReconTeam

Oct 30 2009, 04:39

I just tried out your vegetation and building mods and they are amazing. So good that I think BI should incorporate them into their next patch to optimize the game.

tcp

Oct 30 2009, 05:24

I agree. Using the low plants and buildings makes the game so much smoother. No longer a headache with stuff popping all over the place.

ReconTeam

Oct 30 2009, 23:30

Anyway you could release keys for these mods allowing online play?

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 31 2009, 06:42

Key and sign files (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects#Key-and-sign-files)

Malick

Oct 31 2009, 13:07

Hello kju !

Thank you for these very nice addons : they now allow me to find some pleasure in playing Arma 2 ! Without them, it's slideshow party.

Regarding the "drawing distance fix", which is quite nice also, how do I need to alter the files if I want to increase/decrease the distance at which objects are shown ?

Thanks !

Malick

.kju [PvPscene]

Oct 31 2009, 14:09

Extract the pbo and play with the featureSize value and repack.

Mind you that the graphics setting 'object detail' also changes drawing distance (amount)
of objects.

CarlGustaffa

Oct 31 2009, 23:48

With 3 files per proper tweak, and a shitload of tweaks :) I find it very hard to download them. Is there any way of keeping an updated archive so we could get away with just one download?

ReconTeam

Nov 1 2009, 01:50

Hey Kju, where those two keys I found after clicking a download in that list the only ones I need? After I placed them in the key folder, I couldn't join certain servers anyway. All I am running all the vegetation and building mods. Am I missing something? I am not very familiar with the keys system in ArmA and ArmA 2. Does the server need to have some sort of key too?

.kju [PvPscene]

Nov 1 2009, 06:25

@<hidden> ReconTeam

Yes. The server admin needs to put the key on his server, for you to be able to join.
Not working well .. so hopefully you are playing on a server you know the admin.

As client you only need the pbo and the bisign file in the same folder.

@<hidden> Carl Gustaffa

Armaholic wanted to do this from what I recall.
The other option you have is to sync with public git repository of PROPER.

Mclan

Nov 1 2009, 10:40

;) A must have tweak mod! Many thanks!

ReconTeam

Nov 2 2009, 02:26

I have noticed a few buildings that with the your low-building mod appear blurry at very short distances, like as if you were looking at them from 1000 meters away. Mainly small sheds in stuff. For example in that town on the southeast of Utes, look at the shed to the north of the burnt-out Church.

Other wise both mods seem to work great, although I see the greatest FPS increase with the low-vegetation mod.

.kju [PvPscene]

Nov 2 2009, 05:58

Please read Report bad models (http://dev-heaven.net/wiki/proper-projects#Reduced-model-complexity).

NoRailgunner

Nov 3 2009, 09:39

Are you plan to change those green unit colors into better looking one eg. grey-black-white - less distracting?
What about reworking the briefing menu to a more believable one? Imho black text on white background is still today more eyefriendly and better to read. Thought it could be nice to have a menu where all people could setup the color and the HUD stuff... :bounce3:

.kju [PvPscene]

Nov 3 2009, 10:47

Yep. I have a white addon (WIP), yet it is ugly to find every spot in the configs.
Not much prio atm unfortunately. In the end one goal of PROPER is to educate people
in config modification to be able to do it themselves.

Unfortunately haven't seen really people get into it..

NoRailgunner

Nov 3 2009, 11:21

What about "Arma2 tweaking + tuning in a Nutshell". ;)

yet it is ugly to find every spot in the configs.
Arent BIS changing the design for OA maybe a dev can point us to the right configs? Bit strange that in 2009/2010 people arent able to change the menu + HUD appearance/design "on the fly". :confused:

.kju [PvPscene]

Nov 3 2009, 13:35

Like these?

Learn_from_the_configs (http://community.bistudio.com/wiki/PROPER:Mod#Learn_from_the_configs)
Addon_Configuration (http://community.bistudio.com/wiki/Category:ArmA:_Addon_Configuration)
Basic Config File (http://community.bistudio.com/wiki/User:Serc)

A real guide .. sounds like a good plan, yet I gave that up.
95% of the people aren't interested or dedicated - not their fault:
society made them that way.

It is not about the right config, yet the definitions are in many different classes.
Could it be done easier, yes - much without a lot effort, no.

jasonnoguchi

Nov 9 2009, 10:55

Does this low visual bush mod work with ArmA1? Having a VERY hard time with fps killing bushes. :(

.kju [PvPscene]

Nov 9 2009, 11:36

For a1 there is PROPER plants (http://www.armaholic.com/plug.php?e=search).

11_HARLEY_11

Nov 10 2009, 22:35

Thanks for the mods kju, just brilliant.

edit: if I have my settings already on low models, is there still a benefit to using the building lod mods? seeings as the top lods aren't being drawn anyway? (At least that's how I think it's working) Or does it work differently. Sorry if this has already been covered. searched but couldn't find.

.kju [PvPscene]

Nov 11 2009, 06:11

Even on low graphic settings, I think the engine uses the highest LOD.
You can confirm that by measuring FPS via fraps in ArmA2mark with and without.

Kroky

Nov 12 2009, 11:37

@<hidden>

Is there a proper module for changing the view inside the vehicles?
I mean to be able to double click on - and move the view inside the vehicle to a more rear position. Like it is possible with non scoped weapons already?

.kju [PvPscene]

Nov 12 2009, 12:48

Nope. Not yet. I think its doable, yet I see no real importance for it.

I will make a more OFP like FOV addon for both infantry and vehicles soon though.
Means way less zooming in.

Kroky

Nov 12 2009, 19:43

Nope. Not yet. I think its doable, yet I see no real importance for it.

I will make a more OFP like FOV addon for both infantry and vehicles soon though.
Means way less zooming in.

sounds good. Waiting for it.

mrcash2009

Nov 14 2009, 19:35

I cant login with guest/guest ... does it realy need a login at devheaven to download these tweaks?

.kju [PvPscene]

Nov 14 2009, 19:48

Unless you find a mirror, yes it does.
Just try again. Most likely someone else was logged in already.

Alex72

Nov 14 2009, 19:54

Kju, maybe not the best place to ask but since this kind of relates i just had a question.

Do you (or anyone else) think the latest beta (v60141) switches LOD's much more than before? Might be one of those spooky things with this games updates where i think something is happening when it in fact is not lol. But it feels like i see a lot of switching. A crazy example is one of those sandbag walls (low with small sacks in the editor) is changing its shape and textures 3 times when i move between 1-9 meters from it. 3 times within 10 meters feels a bit over done? Im no pro in this matter, but thanks to that and some other crazy switching i wondered if anyone else noticed anything.

And you being the mastermind here even have your own addons regarding this i thaught you would know if any. :)

Using your addons ofcourse though. Maybe they had some influence?

Thanks
Alex