New PC - Illogical Performance

[sandzibar]

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 GO 2.40GHz Quad Core CPU Overclocked to 3.00GHz
EVGA nForce 790 Ultra SLi (Socket LGA775) PCI-Express DDR3 Motherboard
OCZ 2GB PC2-10666 CAS7 (2x1GB) Dual Channel Kit (Overclocked at 1333MHz+)
2x NVIDIA 9800 GTX 512MB GDDR3 HDTV/Dual DVI (PCI-Express) Graphics Cards configured in SLI (Nvidia 175.16 drivers)
Xi-Fi Gamer sound card (latest updated drivers)
WinXP Pro (updated all the way to SP3)

Runs like a dog... OFPMark of 1800 in 1280x1024 http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif

Then randomly hardlocks if i change my Viewdistance above 3000 with High settings in Arma.

This thing should utterly spank it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif
Any ideas what could cause such amazingly poor performance? I think my old AMD3700 kits with an AGP card does better. Im at a complete loss here.
http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif

[sandzibar]

same arma settings, same res on old kit using the ArmaMark1.0 mission..

1st run: 1529
2nd run: 1585

compared to the new PC

1st run: 2317
2nd run: 1836 (wtf... lost 500pts after retrying mission?)

argfghgh

[Mr_Tea]

Sometimes overclocking produces illogical performance in games.
Have you tried it without overclocking?

[dwringer]

Perhaps there's a driver update you could download for your memory controller; other than that it could be any number of drivers that could be causing such a problem. Try without the overclocking as above, and if that doesn't work search for all the drivers you can find to update paying special attention to drivers for your chipset/motherboard/etc.

Of course I've had memory controller issues in the past that never got resolved until I upgraded to Windows Vista, but that's neither here nor there, just an indicator of how frustrating it is ;p

[sandzibar]

Well the pc was brought from overclockers.co.uk and is overclocked by them (meant to be stable before it leaves) so id hope that that wasnt the reason. Ill try to set it to stock settings i guess.. but kinda defeats the purpose of the machine.

Im not sure about mem controller updates? would that be under the nforce 790i mobo drivers? as those are upto date aswell http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif

cheers for the suggestions so far guys. Its really annoying shelling out alot of cash for it to be less reliable and only a bit more capable than my old pc. *sigh*

[Mr_Tea]

Look if there is a newer BIOS version for your board, that could change a lot.

[ArmaVidz]

Sometimes overclocking produces illogical performance in games.
Have you tried it without overclocking?
I had this very issue with my Core2Quad. It was overclocked to 3.2Ghz, temps were good, voltage was good, performance was crap. Once I rolled it back to 2.4Ghz, Armed Assault performed waay better.

You could try setting stock voltage/FSB/Mhz for the parts you have. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[sandzibar]

Ok dropped it down to stock fsb of 1066, 2.4ghz cpu speed and got the following ArmaMark scores:

1st: 1857
2nd: 1563

That last score is worse than my 2 year old PC... Im now crying into my beer like a small child. This all just defies any kind of logic. And why the hell does the 2nd run of the test give such a fall in performance.. it 'should' get better. Did on my old one.

edit: ran 3dMark06 to try and make myself feel better.. got 16797 - which as far as I can tell - is a fairly respectable score.
The problem def lies with Arma and my hardware.. and not just my new hardware in general. All other games ive tried so far absolutely fly. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif

[oChaos.DNJ]

Try running without SLI. ArmA doesnt support SLI I believe. But also what about your PSU ?

[sandzibar]

Tried running with and without SLI mode.. no difference really that I could see. Possible slightly fewer hardlockups when changing viewdistance.

PSU is a Tagan 800W.

[Mr_Tea]

So what about the BIOS, have you checked for an newer version?

[sandzibar]

So what about the BIOS, have you checked for an newer version?
Seems theres a few other using this mobo with similar issues with freezes. So it might help that issue. Not sure about the crap arma performance though. Ill give it a go. Fingers crossed etc.

[Mr_Tea]

Most probably there was software delivered together with that mobo, that let you update the BIOS from within windows.
Should be very easy to update than.

[[DirTyDeeDs]-Ziggy-]

I empathize with your situation. I hope you gain the performance that you paid for with some community help. Alas, I cannot help, but I achieved 4k ArmA mark with my rig and it appears to be a much less capable machine. sorry http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

[sandzibar]

Well this morning I flashed the BIOS with latest update.. new ArmaMarks:

1) 2695 - woo. slight improvement. still f**king sh*te though.

edit: so the uaz test gave me an average of 29fps at a 2500 viewdistance at 1280x1024 (not even using Vhigh settings either). thats quite amazingly shockingly bad. EVE and CoD4 blister along at 120fps+ all at max settings at that res.

then 2nd run crashed the PC at the Tank scene. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif

Ive obviously offended some omnipotent deity at some point and this is their idea of revenge. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/icon_rolleyes.gif

Arma either hates my:
core2quad cores
9800GTX GFX cards
or my 790i Mobo

[MadDogX]

Have you checked your temperatures?

Perhaps grab a program like SpeedFan and see how hot stuff gets while you're running ArmAmark. The problem could be related to temperatures.

[sandzibar]

Nope temp is fine http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif Larger fans in this thing than on a russian Zubr (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zubr/Pomornik_%28LCAC%29) class hovercraft. Plus wouldnt that also make the system unstable generally, and not just in Arma surely?

[Sickboy]

I'll try some ArmA Mark aswell soon.
I dont know how representative this arma mark is though.

About your FPS in other games; awesome, but useless.

About temperatures; high temps usually result in corruption / crashes. If the devices throttle back it can also cause slowdowns. No problems at other games / general usage, doesnt exclude temperature problems though.

FPS: Maybe you are limited by V-Sync settings?

DDR3 Memory at 1066 with CAS7, overclocked to 1333; How high is the CAS at this speed? Afaik ArmA benefits from good memory performance.

No experience with the last new Nvidia chipsets, however, my experience is that the X38 (and X48) kicks-all-ass http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

My own specs:
Core2Quad Q6600 @<hidden> 3.33ghz
Asus Maximus Formula X38 (fsb 1666mhz)
8GB DDR2-1066 CAS5
8800GTX 768mb
Vista X64 SP1

Runs like a dream, will post arma marks when tested.

[sandzibar]

cheers sickboy. im off down the pub to drown my sorrows for a bit. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

ill look into the CAS setting when i get back, and try disabling vsync.. though id be suprised if it was that. theres some sort of epic bottleneck somewhere.

[Yoma]

I get +- 4600 armamark with E6750 Core duo at stock speed(2.66GHZ) + 8800GTX 768MB+ 6GB RAM on VISTAx64

I must add that i have very few settings on high, none on very high.
VD: 2500
high :shadows shaders,blood
normal: textures, AA, aniso,objects
low: postprocessing
very low: terrain

So what you get sounds bad indeed.
Since you use xp: i found that the last drivers where NOT the best for my system.
Have you tried installing older vga drivers yet?
I&#39;d download the 163.75_forceware_winxp_32bit_international_whql drivers,
remove the current driver, install the 163.75 and then try running it without SLI first.

Allso: did you do a real install of arma or did you just copy the arma files and installed it via a registry key?

[sandzibar]

fresh install of arma. then QG. then the 1.14 patch.

I dont think those early drivers support series 9 geforce gpu&#39;s http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif

tried vsunc off.. slight fps boost as was expected but armamark still 2600.. when it should be 4000+

still hardlocks the system lots (even had this happen for the first time in CoD4 too). After searching the web more there are lots of angry rants about nvidia&#39;s shit drivers for 9800&#39;s and SLI&#39;s mobo. Im hopping they release something that makes my new toy playable soon
http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/mad_o.gif

[SWAT_BigBear]

Don&#39;t fret about ArmA Mark.
I do not know where the conflict is,
Vista.....64?
SLI,
2X2 cpu&#39;s,
who knows.
I gave up on ArmA Mark, seems just under 2500 is all I seen a year ago.
My game runs clean and smooth with higher video settings in game, and the Nvidia CP set to "Performance".

[kklownboy]

i have a 9800 gx2, so i run Arma with SLI. When you say you see no real diff between single and dual, then i would think your not getting SLI to work.
When i use just the default arma.exe i can not get SLI to work, even with it selected in the CP, with any choices of AFR, or SPF...
Sooo i rename the .exe to fear.exe and its good to go.
Had the same issue with Crossfire. Had to rename the .exe.

[Sickboy]

i have a 9800 gx2, so i run Arma with SLI. When you say you see no real diff between single and dual, then i would think your not getting SLI to work.
 When i use just the default arma.exe i can not get SLI to work, even with it selected in the CP, with any choices of AFR, or SPF...
 Sooo i rename the .exe to fear.exe and its good to go.
 Had the same issue with Crossfire. Had to rename the .exe.
I always understood that ppl who turned on SLI (which to me would seem using your method alike), had terrible performance.

Im very happy to hear you have way better results, good to know it does actually work http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[kklownboy]

The card runs great. Better success if you use v-sync and set up a profile in the nvidia control pane.
I am using the current signature 175.16 and 32bitSP3. There is a Arma Demo profile that comes with the current drivers as well as many others. I had no success with that or a Arma named .exe.
But fear.exe has been good for me on CF with my old 1950xtx&#39;s and v1.04 and then on to my 2900xt&#39;s v1.05-v109. I used hl2.exe first then the Catalyst drivers that patched the memory leak made hl2.exe no good. Went to fear , the 2900s would dbl my frames 25 to 50 in Crossfire, but you would still tank in the trees. The low dips in the teens is certain death. The 9800gx2 is like having QF 2900xt&#39;s. In one slot.

[kklownboy]

Don&#39;t fret about ArmA Mark.
I do not know where the conflict is,
Vista.....64?
SLI,
2X2 cpu&#39;s,
who knows.
I gave up on ArmA Mark, seems just under 2500 is all I seen a year ago.
My game runs clean and smooth with higher video settings in game, and the Nvidia CP set to "Performance".
Yeah i think Arma_Mark and dual GPU are borked. I think it turns off the Vertical sync.... And is not at all what the game is like... not a true measure of the current game. Was good back in the 1.01-.03 time frame. Well for a black screen with numbers

[Yoma]

Well maybe Armamark doesn&#39;t work to good with sli, but i must say that it does report what i feel ingame.

(If i put my settings up, the mark goes down and so does the ingame performance when really playing)

Also armamark seems to change with my hardware quite realisticly. That said, of course it&#39;s not a real accurate benchmark, but on my machine it does say something.

[sandzibar]

well to anyone interested the troublesome PC has been sent back for a stern talking to by the people who built it.. hopefully it will come back not sucking donkey balls. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

[Yoma]

Keep us posted. Let&#39;s just hope they don&#39;t run a 3dmark on it and send it back noting: 3DMark works so it&#39;s okidoki.

[Michael_Wittman]

Im on the ball. And for all that says arma is not supported by SLI please feel free to visit SLI supported games (http://uk.slizone.com/object/slizone2_game_uk.html)

and kindly STFU.

[kklownboy]

Im on the ball. And for all that says arma is not supported by SLI please feel free to visit SLI supported games (http://uk.slizone.com/object/slizone2_game_uk.html)

and kindly STFU.
there are allot of unsupported sli/ cf games... your point? What i am saying you have to fool the driver its another game, a supported game to get the full dual gpu. And in the current drivers from Nvidia 175.16 XP It even has Arma Demo profile....

[sandzibar]

Well got the PC back from the vendor where they ran some tests and seems like they messed with the voltages etc (though oddly they didnt supply any info on what &#39;exactly&#39; theyve done..) Framerate seems improved yay. BUT.


..still crashes in arma anywhere from 3mins to 30mins into a MP game. And because it hardlocks I dont see anyway of getting a log of what causes it..

Only crashes in arma so far. Everything else works great.

Im so sad http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif

[Supernova]

Flash to P05 bios. Also its a bad idea to buy a pre-built system you should buy it you&#39;reself and until you understanding overclocking dont overclock leave it at stock.

[sandzibar]

did that on page 1... all the other systems ive had have been ones ive put together from components ordered. couldnt be arsed this time and this is what happens.

seems the intel q6600 I had before has magically turned into a q9450 yorkfield now... I guess thats what they did to try and solve the issues.

[echo1]

seems the intel q6600 I had before has magically turned into a q9450 yorkfield now... I guess thats what they did to try and solve the issues.
An unusual solution. I wouldnt say swapping CPU would do much. Sounds to me like ArmA and SLi refusing to get along well together.

[sandzibar]

aye I think id have to agree..

id say it was going to be one of these causing the issues:

Arma + 9800GTX
Arma + Creative XiFi
790i mobo + Creative XiFi
790i mobo + 9800GTX

or a combination.. my only hope now is that new drivers for the soundcards,motherboard, and graphic cards will fix it.. but that could take months knowing nvidia :/

or some magical new Arma patch where Marek will state "fixed issues with 9 series SLI&#39;d nvidia cards crashing PCs and increased their performance 200%".

i wont be holding my breath http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

[Supernova]

There has always been the 790i (reference [apparently non-reference are fine]) problem with X-Fi although I don&#39;t remember exactly if it was most prominent in XP or VISTA. What they did was barely overclock it , should have spent the money on a better CPU than paying for an overclock. It could be a overclocked memory problem.

[sandzibar]

that seems to be the 2nd post in a row where you are trying to call me an idiot... why dont you go elsewhere and &#39;help&#39; eh? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/icon_rolleyes.gif im really not in the mood.

[Supernova]

Maybe you can try the XFX 790i , it is possible that there might be some change or you could turn to the Striker II extreme. Haven&#39;t you considered it could also possibly be a memory problem ?. I didn&#39;t call you an idiot but from 2.40 to 2.66ghz thats nothing for an overclock , and I overclock so I know what im saying.

[sandzibar]

eh?

original setup was a q6600 2.4ghz oc&#39;d to 3ghz
new one is q9450 2.66ghz oc&#39;d to 3ghz

theyve given me a better chip for free.. ok so in proportion its not oc&#39;d as much as the old one.. but... so what? doenst change the fact that the system is running at 3ghz. which is what they advertised it as.

the problem is that arma crashes.. just arma.. no other games (CoH,CoD4 and EVE).. 3mark06 doesnt have any issues either when benchmarking. I tihnk ill try removing the soundcard and drivers again.

[gL33k]

Well this morning I flashed the BIOS with latest update.. new ArmaMarks:

1) 2695 - woo. slight improvement. still f**king sh*te though.

edit: so the uaz test gave me an average of 29fps at a 2500 viewdistance at 1280x1024 (not even using Vhigh settings either). thats quite amazingly shockingly bad. EVE and CoD4 blister along at 120fps+ all at max settings at that res.

then 2nd run crashed the PC at the Tank scene. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif

Ive obviously offended some omnipotent deity at some point and this is their idea of revenge. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/icon_rolleyes.gif

Arma either hates my:
core2quad cores
9800GTX GFX cards
or my 790i Mobo
DRIVERS and / or hardware.

for sli, use nhancer and test all sli profile. you might be able to find the appropriate sli method.
Also , disable vsync , or use D3Doverride for force tripple buffering.

but before all that , choose well yor drivers , and stresstest your cpu and memory.
never , ever, start anything else than stresstest with a new computer.

my 2 cents .

[echo1]

aye I think id have to agree..

id say it was going to be one of these causing the issues:

Arma + 9800GTX
Arma + Creative XiFi
790i mobo + Creative XiFi
790i mobo + 9800GTX

or a combination.. my only hope now is that new drivers for the soundcards,motherboard, and graphic cards will fix it.. but that could take months knowing nvidia :/

or some magical new Arma patch where Marek will state "fixed issues with 9 series SLI&#39;d nvidia cards crashing PCs and increased their performance 200%".

i wont be holding my breath  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif
I have a Creative X-Fi, and it causes me no end of shit. I intend to replace it with an Asus Xonar at some stage, but till then, I have it removed as it almost never works. It also used to be responsible for a lot of BSODs I had. A lot of angry people complaining about Creative&#39;s substandard drivers seems to confirm that Im not the only one. Try taking it out and seeing how it goes.

[Yoma]

Well my Creative XFI-SomeLameGamer-Edition, doesn&#39;t give me any problems at all.
(E6750 on P35 + 6GB RAM+8800GTX)
So i don&#39;t really think it&#39;s Arma VS X-Fi.

It&#39;s a good thought to remove "unneeded" hardware and overclocks and to test piece by piece.

I found that "other games work good" is not allways a good reference, i can overclock my cpu and when running Arma it will crash but running Crysis works just fine.

That said, you&#39;re probably not an idiot and know this allready... http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

[Sickboy]

Have you tried another OpenAL release?
I&#39;ve had the experience that X-fi drivers <-> OpenAL Releases, can cause issues. It was especially under Vista, however.
Hope it might help you find the right direction.

[sandzibar]

ok. tried updating OpenAL, new XFi beta drivers, turned off CMSS-3D, and completely turned off SLI - not just under the arma nvidia profile.

No crashes (2 hours session on GOL server with warfare) and arma mark is up to around 4000.

happy pants http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/yay.gif

cheers for all the ideas and assistance chaps.

[echo1]

Try reversing that process to see what&#39;s causing it. Hopefully not the SLI http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

@<hidden>:
It could be to do with my motherboard, Im not too sure. But a cousin of mine has constant problems with his Audigy 2 killing itself at random. I also had a PC a few years ago with a 51 Live that caused a fair few crashes. Therefore I have little faith in Creative&#39;s cards.

[Yoma]

Ah those early SBLive cards i remember those, those were indeed bitches. Crashed my old pc countless times.