Virtualbattlefieldsystem.com

[Ironsight]

The Coalesent VBS site got updated with a lot of new impressive things.

Take a look! (http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/index.html)

First responder module:

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/first/cocSS9.jpg >100kb

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/first/cocSS13.jpg >100kb

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/first/cocSS8.jpg >100kb

U.S. Army/National Guard:

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/ngb/ngbSS3.jpg >100kb

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/ngb/ngbSS7.jpg >100kb

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/ngb/ngbSS9.jpg

More on the new site http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Raptor]

cool update. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Rainbow]

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/7796/image59yo.jpg

"Look for press releases regarding VBS2 and other VBS developments to be posted in the near future." (http://www.virtualbattlespace.com/news.htm)  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Fork122]

Wow, awesome stuff, those cities are amazing http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Chipper]

its hard to think that this is flashpoint engine! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/notworthy.gif

[TheBladeRoden]

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif I wish I had money

[Placebo]

Please don't hotlink images over 100kb in size, you've been around long enough to know that.

[Ironsight]

Please don't hotlink images over 100kb in size, you've been around long enough to know that.
Sorry Placebo. From most pics, image data was unavailable and they seemed under, or near 100kb to me. It won't happen again http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

[Sanctuary]

These screenshots look really impressive.

[spoock]

big city in OFP 1.99 (VBS1)? Impresive? How I must have PC's HW for this modul? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

[Heatseeker]

Looks huge, impressive though it seems to focus more on the functional aspect rather than visuals, has expected http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .

[Rainbow]

big city in OFP 1.99 (VBS1)?...
2.07 http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

[Daniel]

Am I right in deducing that whatever VBS has, Armed Assault will be better? Cause that would make sense, and at the moment, a lot of Armed Assault stuff (such as units/vehicles) doesn't match up to VBS quality in my opinion. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

[DBR_ONIX]

If they leave things out for ArmA, to leave in VBS1 only, thats just plain stupidity..
The main thing BI will make money from it ArmA.. If you piss of loads of people and don't include any decent new features, you'll lose money.. VBS1, as is releated a lot, IS NOT A GAME.. Surely a organistaion using the tool, are less likely to want/need the new features.

Erm, that's probobaly not worded right.. But in super-short : ArmA's feature list will impress more people than VBS1's feature list will impress millatry training organisers http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
- Ben

[JdB]

The main thing BI will make money from it ArmA.. If you piss of loads of people and don't include any decent new features, you'll lose money..
As BIS has stated ArmA will be an expansion with some engine tweaks. By following the screens (which doesn't say everything of course) the only real improvement I see is the normal mapping that is used. The units that can be seen have already been done better by OFP mods. The obvious thing then would be to include alot of engine improvement/additions. As BIS mentioned already that the total engine overhaul won't happen until "Game 2", I'd be more cautious about calling ArmA ''great'' (or anything similar), and having (too) high hopes about it.

And what is so special about this (http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/ngb/ngbSS9.jpg) for example? It has already been done much better in OFP.

[DBR_ONIX]

You gave me another idea thing..
If you don't add new features into ArmA, a lot less people will buy it.. People will think "Meh, it's just the same as OFP, and OFP is 1/3 the price.."
- Ben

[major gandhi]

I assume BIS will include a lot of new stuff in Armed Assault but we'll see no modells from VBS1 and no new engine features that may be shown on some VBS1 pics or vids. I think Armed Assault is really overhyped.

Btw what VBS1 offers concerning "Military Operations Other Than War" is really impresive. Here it comes clear what a "professional mod team" can make out of the ofp engine http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

*

Arms Control
*

Combating Terrorism
*

DoD Support to Counterdrug Operations
*

Enforcement of Sanctions and/or Maritime Intercept Operations
*

Enforcing Exclusion Zones
*

Ensuring Freedom of Navigation and Overflight
*

Humanitarian Assistance

*

Nation Assistance / Support to Counterinsurgency
*

Noncombatant Evacuation Operations
*

Peace Operations
*

Protection of Shipping
*

Recovery Operations
*

Show of Force Operations
*

Support to Insurgency

[Heatseeker]

I assume BIS will include a lot of new stuff in Armed Assault but we'll see no modells from VBS1 and no new engine features that may be shown on some VBS1 pics or vids. I think Armed Assault is really overhyped.
If that was the case it wouldnt be moving to the improved ARMA engine now would it? I think ARMA will introduce alot more improvements than just better models, textures and scripting comands.


Quote[/b] ]Combating Terrorism

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif .

[major gandhi]

[ig]http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/first/cocSS14.jpg[/img]

[ig]http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/first/cocSS12.jpg[/img]>100kb

this looky really interesting, I'm wondering if the gunner/cargo is always in this position or if he moves into this position with an animation. That's something I already thought about in connection to a whinch-function. if it's possible to include a real whinchmaster, who moves into positon when the script is activated, holds the cable and when the person in the hoist is at the level of the helicopter gets the person into the heli. I don't understand much of scripts so would it bes possible to realize that with the corresponding animations?

[edit: sorry for the image-thing]

[4 IN 1]

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/first/cocSS14.jpg

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/first/cocSS12.jpg

this looky really interesting, I'm wondering if the gunner/cargo is always in this position or if he moves into this position with an animation. That's something I already thought about in connection to a whinch-function. if it's possible to include a real whinchmaster, who moves into positon when the script is activated, holds the cable and when the person in the hoist is at the level of the helicopter gets the person into the heli. I don't understand much of scripts so would it bes possible to realize that with the corresponding animations?
its more like to be join with the vehical imporvment we saw few month b4(the video show that you can stand in APC/Aircraft)

and i am happy to see such thing

*starts doing man maths* http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif
i might got that much of money, and sure as hell not going to waste this great pic of work, but its goin to be a huuuuge blood loss for me(and maybe some "real" blood loss from my mother/father) http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

but then*voice in my head* just $6000 HKD its just $6000 HKD
i can affort it i can.............. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif

[Placebo]

major gandhi don't hotlink images over 100kb please.

[shinRaiden]

You do need to keep in mind that modules such as VIMS and the NGB pack that are exclusively developed by Coalescent are not publically available, and are only marketed directly to agency procurement channels, and only in North America.

In contrast to high-end simulators, or live training exercises, VBS is very affordable. And like OFP, VBS does not provide any of the items listed in a prior post, rather it provides a flexible framework so that if you wish do train in such activities, the capability and functionality is there with minimal or no field modification required.


Quote[/b] ]
"As BIS stated..."



Quote[/b] ]
"As BIS mentioned..."


VBS development and management - while licensed and coordinated with BIS - is handled by BIA on a day-to-day basis. There is technology exchange back and forth, but project roadmaps, support, and development work is fairly independent in most regards. So there may be things in ArmA that won't be in VBS, and things in VBS that won't be in ArmA.

A case in point is that Campaign functionality was removed in VBS, as nearly all military or agency usage is in instructor-led MP sessions. It's a totally different way of doing things. In OFP we're accustomed to editing the guts out to our heart's content, the target audience for VBS has to be told when to touch the mouse and when not to etc. Related to that is a tweak in the MP setup, where the instructor can lock players into slots, so all the role assignment can be strictly top-down by-the-book.

Obviously changes such as these are not at all suitable for the OFP gaming environment. BIA and BIS both have their shared and differing priorities, and both OFP and VBS have done well in their respective markets.

[Heatseeker]

Quote[/b] ]749175 requests since Tuesday 18 May, 2004
This number seems to indicate the amount of module requests on VBS1 online shop, is this a typo or is vbs1 really doing better than OPF did http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/rofl.gif .
630€ :11 products = average 57.27x749175=42905252.€ - tax cuts, production and development costs, etc..
No greedy publisher cut either, just some neat looking addons on a 4 year old tweaked graphics engine. If the numbers are/were real BIA would only need there military contracts for free, impressive product advertising imo http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif .
Im wondering how much BIA charges private military customers for specific modules and maps based on topografic/satellite data, etc. It seems the civilian customers arent getting much simulation technology but do represent a big slice % of income http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/rofl.gif .

[major gandhi]

I think it's the number of people visiting the website.

[0wl]

Looks nice, i'll have to look into this some more thanx! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Hornet85]

when i get the money for this it will be on its way to me http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

will only lake like 10 years or some thing http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif

hope ArmAs will have alot of the futures that VBS1 have then i dont need to save money for it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/thumbs-up.gif

[Daniel]

What does BIA stand for?

Hope Armed Assult comes with "walk around" on vehicles like VBS. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif

[Placebo]

Daniel @<hidden> Oct. 24 2005,12:53)]What does BIA stand for?
Bohemia Interactive Australia

[Rainbow]

Cool update http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif
Link (http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots02.html)

[Ironsight]

Cool update http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif
Link (http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots02.html)
Me wants that Stryker. But I guess the commercial US army module will be much better judging from the quality of the earlier released video http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

EDIT:
This Baghdad WIP satelite shot looks sooooo cool (http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/ngb/ngbSS1.jpg)

[Bonko the Sane]

one thing the vbs people could learn from the ofp community...how to take screenshots, and what AntiAliasing is for http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

[mchide]

Bohemia Interactive or Colascent are not cheating users with edited pictures, like other companyes.

[ExtracTioN]

And that is a good thing to not show edited pictures just how it looks ingame http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif
I think the VBS1 engine is updated to not lag with such big city&#39;s and objects I dont think they have builded a city that huge just for screenshots only I know for sure that it runs very smootly.
I wish those VIMS and NGB modules will come worldwide to everyone avaible to bad to hear now that it is not avaible to public now http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

[shinRaiden]

In regards to that Baghdad map, I&#39;m curious though to see what the poly&#39;s look like up close. Dunno if it&#39;s just me, or are the grey buildings untextured?

Also, since the engine map texture count limit was unchanged in VBS1, the maximum area that you can use aerial imaging for is a 22x22 cell square, or 1.1km x 1.1km.

New Special Offer promotion for international customers at Virtualbattlespace.com (http://virtualbattlespace.com/store/product_info.php?cPath=22&products_id=41).

[major gandhi]

Special offer looks interesting at first sight, but some more interesting packs instead of the ones included (Animal-pack&#33;, Observer&#33; ) would be better.


Btw does someone know if there&#39;ll be a VBS-version (VBS2?) that&#39;ll include the improvements of ArmA?

[sv5000]

I think people are reading to much into ArmA.... http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif

These screenshots look great, looks like i have to visit the shop for more modules  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/pistols.gif

I only hope that BIA will punch these out for non NA buyers

"And what is so special about this for example? It has already been done much better in OFP."

Lt Hunter..please show me a map that is this well detailed, so i can d/l it

[JdB]

Lt Hunter..please show me a map that is this well detailed, so i can d/l it
When comparing islands, you also need to compare their costs.

Bahadur (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/news/pics/sectionpics/Bahadur.jpg)

SandyRock Island (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/news/pics/sectionpics/SandyRockIsland.jpg)

AfghanEveron (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/news/pics/sectionpics/AghanEveron.jpg)

HomeLand (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/news/pics/sectionpics/HomeLand.jpg)

Torment valley (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/index.php?showthis=8805&newlang=eng)

Saint Remý (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/index.php?showthis=7172)

All great islands, all available to download free of charge. Also, there is Tonal, but it seems to lag for a lot of people, so I won&#39;t mention it here with pics.

The Baghdad island is more detailed, at a cost of yet another &#036;50-&#036;100. Not to mention the Core module you need which weighs in at about &#036;150 or more in case of &#39;&#39;special&#39;&#39; offers.

Furthermore, with some cleaver pics, you can make any island look good. Also, that &#39;&#39;satellite&#39;&#39; picture looks more like it is from a UAV, then from a satellite http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif

[oyman]

those m1a1s look bad http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif


those cities look cool though, some of the buildings are untextured http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

but i guess they still working on it

[Rudedog]

FYI,

Those pics are of the Coalescent US Army Pack, not the BIA USArmy pack being made by us. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

[Ironsight]

FYI,

Those pics are of the Coalescent US Army Pack, not the BIA USArmy pack being made by us. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif
To guote myself

Quote[/b] ]Me wants that Stryker. But I guess the commercial US army module will be much better judging from the quality of the earlier released video http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif

[spoock]

200 dollars? waw, but I havent money. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/icon_rolleyes.gif
I wait for Arma

[sv5000]

Thanks for those Lt Hunter, I only had one of them

[major gandhi]

FYI,

Those pics are of the Coalescent US Army Pack, not the BIA USArmy pack being made by us. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif
Btw do you plan to include a CH47D into your pack? (I know there&#39;s the old BIS one but it isn&#39;t really up to date)

[Heatseeker]

those m1a1s look bad  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif


those cities look cool though, some of the buildings are untextured http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

but i guess they still working on it
This is problably VBS1 proving itself has a tool rather than a game, like functionality vs aesthetics http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif .
Because from a training perspective having very detailed models and textures adds little to what it is supposed to do, and considering the massive size of those cities it seems they have focused more on size and functionality rather than pretty graphics obviously, problably also has a compromise due to the performance limitations of drawing all those buildings too. I wouldnt be surprised if alot of what the military orders looks like this because sims arent made of cool looking, pretty addons http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .

[brataccas]

anyone noticed this:

VBS1 (trees)

http://www.virtualbattlefieldsystem.com/screenshots/ngb/ngbSS16.jpg

Armed assault (trees)

http://ofp.gamezone.cz/news/pics2/aa_shot2.jpg


spot the differance&#33; http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif

[ExtracTioN]

Armed Assault trees have bumpmap textures VBS1 version does not have bumpmap textures http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

[MattXR]

Yes ArmA trees look better quality

[Ebud]

Terrain Pack2 Palm (http://www.vbs1.net/screenshots/tp2/tp2SS7.jpg)

They look the same to me. I know there may be bumpmaps on the AA tree but I just don&#39;t see it.

[Placebo]

This thread is not here for discussing VBS versus ArmA, please stay ontopic http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Nephilim]

afaik arma will support bumps
but i dont care cuz it makes things appear like wrapped in plastic http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif

vbs1 has high res textures and taht looks even better then any stupid bump or normal map...

[Heatseeker]

afaik arma will support bumps
but i dont care cuz it makes things appear like wrapped in plastic  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif

vbs1 has high res textures and taht looks even better then any stupid bump or normal map...
I have to agree, all those bump, normal, specular whatever dont look real or sharp enough for OPF&#39;s/VBS engine, a sharp photorealistic texture will always have a more authentic and natural feel and look imo. I cant imagine the amount of work applying several layers of textures on a huge game like flashpoint just to make it look cartoonish and run like an old dog, some improvements on metal surfaces maybe but for the most VBS1 textures look amazing to me. Adding improved/better lighting should make it look amazing http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/notworthy.gif .

[Hellfish6]

Uh... please keep the chatter limited to VBS, not graphical standards or ArAs graphics. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Heatseeker]

I just noticed that not only BIA has put a special offer available including the core plus some packs but that some addon pack prices have dropped considerably.
VBS1 module pack online store (http://virtualbattlespace.com/store/index.php?cPath=21&osCsid=0f4ed1fb3880e0dbfa2e9e6f514a0ed7)
People can get the Special offer VBS1 core (including special forces, animal pack, terrain1 and observer3), both ADF packs, terrain2, opfor and marine packs for 346.07€. I might have considered it if this was its price when it came out http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .

Ofcourse the price will still climb with future packs such has convoy thingy, US army, terrain3 and others when these are released plus a VBS2 anouncement is sort of.. expected http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif .

Still, seems like a good time to buy it, i wonder if it suffers from the same HW/SW compatbility and performance problems found in current flashpoint game  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif .

edit: i might ask these questions at the VBS1 forums to prevent further off topic discussion and forum violence here..

[gandalf the white]

I wonder if VBS1 users get a new engine (that supports DirectX / fixes "ofp bugs" or will have to pay another &#036;200 dollars to improve an engine that can be surpassed in terms of complexity with an Xbox



afaik arma will support bumps
but i dont care cuz it makes things appear like wrapped in plastic http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif

vbs1 has high res textures and taht looks even better then any stupid bump or normal map...
I have to agree, all those bump, normal, specular whatever dont look real or sharp enough for OPF&#39;s/VBS engine, a sharp photorealistic texture will always have a more authentic and natural feel and look imo. I cant imagine the amount of work applying several layers of textures on a huge game like flashpoint just to make it look cartoonish and run like an old dog, some improvements on metal surfaces maybe but for the most VBS1 textures look amazing to me. Adding improved/better lighting should make it look amazing http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/notworthy.gif .
@<hidden>:

With all respect to your knowledge in modelling, wich part of this looks plastified (http://doom3net.d3files.com/screenshots/shot00070.jpg)?

Technology is advancing, bumpmappings are rendered differently for each engine.

@<hidden>:

Bumpmappings makes you see detail that is not modelled into the model, it is a way to save your videocard from rendering X thousand polygons. to compare:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v297/15179/Other/behold.jpg

I wonder what you could like to see, the left model (wich double the texture quality and tripple the polygon count to match the right one) , or the cartoonish GPU-unfriendly right model. (enhanced only by a extra texture layer)


<span style='font-size:27pt;line-height:100%'>FIRST ONE TO CALL BUMPMAPPING OILY GETS IT IN THE REAR FROM ME&#33;</span>
( /&#92; Go for it Jennifer, make my day http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif )

[ShuyaNanahara]

now now deniz, you aint gonna get that lucky http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif ..at least not today...maybe not even in this life time, and i like bump mapping it really does make things look alot nicer..wrapped in plastic?..dont know about that jen, i mean it would entirely depend on the engine vs the skill of the texture artists http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

[Chipper]

bump mapping looks "oily" http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif

[gandalf the white]

bump mapping looks "oily" http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif
Holy schmuck that was rough, I guess the bumpmaps I used for lubrication weren&#39;t as oily as I was told they were http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif .

Either way, it depends on the engine, and I hope there will be some examples on how bumpmaps look in VBS1

EDIT: removed Arma from above sentence http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

[Kegetys]

I do not find the lighting on that Doom 3 shot to be realistic at all, and even in most of the Game2 shots the lighting looks quite wrong. In real life materials reflect light, so when a light ray hits a surface it lits other surfaces around it. This "radiosity" effect is missing from those fancy bumpmapping effects game developers seem to love today, which creates the unrealistic "plastic" look. Also, for example with skin light tends to pass through the skin and make the skin "glow" which removes strong highlights and shadows.

The only solution to this (imo.) is to tone down those fancy effects, add static ambient lighting and do better textures. The video cards today are nowhere near the capability to render realistic lighting in real time so its better to be done statically in the textures.

[Heatseeker]

Quote[/b] ]Bumpmappings makes you see detail that is not modelled into the model, it is a way to save your videocard from rendering X thousand polygons.

I prefer having my videocard rendering x thousand poligons and photorealistic textures on a game engine that is so remarcable that it can do it on open, complex environments with a decent amount of units interacting simultaniously and all this while maintaining decent performance. This is the reality of the BIS engine, performance doesnt drop when 5 units apear on the screen inside a squary/boxy level, bumpmapping and normal mapping wont save your memory of loading all those textures either http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .

Technicaly VBS1 may not be considered has advanced but it does provides realistic, sharp looking visuals, higher amounts of detail in both quality and quantity while new gen games relly more on textures and efects, if you look closely all modeling work in these games (units, environments, decorations, etc) look quite low on poly count (squary) and are more demanding.

Fact is VBS1 stuff looks much more "real", problably runs alot better, is less demanding and draws alot more than any other game engine out there, thats why it was adopted by the military http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif .

[colossus]

When I think oily/plastic looking bumpmapping I&#39;m thinking at the first mission in Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory.
I have never seen worse bumpmapping then that&#33;
Even when the AIs are inside (it&#39;s raining on the mission) there skin looks like they are actionfigures, it&#39;s so oily and plastic look-a-like that it is horrible. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif

I mean look at this&#33; (http://surgemag.com/images/Fall2004/Previews/Splinter%20Cell/large/SC3_CTE_Rain.jpg)

PS: This is getting WAAAYY off topic, maybe the mods can split the topic and add all post about bumpmapping to a topic for it&#39;s self?

[brataccas]

riddick has some good bumpmapping in some of the levels ever seen the shower room?

[Ironsight]

Why are you guys still talking about bumpmapping after explicit moderators instructions? I don&#39;t wanna see this topic getting locked http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

[gandalf the white]

Why are you guys still talking about bumpmapping after explicit moderators instructions? I don&#39;t wanna see this topic getting locked http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif
that was comparing Arma with VBS1, I do not see a problem with discussing the use of bumpmapping (or polling the opinion about it) in VBS1 http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .


Quote[/b] ] Technicaly VBS1 may not be considered has advanced but it does provides realistic, sharp looking visuals, higher amounts of detail in both quality and quantity while new gen games relly more on textures and efects, if you look closely all modeling work in these games (units, environments, decorations, etc) look quite low on poly count (squary) and are more demanding.

Fact is VBS1 stuff looks much more "real", problably runs alot better, is less demanding and draws alot more than any other game engine out there, thats why it was adopted by the military

"it looks real"
depends on your viewpoint, the lack of proper shadowing and the fact you can count the polygons kind of destroys the effect for me.
"Is less demanding"
true, very true.
"draws allot more than any other game engine out there"
Not neccisary, but it also calculates allot of stuff you can&#39;t see (trajectory for each bullet) , however,



Kegety&#39;s, about the light deflecting bit, you mean as shown here (http://hardwired.hu/img/wg/2/397/Enemy_Territory_Quake_Wars_1.jpg) ? or on this render (http://www.studiopc.com/benchmarking3dsmax/a_new_proposal_radiosity.html)? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif . I am not the expert here, but my common sense tells me that that, on a Game2 scale, will be a b*tch to accomplish. Then again, I have heard rumors about DirectX10 coming up, so... maybe I am wrong (and I certainly hope I am *drool ^.^)

Either way, Kegety&#39;s, I&#39;d like to hear your (affordable) solution to realistic rendering, I heard something about Glide?

[Kegetys]

Kegety&#39;s, about the light deflecting bit, you mean as shown here (http://hardwired.hu/img/wg/2/397/Enemy_Territory_Quake_Wars_1.jpg) ?  or on this render (http://www.studiopc.com/benchmarking3dsmax/a_new_proposal_radiosity.html)?
I see nothing like that in the first screenshot, and the second link is not about real time rendering (Did you even read it yourself?).


Quote[/b] ]Either way, Kegety&#39;s, I&#39;d like to hear your (affordable) solution to realistic rendering, I heard something about Glide?

What do you mean by "affordable realistic rendering"? Forward raytracing would be "realistic rendering", but you&#39;re going to have to wait until 2500 or something to be able to do that in real time (if ever).

[gandalf the white]

Kegety&#39;s, about the light deflecting bit, you mean as shown here (http://hardwired.hu/img/wg/2/397/Enemy_Territory_Quake_Wars_1.jpg) ? or on this render (http://www.studiopc.com/benchmarking3dsmax/a_new_proposal_radiosity.html)?
I see nothing like that in the first screenshot, and the second link is not about real time rendering (Did you even read it yourself?).
The second link is about Radiosity Afaik, i&#39;m not the expert here but it revolves around making the light scatter from a surface to illuminate other surfaces (I had the idea that was what you meant. ( " In real life materials reflect light, so when a light ray hits a surface it lits other surfaces around it. This "radiosity" effect is missing from those fancy bumpmapping effects game developers seem to love today" )

The article I liked was not about real time rendering, but go here (http://www.nzone.com/object/nzone_madmodmike_home.html) , I think Nvidia tries to make it real-time renderable. </quote>

<quote>
Quote[/b] ]
Quote[/b] ]Either way, Kegety&#39;s, I&#39;d like to hear your (affordable) solution to realistic rendering, I heard something about Glide?
What do you mean by "affordable realistic rendering"? Forward raytracing would be "realistic rendering", but you&#39;re going to have to wait until 2500 or something to be able to do that in real time (if ever)
exactly&#33; Bumpmapping, shaders, filters, and all that stuff is aiming to make lifelike scenes with minimal calculating time&#33; the first generation of this technology might be a bit cartoony, but in the end the goal is thesame. <quote>

Oh, and please go easy on me, it&#39;s hard to talk about stuff you have to learn on the fly http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif .

On another note: you got my PM? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Kegetys]

The second link is about Radiosity Afaik
Yes it is but its not rendered in real time. Sure, you could do radiosity rendering even with a calculator and a piece of paper but that doesnt mean you could do it at acceptable framerates in a decent resolution.

You can try this (http://www.realstorm.de/realstorm/data/RealStorm_Bench2004.exe) for an example what is possible in real-time using raytracing now. With radiosity and all the other fancy stuff enabled I mostly get less than 1FPS in that with my 3,1GHz P4 in 640x480 resolution.


Quote[/b] ]exactly&#33; Bumpmapping, shaders, filters, and all that stuff is aiming to make lifelike scenes with minimal calculating time&#33; the first generation of this technology might be a bit cartoony, but in the end the goal is thesame.

I&#39;d rather look at something that looks realistic instead of something that attempts to do something realistically but fails miserably and looks like everything is made of plastic. Stalker for example looks good (imo.), and that is mostly thanks to the excelent textures. In fact I find the older screenshots of it looking much better than some newer video where they had added the "fancy" plastic stuff everywhere.

And yes I got your pm.

[Heatseeker]

I&#39;d rather look at something that looks realistic instead of something that attempts to do something realistically but fails miserably and looks like everything is made of plastic. Stalker for example looks good (imo.), and that is mostly thanks to the excelent textures. In fact I find the older screenshots of it looking much better than some newer video where they had added the "fancy" plastic stuff everywhere.
Agree 100% http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif , Far Cry is a good example of a game featuring new technology and still looking rather squary and cartoonish, Suma once said they got it right the first time regarding BIS real virtuality engine, we have seen how it can handle quite a huge amount of photorealistic detail in VBS1, we have also seen lighting and other improvements in the xbox game.
I think this engines future versions will kick some major ass but people used to smaller games featuring all new DX stuff will complain about the graphics even if they look more realistic, smoother and sharper, most bump mapped textures give a good "fake" efect from the distance but look rather blurry if you look closely, that doom pic is a good example, i prefer the art seen in VBS1 footage, that kind of detail on a future improved engine version (lighting, etc) would be alot more impressive to me  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif .

[Heatseeker]

VBS2 (http://www.virtualbattlespace.com/news.htm#vbs2_iitsec)

Guess this is why the price of some vbs1 modules has dropped significantly and they come up with the special offer package, im wondering now when will the civilian/public version come out, if it comes out before ARMA and the price isnt ridiculously high (it problably will) it would be something to consider but then its the all new improved engine so i seriously doubt it will be made available to the public anytime soon http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/goodnight.gif .

[major gandhi]

would like to know more about vbs2

[Heatseeker]

VBS1 = Specific OPF engine based app licensed and developed for military, law enforcement agencies blahblah.

VBS2 = Specific OPF improved engine based app (1.5?/ARMA?) licensed for etc...
Not much to know about it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif .

Its unfortunate BI is so secretive about it but if they are presenting VBS2 it could be good news for us. Atleast the improved graphics engine will be seen in action.. by someone...

[WhoCares]

I guess the conference is not open for the public http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/icon_rolleyes.gif

So do we have someone that can apply for a job in the Cantina of the Florida Convention Center in Orlando?&#33;

[Rainbow]

VBS2 = probably something how ArmA - Game2

[Heatseeker]

Found coalescent booth (http://exhibits.iitsec.org/iitsec/attendee/booth.asp?Booth=8104) for the event, now we just need to find a comunity spy from Orlando. FL to infiltrate the place and take pics, maybe the opfmaniac map will reveal the spy&#39;s identity  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif . Booth 2304 hall C.
Also got a list of service providers (http://exhibits.iitsec.org/iitsec/attendee/Content.asp?ID=201&exp=11%2F7%2F2005+10%3A32%3A44+PM&SortMenu=114000) for the event, shouldnt be hard to infiltrate.

[Cozza]

Winters http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif Dosnt he come from Orlando http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Heatseeker]

Winters  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif  Dosnt he come from Orlando http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif
shhhh, he&#39;s supposed to be undercover http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif .

Doubt we will get much out of this exposition, still good luck to BIA http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif .

[SniperAndy]

the converence got a open day.
i think it&#39;s the 1st. of december.

also track this site for any news related:
http://www.vbs2.info

[Winters]

Winters  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif  Dosnt he come from Orlando http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif
I worked the booth last year, it was a big waste of time. Nothing came out of it except a bunch of people losing their jobs because management doesnt know how to market the product.

[Heatseeker]

I worked the booth last year, it was a big waste of time. Nothing came out of it...
What about this year http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif ? Will you be able to atleast sneak inside?

[Winters]

I have no interest in what a company that screws over their employees is planning. Judging by the fact that they are now sharing a booth which makes the 3rd straight year that it&#39;s shrunk in size should tell you about the state of the company. Instead of going out and getting new contracts and clients they are sitting on their fat asses and waiting for money to come knock on their door.

I have washed my hands of them and moved on, my new job pays more, has better benefits, more responsibilty and is not going to go out of business anytime soon.

[|RE|Warhawk]

@<hidden>

Forgive my ignorance but what company are you speaking of? BIS, BIA or CTCorp?

Stout Hearts
&#124;RE&#124;Warhawk

[Heatseeker]

CTcorp? Sad to hear that http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif .
Still the base technology for VBS2 should be BIS/BIA handy work, main interest would be to hear about what improvements have they acomplished for V2 and if a version will be made available for public use anytime soon http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif . Dont really care about CT and private military contracts much...

[|RE|Warhawk]

@<hidden>,

Don&#39;t even get me started on CTCorp. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif

Stout Hearts
&#124;RE&#124;Warhawk

[S.O.S]

I think BIS is bullshitting us all with there empty excuses, instead of working on on Armed Assault they create this fucking VBS2 which nobody of us can pay anyways, but the government. if they would at least keep one of there announcements (release date) which obivously wont be this year or ever next year - just as last year and the year before - then there could be something to look forward.

Anybody who still belives in bis and armed assault should start to think what this company did the last 3 years for ofp, they made promises over and over but didnt bring it at all, even the xbox version is so cheap - no new missions rarely new textures maybe a few new sound eefect and some little xbox graphics-improvements, wow - cool, but thats about it basicly.

I would think nothing of this company if there wouldnt have been operation flashpoint cwc or resistance, but actually thats history.

The tourney of us civil ofp fans seems to stop here obviously.

[SniperAndy]

i think people still dont see the difference between BI & BIA.
since BI is working on completing AA with allmost all they got BIA has shifted most dev work from VBS1 to VBS2 atm. this might also be the reason why the USARMY1 module and the patch are so delayed. because they need VBS2 up and running for the convention. still armed assault is a different story and maybe people should realise this some day.

[|RE|Warhawk]

@<hidden>
What I find rather amusing is those that think they know what is going on and don&#39;t. If you think BIS is such a bad company why are you here? I&#39;m not saying that you don&#39;t, or do as the case maybe, have legitimate complaints. But perhaps you should keep in mind that VBS1/VBS2 Development is being wholely and completely done seperately by a different group of people. But hey if you feel that you can get a better deal with a company like EA or UBI I would say go for it. For myself I think I will be giving them more time as there really isn&#39;t anything else out there that&#39;s going to come close to having what I want in my next mainstream online game or sim.

@<hidden>
You might want to consider the fact that you could be waaaaaay off base in what you think is happening or not happening with VBS and what&#39;s in store. Not saying that I know anymore than you but it might be best to maybe think about that before you engage your fingers on your keyboard?

Stout Hearts
&#124;RE&#124;Warhawk

[Heatseeker]

i think people still dont see the difference between BI & BIA.
since BI is working on completing AA with allmost all they got BIA has shifted most dev work from VBS1 to VBS2 atm. this might also be the reason why the USARMY1 module and the patch are so delayed. because they need VBS2 up and running for the convention. still armed assault is a different story and maybe people should realise this some day.
Yeah but i though BIA only made specific content, units, maps, art and stuff like that, the game engine and tools are still BIS work. If VBS2 is under development and being presented soon why are they still making modules for version 1? Makes no sense unless vbs2 wont be available to the public any time soon wich would kind of suck http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif .
That or current stuff will indeed be compatible, i would really like to know bout that.

edit: Took a look around your site, looks very nice btw http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif .

[shinRaiden]

I think BIS is bullshitting us all with there empty excuses, instead of working on on Armed Assault they create this fucking VBS2 which nobody of us can pay anyways, but the government. if they would at least keep one of there announcements (release date) which obivously wont be this year or ever next year - just as last year and the year before - then there could be something to look forward.

Anybody who still belives in bis and armed assault should start to think what this company did the last 3 years for ofp, they made promises over and over but didnt bring it at all, even the xbox version is so cheap - no new missions rarely new textures maybe a few new sound eefect and some little xbox graphics-improvements, wow - cool, but thats about it basicly.

I would think nothing of this company if there wouldnt have been operation flashpoint cwc or resistance, but actually thats history.

The tourney of us civil ofp fans seems to stop here obviously.
You may think all you want, but you don&#39;t have any clue what you&#39;re talking about, which prove&#39;s you&#39;re not thinking.

BIS has been working on 3 products: Elite, ArmA, and Game2. At certain stages completed content, or content in development, is forked and licensed to BIA to develop for VBS. The projects are related, but effectively independent in the operation and management. BIA takes care of VBS, BIS takes care of OFP.

BIS has not been sitting on their rear-ends for the past 3 years, if you go and read the actual real interviews Placebo commented about how BIS had to do massive rewrites and rework to fit CWC+RES into the Xbox. Not only did they make it fit, they also totally overhauled the net code, and increased relative performance over the PC significantly. The content is technically several generations advanced over the CWC content. It looks the same, but it works differently. If you can&#39;t understand the impact that has for the long term then Flashpoint is way over your head.

Oh, and while "BIS has been sitting on their butts" they&#39;ve also released several patches and increasing community support. Among other items of business. If you&#39;re going to rip on something, make sure you actually know what you&#39;re talking about.

[S.O.S]

my whole point was that its again the end of a year, bis promised to releasethe game (armed assault) but for fact it cant be released within this year. this is happening, for fact, now since 1, maybe 2 years without anything new for the pc customer.

better ea or ubi soft then NO GAME.

[Cozza]

you try making 3 games at one time. Not very easy. And BIS is a small company.

[|RE|Warhawk]

my whole point was that its again the end of a year, bis promised to releasethe game (armed assault) but for fact it cant be released within this year. this is happening, for fact, now since 1, maybe 2 years without anything new for the pc customer.

better ea or ubi soft then NO GAME.
@<hidden>

From someone that has dealt with UBI, as a customer, for going on 10 years now let me tell you something. UBI = no game at all or one that you don&#39;t want anyways. EA isn&#39;t much better but hey if you think the grass is greener on the other side of the fence then jump my boy, jump.

Stout Hearts
&#124;RE&#124;Warhawk

[Heatseeker]

better ea or ubi soft then NO GAME.
EA and UBI = Publishers
BIS = Software developer (main activity at least?)

Please stop driving this topic further off topic and put more thought into your posting, im sure news will arrive sooner or later and that the end result of BIS future games will be well worth the waiting time, i know people are a bit frustrated lately but in the end it will be worth it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif .

[SniperAndy]

@<hidden>
What I find rather amusing is those that think they know what is going on and don&#39;t. If you think BIS is such a bad company why are you here? I&#39;m not saying that you don&#39;t, or do as the case maybe, have legitimate complaints. But perhaps you should keep in mind that VBS1/VBS2 Development is being wholely and completely done seperately by a different group of people. But hey if you feel that you can get a better deal with a company like EA or UBI I would say go for it. For myself I think I will be giving them more time as there really isn&#39;t anything else out there that&#39;s going to come close to having what I want in my next mainstream online game or sim.

@<hidden>
You might want to consider the fact that you could be waaaaaay off base in what you think is happening or not happening with VBS and what&#39;s in store. Not saying that I know anymore than you but it might be best to maybe think about that before you engage your fingers on your keyboard?

Stout Hearts
&#124;RE&#124;Warhawk
thank god it&#39;s a free world and I can think what I want.
so long as I dont say that&#39;s how it is cause it would confuse people hearing more shait about the different products.
maybe also you wanna swith on your brains from time to time before hitting the keyboards..

[|RE|Warhawk]

@<hidden>
What I find rather amusing is those that think they know what is going on and don&#39;t. If you think BIS is such a bad company why are you here? I&#39;m not saying that you don&#39;t, or do as the case maybe, have legitimate complaints. But perhaps you should keep in mind that VBS1/VBS2 Development is being wholely and completely done seperately by a different group of people. But hey if you feel that you can get a better deal with a company like EA or UBI I would say go for it. For myself I think I will be giving them more time as there really isn&#39;t anything else out there that&#39;s going to come close to having what I want in my next mainstream online game or sim.

@<hidden>
You might want to consider the fact that you could be waaaaaay off base in what you think is happening or not happening with VBS and what&#39;s in store. Not saying that I know anymore than you but it might be best to maybe think about that before you engage your fingers on your keyboard?

Stout Hearts
&#124;RE&#124;Warhawk
thank god it&#39;s a free world and I can think what I want.
so long as I dont say that&#39;s how it is cause it would confuse people hearing more shait about the different products.
maybe also you wanna swith on your brains from time to time before hitting the keyboards..
That&#39;s the thing about thoughts and opinions. Everyone is entitled to one. No matter how misinformed it might be.

Stout Hearts
&#124;RE&#124;Warhawk

[SniperAndy]

Quote[/b] ]BIA has shifted most dev work from VBS1 to VBS2 atm.
so you&#39;re saying this is miss informed?...maybe some stuff is just not to be told you know?
(i know the other issues they had with USARMY1, but that doesn&#39;t belong here warhawk http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/notworthy.gif )

i don&#39;t wanna take this anymore off-topic.
so hopefully AA will be released before christmas and I also hope the "new" AA side goes online soon so we all get a better insight on what AA will bring us.

[|RE|Warhawk]

No SA I am not saying that at all. Please not the use of the word "might" and try not to read between the lines. Thank you very much.

Stout Hearts
&#124;RE&#124;Warhawk

[CanadianTerror]

Quote[/b] ]That&#39;s the thing about thoughts and opinions. Everyone is entitled to one. No matter how misinformed it might be.

That&#39;s just F&#39;n brilliant&#33;

*writes that down*

[Hellfish6]

Yeah. This is way off topic and bordering on flaming. Closing.