Islands complexity

[L etranger]

Hello, do we have any information about islands to know if they have been improved to fill the blank of 'nothing to hide' (like the empty plain of the originals one) with more bushs, trees, houses, etc..?

[Harnu]

There's been some info here and there. If anyone can dig up some of the old info BIS put out about their plans for terrain we might get a little more insight. Supposedly the sizes were to be much larger. As as far as you asking about the spaces in between where it was just flat grass, I believe some modeled grass is going to be in game to help act as sort of a filler.

[Espectro]

Only thing i know is, that the included island sarah, will be alot smaller than Nogova

[schmerzbringer]

If you look at the screenies (only 100% info (yes WIP)), the answer is: YES! More objects/m˛ http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Ti0n3r]

Only thing i know is, that the included island sarah, will be alot smaller than Nogova
Were did you hear that?

[twisted]

Only thing i know is, that the included island sarah, will be alot smaller than Nogova
Were did you hear that?
from this preview it seems it won't be smaller but it will be more detailed.

http://www.kvaerulanten.dk/armed-assault/?side=previews

look about 1/2 down the page.


http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Jakerod]

Quote[/b] ]The new campaign, on an equally new island, has been created to showcase the improved features of the engine. It's much larger and more detailed than Everon and previous worlds. Codenamed Sara, it's going to feature dense woodlands and as big an urban environment as the game can take.
From the preview

It could very well be bigger than nogova

[Jotte]

Seing that Nogova would fall under "previous worlds" category it seems very likely that it is larger. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Berghoff]

Wth, smaller? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif I think not, more like larger and more detailed.

[da12thMonkey]

Only thing i know is, that the included island sarah, will be alot smaller than Nogova
What gives you that idea? The E3 showcard (http://www.armedassault.com/pics/e3showcard.pdf) says there will be a "New map" which we now know to be Sara "covering over 100 sq. km, in extreme detail"

Nogova is about 100 sq. km too so they're of about equal size.

[DBR_ONIX]

It says "includes all content from original game" or similar, which means Nogava it's self (Revamped too) will be included..
Maybe : Sarah > Shara (the desert) > Desert Island? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
- Ben

[StealthTiger]

Maybe : Sarah > Shara (the desert) > Desert Island? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
- Ben
I doubt it though. Why have a comparitively boring desert island when you can show off everthing on a Nogova type island? .. like those rolling hills. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Espectro]

nogova is ~14x14 km = 196skm, right?

[bravo 6]

well, another crappy island then.. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

[kavoven]

I guess their won't be anything new on this island, except new objects, but nothing special....

[MattXR]

i heard there wasnt going to be a desert island.. but sarah sounds deserty lol http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

[FischKopp]

A normal OFP map is about 12.5 km x 12.5 km big, which means about 150 km2. And i think the island will not be bigger than the usal OFP map. But it will allow much more details. Although i would also prefer bigger maps, cos for modern ground warfrare is it to small.

[Hellfish6]

You guys are being kind of short sighted - you have no idea about any of the island's specifics yet you're already making conclusions about it. How the hell do you know it's a crappy island if you've only seen maybe four screenshots??

How about you stop making up your opinion before you know anything about it?

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif

[Daddl]

Also neither Nogova nor any other of the original islands covered the full 12.5x12.5 km˛. Nogova is 100km˛ of land surface max. Get your facts straight.

Anyways, what's the point in speculating? We've seen from the screenshots that the islands are more detailed, which does more to improve imersion than adding a few km˛ extra. Remember this is ArmA, not the next generation game!

[Espectro]

Also neither Nogova nor any other of the original islands covered the full 12.5x12.5 km˛. Nogova is 100km˛ of land surface max. Get your facts straight.

Anyways, what's the point in speculating? We've seen from the screenshots that the islands are more detailed, which does more to improve imersion than adding a few km˛ extra. Remember this is ArmA, not the next generation game!
actually, nogova is 132 sqm of land surface.... get your facts straight

[Commando84]

i don't care so much if the new island is 100 or 130 skm in size
btw how do you do those raized 2's?? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif
But Im more intrested in game engine advancements and how missions can be made differently and maybe if addons can be upgraded with new stuff http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif
The new island sounds and looks very nice and i think we should be happy they took the time to make the expansion pack instead of only working on game 2 http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Daddl]

actually, nogova is 132 sqm of land surface.... get your facts straight
Actually you are wrong about that:
Nogova is just about 90km˛ of land surface including all islands. I just checked this by creating a mosaic of a few georeferenced screenshots from the mission editor map, manually digitizing the water borders (the first water contour line was used, which means this method actually gives a slight overestimate) and using ArcGIS to calculate the surface.

http://temp.joltan.net/NogovaShape.png

If you want to check yourself, the georeferenced images and the resulting shape file are available here (http://temp.joltan.net/NogovaGISData.zip) (as ERDAS img and ArcView shape).

Edit: yes, I admit you have to be bored to go to such length. That's what traveling by train does to you. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

Anyways, thanks for ignoring my main point:

what's the point in speculating? We've seen from the screenshots that the islands are more detailed, which does more to improve imersion than adding a few km˛ extra. Remember this is ArmA, not the next generation game!

[Batukhan]

Great job! Anyone think that CS has fans like that? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

[Hekezu]

Great job! Anyone think that CS has fans like that? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif
They don't even bother calculating the area of the maps because the maps are sooo small. Uhm.. 1 square meter, 2... 3... 4... http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/rofl.gif

[Espectro]

Great job! Anyone think that CS has fans like that?  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif
They don't even bother calculating the area of the maps because the maps are sooo small. Uhm.. 1 square meter, 2... 3... 4...  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/rofl.gif
Sorry bout that daddl, i stand corrected. Anyway, I don't care if sarah is larger or smaller than nogova (I think theres plenty of room on nogova for various landscapes), But i do care about more detail, and we have seen from the shots that it has that.

Lets just wait for the game to arrive, hehe http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

btw. Does that calculating include height of land? (ie. does it flatten the land first), or is it just an overhead view?

[Chip]

What about the terrain resolution? AFAIK the current OFP engine has resolution of 30 meters and that makes construction of many terrain features (for example ditches) very difficult if not impossible. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif

[Heatseeker]

I just hope it wont be another LAGova, Nogova is big but too laggy and barren, lotsa empty terrain there with no cover, if thats the case i would rather have a more detailed Malden/Everon type island with more cover because gameplay is more important than size and considering OFP's original islands already provided enough space for infantry, armor and helicopters they suit me just fine.
Better looks, better terrain, more cover and concealment and more details definetly but i dont know why we would need a island bigger than Nogova really. anyone remember Tonal?

[Jakerod]

Looks detailed enough for me:Screen (http://www.armedassault.com/shots/aa_shot4.jpg)

EDIT: Fixed Link

[Heatseeker]

Looks detailed enough for me:http://www.armedassault.com/shots/aa_shot4.jpg
It looks good, but seems to lack some rocks, fallen tree logs and other objects that could improve gameplay by providing solid cover, so we can take advantage of the rock solid colision detection http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .

[Jakerod]

Quote[/b] ]t looks good, but seems to lack some rocks, fallen tree logs and other objects that could improve gameplay by providing solid cover, so we can take advantage of the rock solid colision detection .

There isn't going to be rocks there probably. The way the terrain looks there is a good chance that all that ground is just soil and not rock. You have to look at it from a reality perspective too not just a gameplay one.

[Heatseeker]

There isn't going to be rocks there probably. The way the terrain looks there is a good chance that all that ground is just soil and not rock. You have to look at it from a reality perspective too not just a gameplay one.
There will always be compromises considering they wont be capable of simulating RL levels of detail and objects and nobody i know can run the game in very high level of terrain detail, maybe if the a.i. doesnt pinpoint and shoot so acurately and the new colision detection really works we can take cover behind the trees http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif .

[MattXR]

The Shara Desert isnt all that plain.. although about 95% of it is just sand http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

[Chip]

Looks detailed enough for me:Screen (http://www.armedassault.com/shots/aa_shot4.jpg)

EDIT: Fixed Link
It looks nice, yes. But the resolution seems to be the same as in original OFP, one height point every 30 meters. And that means that you can't make detailed terrain features such as narrow mountain roads, ditches... It would be nice to have at least 10m resolution. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/help.gif I hope it will be introduced, if not in ArmA perhaps in a later patch? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/xmas_o.gif

[Scrub]

I agree, that would be nice.  That screen still looks very beta to me, here's hoping.  I know they made the improvements in a manner that OFP content would port over, but to have the ability to have such features would make ArmA magnitudes better. (even if the terrain was made a true 3D construct  http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif )

[Jakerod]

Its actually once every 50m. And there are ways of making it less than that but it tends to lag there is an island out that is like that.

Screenshot (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/news/pics/sectionpics/Midship.jpg)
Download (ftp://www.gamezone.cz:8021/ofpd/islands2/InfantryRange.zip)

[Chip]

Its actually once every 50m. And there are ways of making it less than that but it tends to lag there is an island out that is like that.

Screenshot (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/news/pics/sectionpics/Midship.jpg)
Download (ftp://www.gamezone.cz:8021/ofpd/islands2/InfantryRange.zip)
Wow, very cool! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wow_o.gif Thanks for info, I hope it won't lag so much in ArmA. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Phleep]

Regarding map detail though, it will be much more effective now to use objects for smaller map details than previously. Shadows are cast upon them which would help create the illusion of continuity. Before, shadows would not be cast on objects making them stand out more.

I still hope the facility for more detailed maps is provided.

[Dwarden]

i really wonder if Armed Assault take advantage of Geometry Instancing (for e.g. trees and bushes and so on at major distance views)

[Uldics]

Isn't OFP allready using some kind of Geometry Instancing? Of course software way. All bushes are just copies of other bushes. And forests, houses. Of course hardware way would be faster. But I dont see exactly how it would be dramatically faster? Or is OFP having a lot of same type objects in memory at same time and only using same models for not wasting HDD space, but not RAM?

[t80]

Quote[/b] ]Uldics Posted on Nov. 11 2005,13:48
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Isn't OFP allready using some kind of Geometry Instancing? Of course software way. All bushes are just copies of other bushes. And forests, houses. Of course hardware way would be faster. But I dont see exactly how it would be dramatically faster? Or is OFP having a lot of same type objects in memory at same time and only using same models for not wasting HDD space, but not RAM?

i would not complaine if AA was 20 gig in size..

[Hauk]

Quote[/b] ]Uldics Posted on Nov. 11 2005,13:48
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Isn't OFP allready using some kind of Geometry Instancing? Of course software way. All bushes are just copies of other bushes. And forests, houses. Of course hardware way would be faster. But I dont see exactly how it would be dramatically faster? Or is OFP having a lot of same type objects in memory at same time and only using same models for not wasting HDD space, but not RAM?

i would not complaine if AA was 20 gig in size..
Neither would I, I'm building my new PC for this game, so I have a fresh new Hard Drive for it! Now, just sit back and wait for release!

ON topic, I do think the islands will be more detailed, considering the whole engine has been redone, so I'm a happy chappy!

Hauk http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

[Berghoff]

The trees will be more detailed than in Resistance don't know about the terrain yet.

[Kode]

well if you put your OFP on very high detail, you get a very hilly terrain, it looks much better, but it also is horrible to drive anything on it, except when you are on a road of course http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif, of course, you need a quite good system to do so to let it run smoothly

[Espectro]

the island will be alot more detailed than any earlier islands as well.

[echo1]

They need some vegetation, The ground just looks flat and lifeless without some grass or weeds or whatnot around the place.

[Jakerod]

They need some vegetation, The ground just looks flat and lifeless without some grass or weeds or whatnot around the place.
Photo (http://www.arma.dk/photogallery.php?photo=50)

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

[Berghoff]

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif I like those trees a lot with those dark areas.

[Llauma]

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif I like those trees a lot with those dark areas.
Yes.. I guess that the improved shadows get's the credits for that. The big difference though will be that all vegetation will wave in the wind, at least I hope they will.

OFP looks much better in screenshots than in real time. With real time lighting effects and other new features in ArmA the game will probably look the best when experienced live.