Various physics SDK support for e.g. modder

[Dwarden]

i know Suma closed the previous thread about physics/ragdoll etc and i apologize i ask this question after (was unable earlier)...

(for forum mod please merge it with that closed thread if it's problem)


i would like to know if it will be big problem for BIS to implement into Armed Assault support for physics SDK as part of modding SDK or in similar way...

like support for these physical engines
http://ode.org/
http://www.tokamakphysics.com/

these are free and have good quality level to be used in such SDK ...

this mean BIS will not need to concentrate on implementing extremely complex physics etc, but it will be possible to implement it's as addon / mod etc ....

i hope You understood what i mean and thanks for answers

[Yoshiro]

You don't just drop in a Physics SDK.


For physics to be in a game, a specific physics engine has to be implemented from the very start. Either in house like BIS did in the past or by buying the rights to another physics engine such as Novodex (new kid on the block, really cool, Unreal Engine 3) or Havok (Half Life 2, Max Payne) and implementing it into the engine. Physics engine SDK's are not compatible with other phyics engines.

From what I understand (I could be completly wrong), BIS has done the inhouse Phyics coding again so any physics tools would be inhouse tools.

[SgtH3nry3]

I hope they done it better now, ok I must admit Operation Flashpoint does come from the no-physics to little-physics enabled games but they had one of the first home-made physics engines.

Still NovodeX would have been a great choice... It's so versatile... It has lots of features other games don't have...
And its a Physics engine and API that is fully compatible with their PhysX card.

If you saw their trailers... You gonna laugh at Half-Life 2 and Battlefield 2...
It makes Meqon, Havok, MathEngine, OpenDE, Newton, and all the other physics engines look like nothing!

[MattXR]

lol it would be cool and all but i think there just proberly testing the game for bugs and that now.. finishing up on a few things.. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

[D.murphy man]

Im sure there still busyly working away whiles being wiped from behind and not aloud to see the light of day, there wives (maybe thats not a bad thing for some http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif ) and any form of civilistion intill they complete Armed Assualt, Game 2 and patch the buggers up http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

[Dwarden]

I hope they done it better now, ok I must admit Operation Flashpoint does come from the no-physics to little-physics enabled games but they had one of the first home-made physics engines.

Still NovodeX would have been a great choice... It's so versatile... It has lots of features other games don't have...
And its a Physics engine and API that is fully compatible with their PhysX card.

If you saw their trailers... You gonna laugh at Half-Life 2 and Battlefield 2...
It makes Meqon, Havok, MathEngine, OpenDE, Newton, and all the other physics engines look like nothing!
i will not agree on this sir .... for example Meqon beats Novodex ...

and some other PEs can match or outperform it too ...

why You use games like HalfLife 2 , that one using modified Havok 1 and parts of Havok 2, there is already Havok 3 out ...

or like BF2 where is physics implementation non existant ...

what about next time compare what physics each engine can do ...

[SgtH3nry3]

i will not agree on this sir .... for example Meqon beats Novodex ...

and some other PEs can match or outperform it too ...
Meqon is only real-time physics engine but it doesn't have correct fluid simulation, nor the ability to control all bones properly and it doesn't have metal bending.

Next to that Meqon cannot simulate things if the CPU doesn't have time and NovodeX can do things real-time (yes Meqon isn't the only one) and just-in-time but also has PPU support.

NovodeX isn't only a physics engine but also a support-API for the Ageia PhysX PPU and it is completly multi-core/processor and multi-threading ready.

Don't believe me? Here is the truth:
http://www.ageia.com/novodex.html
http://www.airtightgames.com/currentproject.html

[Dwarden]

i didn't said Meqon do all this , i said it's better in what it can and it's structure is very easy to adapt and add anything ...

about Novodex ... like i said x times before ... it's about pushing own format thru ... and that's what they hope to cover with PPU ... even they said PPU will be usable by others PE ... quite sure they will be "pushing" own format ...

i already saw these demos ... not impressed me enough... (e.g. bugs You see in it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif)

also about power of that PPU you must take in mind PCI bw limitations...

now price isn't user friendly too (349-399 ?) ... that's quite lot for very narrow specialised calculation card ...

i will simple wait till Havok or someone else release theirs own "PPU" chip http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif) ... as competetion does wonders ...

so until there are mass market available units on mainboards, video/audio cards ... not much change ...

time will tell

[SgtH3nry3]

i already saw these demos ... not impressed me enough... (e.g. bugs You see in it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif)

Your tried Rocket right??? Thats really bad because this was based on SDK 1.1 which was based on Havok JIT physics... http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

Try these trailers http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif you can obviously see it isn't pre-scripted:
http://www.airtightgames.com/currentproject.html

<!--QuoteBegin--Dwarden]also about power of that PPU you must take in mind PCI bw limitations...[/quote]

PCI 32-bit is enough+133Mbps is more than enough for 500.000 physical interactions simultaneously.

Although not enough for graphics cards...


Quote[/b] (Dwarden]also about power of that PPU you must take in mind PCI bw limitations...

PCI 32-bit is enough @<hidden> 133Mbps is more than enough for 500.000 physical interactions simultaneously.

Although not enough for graphics cards...




Check again. Estimations are 249-299 euros is like 200-270 dollars...

[quote=Dwarden]i will simple wait till Havok or someone else release theirs own "PPU" chip http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif) ... as competetion does wonders ...

Blarghh Havok is bad, especially if you seen them on E3 with their new Havok 3 engine...
Too much resource taking, AI-unfriendly, so I asked hey is it finished or what... They said yes&#33;&#33; http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/rofl.gif

Meqon seems better and Open Dynamics Engine too, much better than Havok crap http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/band.gif

And Dwarden, you don&#39;t mind if I use your banner and support you in the fight for Open Game Protocol??
It sounds brilliant http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif:D

[Daddl]

Quote[/b] ]now price isn&#39;t user friendly too (349-399 ?) ... that&#39;s quite lot for very narrow specialised calculation card ...
Check again. Estimations are 249-299 euros is like 200-270 dollars...
I think you got the exchange rate the wrong way around: 249 Euro = 306.4692 U.S. dollar (current exchange rate according to Google). So this would mean more like 300 - 370 US&#036;.

[SgtH3nry3]

Quote[/b] ]now price isn&#39;t user friendly too (349-399 ?) ... that&#39;s quite lot for very narrow specialised calculation card ...
Check again. Estimations are 249-299 euros is like 200-270 dollars...
I think you got the exchange rate the wrong way around: 249 Euro = 306.4692 U.S. dollar (current exchange rate according to Google). So this would mean more like 300 - 370 US&#036;.
It&#39;s not about conversion but about shipping costs, and transport and EU import taxes and all the stuff together http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

[Daddl]

Quote[/b] ]now price isn&#39;t user friendly too (349-399 ?) ... that&#39;s quite lot for very narrow specialised calculation card ...
Check again. Estimations are 249-299 euros is like 200-270 dollars...
I think you got the exchange rate the wrong way around: 249 Euro = 306.4692 U.S. dollar (current exchange rate according to Google). So this would mean more like 300 - 370 US&#036;.
It&#39;s not about conversion but about shipping costs, and transport and EU import taxes and all the stuff together http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif
You think shipping costs from China are more expensive to Europe than to the US? I&#39;d say that&#39;s nothing - and the 16% tax don&#39;t make up for your weak currency.
http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif

[Dwarden]

And Dwarden, you don&#39;t mind if I use your banner and support you in the fight for Open Game Protocol??
It sounds brilliant http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif:D
I have no problem with that ... and that&#39;s why i want to see similar "widely" opened Physics API, chip support for it and market adopting it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif ...

at least with "standard" PE API ...

i don&#39;t think idea for specialized PE calculation card is bad but ... i simple ... don&#39;t like the way it&#39;s taken now ... that&#39;s all ...