New VBS1 videos [Archive] - Bohemia Interactive Forums

ryankaplan

Jul 19 2005, 22:18

Before you block the post, i thought i'd post these because they MAY (i sure as hell hope so, cos they left me drooling) be AA. Damn, imagine a chinook being chased by a mi24, only for the chinook to open it's back door and a soldier inside shoots a stinger at the mi24.....mmmmm

Enhanced armoured vehicles (15.7 mb) - shoot out of hatches, shoot from the turned out position. Enchanced Armoured Vehicles (http://www.virtualbattlespace2.com/media/movies/CT_AV.rar)

Enhanced B vehicles (11.2 mb) - freely move around on transport trucks, engage enemy from cargo positions of light vehicles. Enhanced B vehicles (http://www.virtualbattlespace2.com/media/movies/CT_BV.rar)

Enhanced air transports (15.5 mb) - move on and off transport vehicles in a realistic manner.
Enchanced Air transport (http://www.virtualbattlespace2.com/media/movies/enhanced.rar)

I'm very sorry if they seen before and i was in a cave.

major gandhi

Jul 19 2005, 23:07

hmmm .... looks really nice

Commando84

Jul 19 2005, 23:26

wow! never seen these before or heard of these features .. hopefully this is in Arm assault or and "OFP 2" http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/xmas_o.gif

Sch1sm

Jul 20 2005, 01:21

As far as i know,and looking at the videos, these are simply VBS and nothing more looking at the engine itself and the way everything moves. It's impressive nonetheless yet we'll have to see if a variation appears in ArmA. Are we getting confused between VBS and ArmA methinks? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif

SpecOp9

Jul 20 2005, 01:31

I believe the things being done in VBS1 are also being done for Armed Assault. I see ArmA as a little gift for the folks unfortuante to have VBS1, or an Xbox to witness these cool new features.

Impavido

Jul 20 2005, 03:56

Impressive! The free movement within a moving vehicle especially got my attention. Makes me wonder what happens if the driver puts on the E-brake and turns a hard right http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/rofl.gif

Thanks for the videos

RalphWiggum

Jul 20 2005, 04:37

wrong forum

RalphWiggum

Jul 22 2005, 15:14

reopening thread.

any discussion of VBS will be dealt harshly, as well as requesting/suggesting feature

D.murphy man

Jul 22 2005, 15:39

Kool stuff i seen these before but its still pretty nifty http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif cant wait to get a few buddies riding in the back of my pickup with there ingrams and AKs drive by'ing the enemy gangsta style http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

that is if this feature is included in ArAs (i hope it will! )

Acecombat

Jul 22 2005, 16:14

Scrub

Jul 22 2005, 16:14

It is nice, but not what I'd call 'free'. There seems to be stations you can go to and fire from, which is definately an advancement. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

Edit:

I think this is an oogling thread.. for ooh's and aah's.. which I'm sure it will recieve. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

Edit #2: Darn,Darn,Darn,Darn... I shoulda looked at the air transport one... sorry.. It is a revolutionary deal.. very nice!

Heatseeker

Jul 22 2005, 18:11

Looks nice though the guys inside the apc's and tank look to be atached to the vehicals and not moving freely (not thats its a bad thing, on the contrary), also regarding the helicopter one it may not work so well if the helicopter moves fast or less stable, i really liked how the guy on the tank can now use his binoculars, good job considering the vbs engine is still a updated OFP one but i hope something better is implemented in ARAS http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif .

MattXR

Jul 22 2005, 21:16

yes this feature will be very nice, and if it doesnt come with ArmA we sure will know that we can make it ourselves... http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

stakex

Jul 22 2005, 21:52

reopening thread.

any discussion of VBS will be dealt harshly, as well as requesting/suggesting feature
I am confused , you dont want us discussing this feature from VBS which we hope will be implemented in AA? If so then whats the point of opening the thread? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif
I believe its because we are to disscuss the possibility of them in ArmA. Perhaps some of these will in fact be in ArmA, and thats why this thread was re-opened? I mean they have said ArmA will contain things from VBS... so perhaps these are some of them.

UNN

Jul 22 2005, 22:44

Quote[/b] ] I shoulda looked at the air transport one... sorry.. It is a revolutionary deal.. very nice!

Well you can drive in and load cargo now with OFP (OWP's MI26 for one), plus I doubt that was an AI we watched driving into the back. If it was, then I'm very happy http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

But the moving around in vehicles is comming on great, looks a lot slicker than it did in the older VBS demo http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/thumbs-up.gif

Korax

Jul 22 2005, 23:00

Ooooh.... Aaahh....

It seems the only main improvement is soldiers being able to walk freely within certain areas in vehicles. The rest is done with some clever scripting (If you look carefully in the cargo chopper one there is an action to 'Tie Down' the jeep, which can basically already be done in ofp with alot of setpos and setdir, yet it would work infinitely better in VBS with the addition of setpitch commands).
But if the walking-in-vehicles thing is included in ArAs, I will be one happy man! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/yay.gif

Evishion

Jul 23 2005, 00:18

finally.. the only thing ofp need.. walk free in planes etc http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/notworthy.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/thumbs-up.gif

xnodunitx

Jul 23 2005, 01:01

That better be in ArmAus O_O too good of a feature to leave out and will dissapoint many OFP fans no doubt.

I can already see it,comming down in a CH-47 or UH-60,enemies everywhere and shootin,no more vunerability of being shot and not doing anything from the side,you can land,shoot from the inside and cover soldiers getting out and then fly off for the next pick up....oh man this coupled with the new ArmAus graphics and less engine limitations........might need to call 911 when this is released,screw BF2 those people don't know what their missin.......then again they should keep to BF2 because alot of servers I'v gone to have many many idiots and this game would be way to advanced and real for them.

alacasam

Jul 23 2005, 02:09

All those features would be awsome! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/yay.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/yay.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/yay.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/thumbs-up.gif

bravo 6

Jul 23 2005, 06:51

finally.. the only thing ofp need.. walk free in planes etc http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/notworthy.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/thumbs-up.gif
i agree!

plus the extra island

tankieboy

Jul 23 2005, 07:36

By far not the only thing needed, however a "step" in the right direction.

cain2001

Jul 23 2005, 13:09

what will happen on the big 16 player coop missiong where u fly in from north east in a big ch-17 chopper. There will be a huge party in the back of the chopper (no one sitting still). 5 of the crew fell out and died. 3 was accedently shot by their team mates.

Some limits are good but i guess that realistic all the way is even better. Problem is that people would bend the rules and on a public coop server stuff like this could be whats happening.

I just feel Bad for Pvt Johnson who fell out 3 times in a row in the water and and was spotted by an enemy patrol boat http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

xnodunitx

Jul 23 2005, 13:40

Yeah but you forget this is the OFP community not the BF2 community,people arent as dimwitted or arseholes.

Killbert

Jul 23 2005, 16:19

It probably won't work very well online with lag, but for offline only this would be a great. It looks better than anything similar I have seen in other games so far. The movement looks really smooth. Movement inside vehicles is a small detail, but it makes a huge impact in immersion to the game world.

I hope BIS won't save all the cool VBS stuff for the "Game 2", as I fear. BIS could make ArmAs great if they choose to implement the technology they have already developed for VBS. However I think they would have mentioned it already if they were planning on doing that. Only time or BIS will tell...

ebns72

Jul 23 2005, 21:36

Something I've wondered: will AI be smart enough to walk freely in planes?

spoock

Jul 23 2005, 22:07

JPSelter

Jul 23 2005, 22:12

Are the videos offline? I cannot download them http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/goodnight.gif

Heatseeker

Jul 24 2005, 00:08

I dont know if this will be all that great, moving in flying planes and especialy helicopters may result in a very unrealistic way, like when people pull mad stunts and tight manuevers you wont be dancing in the cargo area, what would be good for larger air units like the C-130, CH47, Mi-26, etc would be for the soldiers to actually get inside the vehicals and then use the action menu to "atach" to the seats, i dont think the ability to move around a flying helicopter will add much to the game except for the fact that the units wont take damage when such vehical is under fire http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif . Same for trucks and apc's, you wont hit much standing on a moving vehical, especialy if the driver is drunk http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .

RsStar

Jul 24 2005, 01:51

im sure it will be fun thoe flying over the battlefield and lobbing grenades out the back for fun.

or like a person said standing at the back with a stinger and shooting down chasing aroplanes

Bikecop

Jul 24 2005, 01:57

I...would...luv....to........c *Pauses the EXTREMELY LARGE urge to bust outa rant against VBS-1* In a squeazy voice* these in future projects. *Urge grows trumendously* http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/banghead.gif
I need my medication before I burst and get banned.

4 IN 1

Jul 24 2005, 04:04

the thing is that while it is fun (maybe too much of it),
it also not as practical as you thought, i mean you may get in and out the chopper faster and realistic and at some point you may running around like nuts in chopper and shooting crap out of the chopper, i see no point other then wasting ammo(you cant aim well in fast moving chopper so why dont just let the door gunners to do the job) or committe suicide(well, Heatseeker i think BIS guys have worked hard on it to make sure you are stick to the flight, but it will just as easy to fall out of the craft if you have 8+ ppl running in it, and dont forgot the RPG theory), so yes other then faster insertions and a extra few hands helping the gunners there is not really much more to give

but the the point is that it also show us that some other things we want to have in new engine will make its way into the game, like multiple gunners

Blanco

Jul 24 2005, 04:07

These movies are about a core update, why should there be lag in MP?
There is no scripting involved.
It seems the freedom you get is similar to the freedom in Joint Operation Typhoon Rising, which is a good thing imo.

Heatseeker

Jul 24 2005, 05:37

I think giving players the ability to shoot any kind of missile or rocket from any moving vehical without serious risk of killing himself, other friendlies and problably the vehical itself would be ridiculous (especialy aircraft), i seriously hope Aras wont turn into that, its bad enough with the helicopter parachutes, i expect evolution, not BF2 http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/sad_o.gif

xnodunitx

Jul 24 2005, 05:50

You guys arent seein the use of this? being able to land helicopters closer to the enemies and such,think about it,now landing a blackhawk near a squad of infantry pretty much gets everyone picked off whereas if we could use weapons inside we wouldnt have to worry about that,or helicopters having to worry about bein attacked from the rear if there was somebody in the back,oh imagine this,a C1 is transporting an M1 tank and a enemy plane comes behind it and the C1 drops the tank ontop of the enemy jet....funny and yet wierd.

I dunno I would support this idea as it does have uses,the people would just need to be smart enough to NOT shoot inside the vehicle,if their that dumb they shouldnt be in it in the first place.

Bikecop

Jul 24 2005, 06:58

Sounds kinda GTA'ish to me. ya know? Would I in real life effin load up my M16 and try to pick off people in a moving helocopter? Man sounds like a waste of ammo if you miss all the effin time because the helo is goin so fast. Although shooting outa trucks and cars seem useful.

SpecOp9

Jul 24 2005, 07:04

*crosses fingers*

PLEASE let this be in ArmA

Berghoff

Jul 24 2005, 08:15

I always like the music in those videos http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

Looks nice.

D.murphy man

Jul 24 2005, 10:59

I cant see the proplem people have with this new and extreamly useful feature http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif i mean isint this what we always wanted in ofp? (this and multiple gunners which are pretty closely related)

Yea sure it might be unrealistic for some one to shoot out of fast moving chopper trying to pick people of, but why dosent it happen in real life? beacuse its a waste of ammo. And maybe itll be the same for OFP. Sure a few n00bs will try shooting of the chopper but as every one gets experience theyll relise its a waste of ammo and wont bother trying to shoot out of the chopper, inless of course its hovering.

Plus this new feature will add 10 times more fun to the game. And isnt that why we play games? to have fun! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

4 IN 1

Jul 24 2005, 13:00

xnodunitx

Jul 24 2005, 13:17

If nothin else being able to walk around freely would be a nice thing,doesnt have to be able to use guns but walkin aroun would be stinkin nice.

D.murphy man

Jul 24 2005, 13:24

also another thought is maybe the possibility of Air craft carriers that we can walk around in now too! now that would be great. Also im sure the star wards mod could make good use of this feature, what with massive star destroyers n all.

funnyguy1

Jul 24 2005, 15:58

Well, nice feature for evac`s, helo extractions, or insertions but for normal flight I suggest the "sit down" option as somebody posted on the other page...

Also, would be great if the party going on at the back, could affect the helo`s flight, I mean the physics stuff, and ofcourse If the pilot or driver decides to do some stunts those poor guys in the back of the vehicle/plane will also have some serious difficulties with `feely` walking http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif
Am I talking about game2 here?
http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/xmas_o.gif

xnodunitx

Jul 24 2005, 16:43

Heh yeah I already see it,a blackhawk does a nose dive and then lifts up quickly,eh the nose does anyway and all the people fall out.

I can already see the "wtf's" and "aaauuugh you suck!" on the screen

gandalf the white

Jul 24 2005, 17:37

three pages, and as usual, what I wanted to propose those entire three pages got mentioned just before I post http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif .

Aircraft carriers are one thing. the LSD is another.... or what about the LST? "Poseidon 51" finally gets a bit more functional! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

Anyhow, don't forget that thesame principle can also be applied to the Antonov 124 , or Antonov 225... now admit: who doesn't wants to be able to move freely in the largest plane on earth (http://www.jetphotos.net/images/a/ADB-225-UR-82060-LNZ-230303-5.jpg.45002.jpg) ? Also, for inter-island CTI's this would be great! instead of transporting armour via ship, load four T80's on a antonov, fly over to the other island (airfield got taken in by airmobile earlier) and proceed? http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

Don't forget that moving around in aircraft, better collision detection, and a Airbus A380 addon, could make for some counter-terrorist actions that make CS:s look like a child's toy on Lan partys http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

Mwahahaha!! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/inlove.gif

pong2cs

Jul 24 2005, 17:49

But parachuting from vehicles would have to be refined a bit, seeing as you are no longer capable of selecting "Eject".

D.murphy man

Jul 24 2005, 18:37

Maybe some sort of parachute eqiupment that fills in a speacial eqiupment slot underneather ur binoculares and night vision. and when your above X altatude and not inside a plane (nearest object command? i dunno) then u get the option to pull ur chute.

Extremeus Decimus

Jul 24 2005, 18:49

The Links posted on the first page don't appear to be working for me, does anybody else have this problem or is it just me?

Thanks for your time
Extremeus Decimus

bravo 6

Jul 24 2005, 19:10

they were working, but not at the moment. try them later..

Heatseeker

Jul 24 2005, 20:13

I pray toward new features from VBS1 in ArmA http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif , but I think, that new features from VBS1 will be in Game2 http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif
Something worth pointing out, VBS1 is still a improved flashpoint engine with some optimisations, new features and functions, technicaly these could be implemented and used in our current opf too, it doesnt utilise the same engine version BIS is currently working on for ARMA so im sure these and other features will be built in the newer ARMA engine.

An interesting quote from seventh from the vbsresources forum:

Quote[/b] ]This is only availble for those already in the sim. Join in progress will not be implemented in VBS1, however as you may know it is being examined for future versions of the FP engine (which future VBS products will be based upon).
This is related to JIP, wich we all know will be present in ARMA so we can assume future version of VBS will be based on the superior ARMA engine, so0O.. i believe that they wont import vbs features into ARMA has some of you sugest but quite the oposite, i think these features will be integrated in the new engine wich will be much better http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .

ebns72

Jul 24 2005, 20:45

Sputnik Monroe

Jul 25 2005, 04:27

I have mixed feelings about this. I hope that you can strap into a seat and have to lock vehicle cargo down. What I'm hoping is that gravity will work and if a bunch CS players are standing up inside the black hawk instead of sitting down, well then they'll all fall out when the black hawk makes a hard bank.

I totally agree on the parachute idea. It should be an inventory item for pilots and paratroopers only. I would really like to see parachuting from choppers removed.

I can see free movement in a vehicle and parachutes as an item being very cool though. Imagine stepping out the back of a C130 and waiting until the lowest minimum altitude to open your chute? Finally HALO missions in Flashpoint, (not the Xbox game HALO... I mean HALO High Altitude Low Opening)

funnyguy1

Jul 25 2005, 06:16

For parachutes, I would kinda like to see it the way FDF does it with parachutes being an inventory item. If you have one, you can jump out of the back of a plane and while in midair falling use the "open chute" option. But if you don't have one...well, you're screwed http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
yeah, that would rock...

offtopic abit: remember that video when some guy flyig UH (dunno what model) was trying to attach the bird to the flying cistern. When he dived down rapidly, and then quickly pulled up, the blades cut the fueling outrigger (?) in front of the helo, because of gravity (I was overload? I don`t know how to explain it in english).

Just a thought about how phisics could affect the flight, but still It`s a bit far from arma I think...

Anyway, what could be done, besides freely walking inside the helos ofcourse, is that they could make those helo blades could kill you. In some situations in ofp it was just crazy when It did nothing to you http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif

PrivateNoob

Jul 26 2005, 15:07

Honestly, the site is down. Hasnt anyone saved the movies and can host them again?

4 IN 1

Jul 26 2005, 16:15

we might need 2 type of chute, one for normal use, less controlable faster droping and would open just out side craft, and one for advance use(HALO/HAHO stuff), much more controlable and stay longer in air, open by player command

since you could have paradrop mission with chopper, i see no needs to remove it, may be just removing the pilot/gunners eject function would do the job

ixnay

Jul 26 2005, 18:01

Here's a mirror of those videos.

Enhanced Ground Vehicles Part 1 (http://ixnay201.shackspace.com/CT_AV.rar)

Enhanced Ground Vehicles Part 2 (http://ixnay201.shackspace.com/CT_BV.rar)

Enhanced Air Transport (http://ixnay201.shackspace.com/enhanced.rar)

Extremeus Decimus

Jul 26 2005, 21:56

Thanks very much ixnaymu9!

http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

ThruYerStErNuM

Jul 27 2005, 01:47

Mirrors to uncompressed videos for the impatient:

Enhanced Ground Vehicles Part 1 (http://waskosky.com/mirrors/CT_AV.mpg)

Enhanced Ground Vehicles Part 2 (http://waskosky.com/mirrors/CT_BV.mpg)

Enhanced Air Transport (http://waskosky.com/mirrors/enhanced.mpg)

This is really exciting, use more imagination. We could slay borg on the starship Enterprise, we could recreate Mario and destroy King Guba. You can already jump with a little scripting in flashpoint, so ArmA could be a platformer http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/yay.gif

Denwad

Jul 28 2005, 06:55

people might be suprised by the fact that the guy in the back was able to shoot his AUG with 100% accuracy, but guess what, the door gunner on a Mi-8 is able to do the same in OFP.

pintle mount doesn't absorb much recoil, i'd imagine the gun would bounce around alot, inaddition to the whole aircraft stuttering from the rotors.

D.murphy man

Jul 28 2005, 11:04

This is really exciting, use more imagination. We could slay borg on the starship Enterprise, we could recreate Mario and destroy King Guba. You can already jump with a little scripting in flashpoint, so ArmA could be a platformer http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/yay.gif
Heh, what ever floats your boat i supose. But yea i was thinking the same thing for giant space combat mod. Just think we could have giant space war ships that you can fly fighters out of and dog fight whiles 2 massive warships battle it out. And even try boarding the enemy ship with some of your buddies and take it over http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif Now that would be cool

Or even a pirate mod, the modding possibilites are endless (well they where for OFP but..even more so now.)

Scrub

Jul 29 2005, 16:52

Quote[/b] ]ebns72 Posted on July 24 2005,16:45
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For parachutes, I would kinda like to see it the way FDF does it with parachutes being an inventory item. If you have one, you can jump out of the back of a plane and while in midair falling use the "open chute" option. But if you don't have one...well, you're screwed

That'd be nice for a mission that goes bad, everybody needs to race to get parachutes and bail before the plane ditches.. not very realistic, but exciting nonetheless.. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

Batukhan

Aug 20 2005, 10:46

Guys, anyone seen this? I bet it's gonna be in AA: dyncamic building destruction (http://www.virtualbattlespace2.com/media/movies/movies_1x.rar)

redface

Aug 20 2005, 11:00

Guys, anyone seen this? I bet it's gonna be in AA: dyncamic building destruction (http://www.virtualbattlespace2.com/media/movies/movies_1x.rar)
before you all start downloading this 37 Mb. file like I did:

it contains VBS1 videos that have been around for some time now (dynamicBuild_a, AFM_a), so nothing new (as opposed to the movies mentioned earlier in this thread marked as "VBS - Enhanced")

there is no indication at all that these features will be in ArmA

DBR_ONIX

Aug 20 2005, 11:11

The dynamic builiding blowing up video is (AFAIK) DIB for VBS1, a thing veery similar will be included with the Falklands mod I'm lead to belive..
- Ben

Nephilim

Aug 20 2005, 11:25

a bird twitterd me that the shown vids wont be in arma
but dib prolly will

colossus

Aug 20 2005, 11:35

Nah, no chance that dynamic building destruction will be in ArmA. Luckly we have seen that "Game 2" has it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/yay.gif

DBR_ONIX

Aug 20 2005, 12:12

a thing veery similar will be included with the Falklands mod
Yeh i'm repeating my self http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
It's entirely possible in OFP, and it'll be just as possible (As it's the same) for ArmA, and it'll run better.
Several people (Col Klink, Manticore, someone who's name I forgot who made a properly destrucuble wall for testing the idea, and probobaly others) have made desroryable buildings, or parts of buildings anyway, like this (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/screenshots/sotw121.jpg)

It's not whether or not it's possible, it's wheter or not someone will release something using it.. Col Klink is making the DIB for VBS, so couldn't release it for OFP (if I'm not wrong, again http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif), ..for example..
- Ben

Batukhan

Aug 20 2005, 14:55

So you guys are rather sure it won't be in AA?

redface

Aug 20 2005, 15:07

So you guys are rather sure it won't be in AA?
it has not been confirmed on any of the official ArmA screens so far

it may become possible as an addon anytime anywhere, but as long it is not part of the engine itself, it is likely to have a massive impact on FPS

(I won't imagine a random set of 10 tanks shooting 10 buildings kept together completely by fast setpos loops)

Heatseeker

Aug 20 2005, 15:22

So you guys are rather sure it won't be in AA?
If its not coded into the "core" and works seperatly requiring specific building models and scripts i dont think it will be in arma, a improved damage system instead of the old cardboard crumble would be very welcome, for buildings, structures and vehicals though considering BIS is keeping OFP user made material compatible with ARAS it all leads me to believe that damage model wont be improved much if at all.
I think DIB would require alot of work on the large amount of buildings and structures that will decorate ARAS islands so i dont think BIS will use this solution, we can only speculate http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif ...
edit: Its not really the deformation of destroyed structures and units that look kinda bad, its the damaged/deformed models i would like to see improved, i would like to see them change/crumble into something more believable and without such a weird impact on the landscape http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/crazy_o.gif .

Ti0n3r

Aug 20 2005, 15:36

So you guys are rather sure it won't be in AA?
Im sure it wont.

Batukhan

Aug 20 2005, 15:45

Oh... stupid me, i thought that building damage in the video was calculated..

killerwhale

Aug 20 2005, 16:32

I cant tell how this game is different than the original flashpoint, same thing...........like Medal of honor, Spearhead, breakthrough, few more guns and some graphic changes. crap

Ti0n3r

Aug 20 2005, 16:46

DBR_ONIX

Aug 20 2005, 16:49

Theres new VBS1 videos, for the upcomming(? may be out already, not sure) patch, that allows moving around in vehicles!!!11!one!!1 (Also shooting personal weapons, moving other vehicles).
Seemed to work very well, only thing the vehicle kinda went a bit funny when it touched the side of the heli, but it's a big improvment on what happens if the same thing happens in OFP (The car can flip in OFP, for example http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif)
You could run about, get in the vehicle (didn't see the person drive it in there, but I assume it works the same as walking about), fire the weapon, also didn't see them jump out, or load AI on to it (There was another person, which could well have been an AI)
Another one showed the player getting in an APC (In back), then it drove of, the player opened the roof, and stood up, and fired of the weapon out the hatch http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/biggrin_o.gif

A friend sent the videos today, and it looks.. tempting enough to buy VBS1 for it alone http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif
But I'll wait and see what ArmA is like, and what VBS1 is like by then too http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

Yeh I know it's a complete rip-off, but I play OFP enough to merit it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
- Ben

Heatseeker

Aug 20 2005, 17:23

I cant tell how this game is different than the original flashpoint, same thing...........like Medal of honor, Spearhead, breakthrough, few more guns and some graphic changes. crap
You are actually very wrong http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/welcome.gif .
Thing is you can add, improve, change crap and it will still be... better crap, but if you pick a slightly outdated but unique masterpiece and you improve it, add to it, etc it will evolve into a better masterpiece.
That i believe is the case with the OFPR/ARAS transition, it will be alot more than just a expantion, it will be a transition to a better engine version, better lighting, models and textures, colision detection and problably more new and improved features and ofcourse new content http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/wink_o.gif .
It will be like a new OFP game on a improved engine but generously including the previous work (3 games in one package).
What more can you ask http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif ...

redface

Aug 20 2005, 19:50

A friend sent the videos today, and it looks.. tempting enough to buy VBS1 for it alone http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/huh.gif

Yeh I know it's a complete rip-off, but I play OFP enough to merit it http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
- Ben
hmm I appreciate your enthusiasm but those videos were already mentioned in this thread http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif

Batukhan

Aug 20 2005, 21:04

Yes.. the very thread IS about those videos.. hehe..

ThruYerStErNuM

Aug 21 2005, 00:55

Since this kind of speculation doesnt seem to warrant a locking...

So you guys are rather sure it won't be in AA?
Im sure it wont.
It seems the only reason people have for doubting that these improvements will be in ArmA are that 'theres no reason to believe they will'? I would need a better reason than that considering games like Soldner look worse than ArmA and still have dynamic buildings and excellent physics. My reason to believe dynamic buildings and near-Game2 physics will be included is this statement by Marek in the letter to the community
Quote[/b] ]Good news for addon makers is that porting their work into ArmA will help prepare them for future releases of our engine, which in the coming years will expand over many areas the ability of our technology.
Maybe porting INTO ArmA means we have to take our old models and do something in the new model editor to make them work with the physics engine features? Such as having sides in models with certain strengths and mass and properties. There is no need to break up the model in the largely complicated way that DIB does when the game engine has a "reworked physical simulation and collision detection". Why would they rework the physics and leave out these features in ArmA but not Game2!

Nephilim

Aug 21 2005, 08:47

as vbs1 arma wont use any diffrent model format

itll still be p3d as it is in vbs1

esti_the_big

Aug 21 2005, 10:48

I'm kinda confused now... I mean, the video with dynamic destruction is something being developed for vbs1. Now, it seems its going to be dynamic - so its pretty sure going to be a change in the core of ofp or vbs1. I now read theres already something seîmiliar in development by falklands mod. but that seems to be using setpos commands, its heavy scripting, but not really dynamic. So you cant compare that with the DDS in the videos.

But why is it so impossible to include dds in AA? Why can't or won't BIS just simply replace the ofp building models with the new dds building models, that doesn't mean they have to replace every house or object in the island, theres enough ways to solve this pratically. I mean, AFAIK the forests in AA will also be "destructable" meaning the trees can now be overrun (so the forest objects have been altered and enhanced) so why is it so impossible to have enhance buildings as well?

And when it comes to damage with the cars, maybe BIS is doing some practical solution, maybe allowing both types of vehilcles in the game. The included vehicles in AA already have improved damage models, the community addons that will all work in AA simply won't have them except the authors edit the vehicle so it can benefit from the new damage model...

And as said correctly above, BIS wants to prepare with AA the community for game 2. That means they might even want AA addons to be game2 compatible, and game 2 will obviously have big changes in physics. Game 2 vehicles will pretty sure have a very improved visual damage system. So its quite possible AA will already have the new damage features of game2.

For me game 2 won't be really the great leap in graphics and physics, in the core elements of the graphics engine. To me, the big engine improvements of game2 are going to be in AI, scripting and especially mission and campaign structure. Most of the work is going into those, enhancing the ofp engine with better physics and making it more modern in terms visual aspects isn't nearly as much work as actually changing the whole structure of gamplay (hell, its going to be completely dynamic, thats the big amount of work BIS has to do...)

So really, is it so uneralistic that dds and vehicle damage are going to be implented in AA?

Nephilim

Aug 21 2005, 12:55

its not impossible
it simply wont be featured in arma

thats all

DBR_ONIX

Aug 21 2005, 14:25

hmm I appreciate your enthusiasm but those videos were already mentioned in this thread http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/whistle.gif
Oh, sorry, just never payed attention to this thread till I saw those to videos, but they weren't impressive enough for me to go though a few hundered posts for http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

Anyway.. It's possible that BI could include (realisticly) desroyable buildings, but chances are they wont. I it is possible in ArmA, but it wont come with the game. Someone else will have to include it (unless...)
But it is deffintly in "Game2", proof.. here (http://ofp.gamezone.cz/news/pics3/opf23.jpg)

- Ben

Heatseeker

Aug 21 2005, 14:32

...For me game 2 won't be really the great leap in graphics and physics, in the core elements of the graphics engine. To me, the big engine improvements of game2 are going to be in AI, scripting and especially mission and campaign structure...
You seem confused, if you compare Game2 and Arma pictures the diference in graphics is huge, Game2 will be a great leap in terms of graphics judging by the pictures.

Regarding dib, dib is a modification/addon CK started working on, its not a engine upgrade, its an addon with buildings that can be blown up resorting to external scripts. Its not a upgrade that will make all buildings in the game colapse nor would BIS use this aproach to model damage in the whole game i think.
I believe dib will give users the possibility of placing and using some destructible buildings on their maps for specific reasons/objectives and thats it.

Quote[/b] ] My reason to believe dynamic buildings and near-Game2 physics will be included is this statement by Marek in the letter to the community

Quote[/b] ]Good news for addon makers is that porting their work into ArmA will help prepare them for future releases of our engine, which in the coming years will expand over many areas the ability of our technology.

IMO this could be regarding the use of diferent texturing type and techniques (arma soldiers look somewhat normalmapped), pixel shadders and other visual enhancements on the models and textures, etc. This is how i think arma will help prepare addon makers for future engine versions, graphics wise mostly, afterall arma is still a 1.5 version of OFP engine and Game 2 is still in early development http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/confused_o.gif .

esti_the_big

Aug 21 2005, 15:24

Quote[/b] ]
You seem confused, if you compare Game2 and Arma pictures the diference in graphics is huge, Game2 will be a great leap in terms of graphics judging by the pictures.

To be honest, I don't think its so huge. Yes, BIS is going to create all new models for game2, a much higher polycount, far better and advanced texture techniques, far more detailed vegetation. But thats all artist work, I don't think the technical features of game2 will be really that different as in AA. They'll upgrade the engine so its state of the art when its released (newer dx maybe), but AA already includes all necessary features: A faster. more modern core (allowing more detailed models for example), new textures (normal mapping), new features for island making (the forests for example), probably new physics (for vehicles etc), and maybe Dynamic Destructable buildings. Thats all graphic or physics in the end, AA is never going to look as good as it could because BIS is not redoing all the models for islands, troops, vehicles, thats saved for game 2.

Now that the graphics engine has been actually built resp. updated, BIS can start working on the artistic part and especially on the new mission system and AI for game2, which are obviously tightly connected. This new mission structure is the hard part of development I'd say, a completely dynamic war isn't easy to program, and that is going to be the really new thing in game2. The graphics engine of course will still be enhanced so its state of the art, but its core is finished, and combined with ofp1 it gives us AA.

This is the reason why I believe AA will or at least could contain dds. I hope they'll at least provide us with the technology, the community will surely do some island remakes with dds for all buildings.

Heatseeker

Aug 21 2005, 15:51

I dont think Arma and Game2 will be so close in technology, game2 will need to be alot more powerfull to draw all that quality we have seen in large scale, i dont think arma engine could handle anything like that plus alot of arma will still be OFP like the a.i. and gameplay problably, i think the fact that one is basicaly a improved OFP and the other is a whole new game speaks for itself, i also dont think arma will get rid of all the major limitations we currently have but game2 problably will http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif .

DBR_ONIX

Aug 21 2005, 16:37

AFAIK Game 2 uses the Poisendon2 engine, where as OFP uses Poisendon 1 engine, and VBS1 uses an expanded version of this, and ArmA is a more expanded version of this also.. {edit:} then VBS2 will use an expanded Poisendon 2 engine etc..
- Ben

ThruYerStErNuM

Aug 21 2005, 20:00

Quote[/b] ]basicaly a improved OFP and the other is a whole new game

Quote[/b] ]VBS1 uses an expanded version of this, and ArmA is a more expanded version of this also..
Why do you both believe its still the old engine when he says

Quote[/b] ]reworked physical simulation and collision detection
I think that maybe because the content of ArmA is the same as OFP, one would think the engine is still the same, but if the content is fully compatable with Game2, and if they say the engine is 'REworked' and not 'improved' then the engine will be much closer to what they now have in Game2.

So I agree with esti_the_big but I dont see the reason for the assumption that ArmA is anything like OFP1 or VBS1 considering the amount of time BIS has been putting into improving the engine. They ported all the content to the XBOX console with a new engine, and they made a playable demo for E3 for Game2. Engine comes first, content second.

DBR_ONIX

Aug 21 2005, 21:54

I think the important word in your post is "reworked", not "remade".. It's an improved versoin of the engine, like I said.. well, ment to say http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/icon_rolleyes.gif (it was kinda obvious I ment that.. I hope.. it still uses the OFP1 engine though)
Even Posiendon 2 will use bits of OFP1's code I'm sure, unless BIS are writing a TOTALY new engine

..meh, who cares, it's all semi-pointless guess work, really http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
- Ben

snoops_213

Aug 21 2005, 23:21

Guys the info is already out there. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif
Because XBox has such low specs BIS had to opitmize its core code for it to even boot properly on XBox. This means that most if not all of it has to be re-written. BIS have already said that ArmA is being made with lessons learnt from Ofp Xbox and VBS1.

Why wouldn't we see some new things in ArmA then? There is an interview with BIS that says that there are requests made to BIS/BIA that come from both gaming community and the Armed Forces requesting the same thing, ie multi-gunner, moving around in vehicles, DDS etc. Now BIS have an oppertunity to incorperate alot of these into th core, instead of using scripts and updates, which can cause conflicts.

Alot of people saying its in VBS1 but it wont come to ArmA, why? If ArmA is an optermized Ofp1/VBS1 engine then it would be the logical step to include everything into the core while they have a chance. If ArmA is so much more stable and runs better than Ofp1/Vbs1 why wouldn't BIA use ArmA engine as its next big upgrade to VBS?

Just my 2 cents http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/smile_o.gif

colossus

Aug 22 2005, 01:05

snoops_213

Aug 22 2005, 01:37

Yes I think they will leave some goodies till game 2 but why would you leave something out that is already incorperated into the previous game? If anything is left till game2 i think it would be multi gunner(check latest screens, new M1 without commander or loaders MGs) but things like dynamic destruction(already done? wip? for VBS1) would be included.
The movies on this thread are what I'm talking about. Why leave these feature out now, only to impliment them a couple of months down the track with the use of scripts and patches when they could just hard code it in? Why not optermize them with the engine? Why add to development costs in the future when it could be implimented right now?

For now all we can do is pray and wait. Reality is, I'm not not to phazed, I will buy it just to support BIS/BIA for their future project(s).

PS @<hidden> I consider Game2 a "goodie" all to itself, as we will have seen nothing like it before or for a long time after it comes out! http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif

DBR_ONIX

Aug 22 2005, 11:46

I have no dout* that the Xbox version has made the codes more "lighter" then what OFP originaly had.
Multi-gunners is a likely possibility and so is moving around in vehicles, but I think they will leave some goodies until "Game 2" (Like dynamic buildings)
*(Not sure if it's spelled like that)
Of course, the xbox is 700mhz, and has 64mb ram.. It wouldn't run OFP, espically to any decent playable level.. But.. the developers know EXACTLY what hardware is in it, so they can create the game so it'll run best on that system, where as with PCs.. look at the "post your specs" threads.. They vary a *little* http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
("Doubt" btw http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif)
I think, if they include the moving around in vehicles thing, I dont see why (If it's not included in the shipped game) someone couldn't use the fact you can move an object around "pefectly" (Compared to what it is now http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif) in the vehicle, and sit a second, third, 80th machinegun in the heli. Just like you can drive a car into the back, shove a MG and it should follow it, no?
Thats assuming they do include it, which as two people have pointed out seems reasonable.. Espically as it's a patch (The moving in vehicles thing) I think they ("hope they" anyway) include this, but the destructable buildings thing is an addon-pack to VBS1, which will be out not long before/after ArmA, and I dont know if they would want to include this in the Ł30 game, rather than the Ł80 + Ł40 "Simulation"/addon pack (From which I'm sure their get people buying other packs too, so another Ł50 or more). Thats what I would be sure many companys would do, but BIS, maybe not http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif
Something in the "DIB in ArmA"'s favour is that VBS1 is basicly made so the millatry can use it (They aren't allowed to use OFP as a training thing, it has to be aimed at the millatry, I guess this is so people can't use the "OH NO MY CHILDREN ARE BECOMMING TRAINED KILLERS" argument against OFP.. http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/mad_o.gif ), and a large ammount of what VBS1 is about is letting whatever-area-of-the-shooting-other-people-company's request specific modifications to be made for them, so it's different from OFP/ArmA, and hopefully they will try to make ArmA a step up from VBS1, then VBS2 a step up from ArmA, and Game2 a step up from VBS2.. Seems very logical, their's an incentive for people to buy the new "civillian" game, and also better code to improve upon (Which will be tested, and the community reporting any bugs, and suggesting new features etc like the what-you-want-in-Game2 threads, and here http://forums.bistudio.com/oldsmileys/tounge2.gif)

Same kind of thing, but you don't want Game2 to just be a graphical update for ArmA, by including everything

But I'm sure we'll find out in a few months when the game is released..
*Prods conversation back to VBS1 videos..*
- Ben