Join In Progress is not the main problem

[CanisDEK]

I have played the Ghost Recon Demo for a few days now. GR does not have JIP, but it never bothered me. The ubi.com program is a bit better and faster that Gamespy, but the real difference is in the game. Ghost recon can support 36 players without any lag issues and the time it takes from joining to the game actually starting is much shorter that in OFP. The play area in GR is very small compared to OFP BUT it is perfect for the number of players that usually are in a game (12-36 is best). When you are in the game you have some clear goals and the gameplay if very smooth:
1. Control a certain area
2. Rescue the hostages
or
3. Just kill other players

In OFP you might have clear goals too in CTF, but often the play area is so big that the small number of players completely destroy the gameplay. Also there is often way too many vehicles for the number of players so a CTF just becomes a destroy the other teams vehicles game. OPF might have some nice and huge islands but because of the low number of players supported the game is better suited for very small play areas.

I think many people would get a much better OFP MP experience if the DEV team made some very cool MP maps tailored to the gameplay possible in OFP. They should be able to make a fair amout of MP maps in no time.

Perhaps the DEV team should even consider making a few MP islands... that could really improve the gameplay. MP has been a huge disappointment for many players and I think the missions are to blame. Of course the net code has been a big problem too but 1.29 is A LOT better than the initial european release... it still needs work IMO but I think the DEVs can make us all enjoy MP fully is they:
1. make MP islands and missions
2. Tweak the netcode... 16 players, 32 players or more??? 16 would do but anything below is too few for a good game like OFP.

[Dawdler]

Yes a small multiplayer map would be perfect. But will it flow better than a big?
The map is graphics, smaller map == higher fps.
Does smaller map == less lag?http://www.flashpoint1985.com/ikonboard3/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif
What it does mean though is extremely better gameplay. I mean an island 1/20 of everon would be fine. Pure action, no "where are you?" "Im 6000m to the north, will run to make a sneak attack, its only like 5500m!".
A devs oppinion would be good, but they seem to have made it their obligation not to respond to any MP suggestions whatsoever...

(Edited by Dawdler at 10:33 am on Nov. 11, 2001)

[Suchey]

there are multiplay missions available which restrict play to a small portion of land...the boundries are clearly marked and wandering beyond them results in death.

[Dawdler]

That was not what we meant. You still draw terrain beyond the boundries, and you still have to load the entire map, taking more memory, be prepared to walk out and perhaps seeing that tree 5,000m away. In conclusion, one still have to have the entire map matrix in memory (Im not good at 3d graphics, so this is just my way of saying it)
It was the size of the map, not the mission that was referred to.

[Nuku]

CanisDEK, you repeatedly post about GR being able to hold 12-36 players without lag. Are these co-op servers or deathmatch/team vs team games?

My consistent experience is GR cannot support more than 4 players in a CO-OP "Mission" type game.

I've experimented with Co-op "Firefight" and "Recon" games with up to 6, but the server tends to crash in mid-game.

Give me an IP of these super-GR servers you're using, and I'll shake em down with me and my buddies (greng@home.com).

[CanisDEK]

Was that the demo you tried, or one of those shady betas? http://www.flashpoint1985.com/ikonboard3/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif Anyway it was TDM, SAR and hamburger hill. Team games. I have had a server running co-op too but that was just because it was late and only 8 people joined the server. It ran fine and playing 36 players in a co-op might not be that fun. I'm not into GR because of co-op, I prefer playing team games like SAR or HH... or plain TDM. Besides my server is a 1333Mhz Tbird with 512MB RAM, which might also influence the games especially in co-op. My connection is 512kb upload. Most connections have a lower upload than download and you might not have as good a upload as you think. On a 2Mb line which we have a few of in our squad you could host 36 players in GR. OFP has some serious lag issues. Even with a ping of 100 OFP can show you random lag crazyness. With a ping of 300 GR will still run smooth, but you will of course see a delay in your actions.

Besides 36 players is not that much... I have played on Tribes2 servers with over 150 players.

[Dawdler]

I played a clan combat yesterday with all 80-100 in ping. The third match it lagged like ####. I mean, locking up for 1 min, suddenly be 1000m from last position (with flag on me strange enough, did my ghost take it while the lag was on??), get runned over by an invisible truck and fly 2000m back to our own town was fun, not only for me though.
OFP handles extremely bad even with low pings.

-EDIT- We where 10 ppl btw.

(Edited by Dawdler at 9:51 pm on Nov. 22, 2001)

[barret]

Wow, ever tried swat 3? It always lags no matter what level. Also Some of the best mappers (not including me) will make boundries that are unescapeable, and that means that it stays a "LIL SMALL MAP". Also one thing that this game has over GR,S3,Doom,Quake,Duke Nukem, Hitman codename43, is that this game has dedicated snipers on both sides (not including half life), I think this game is best fit out for huge multiplay, off of servers that run off of T1. Also the best way to fight the lag: HOST!

[Col Rambo SBS]

Still think that Joining in progress is needed if you want games with more than 6 players.
look at DF2 +DFLW, the map area available to those games is Huge as well, they just place the opposing bases close together. I can play Df2 fine with pings up to 500, my ping in Flashpoint is always under 300 and its definately a bit ropey.
Still as I said, for anything more complicated than small Co-op in Flashpoint, players need the ability to join when they want, this should be a server option. Only then will we see it reach its potetial of massive online wars.

Thats me had my moan, I'll sit quietly now.