Wargame: European Escalation Gameplay

[Cripsis]

RI0AfpyQd4Y

[***LeGeNDK1LLER***]

watching close this project. seems nice.

[Mr. Charles]

Seems like they are fighting in good ol' germany ;)

Nice Game :D

[SiC-Disaster]

I'll wait untill i've seen more improvements over RUSE :)

[JonPL]

Any info\features pls?

[.Taffy]

Just found this today and I am very interested, love that you can go from a view of the whole battlefield to a detailed close up each unit. Hopefullythe control over units will be as wide ranging too. We haven'ty seen much of the infantry but I hope they really come into their own in urban areas with effective use of cover.

I think the closed beta has started, an open one will come along at some point and release is expected Q1 2012.

[ziiip]

New trailer looks amazing as sheet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_xLCrq8b4c&feature=player_embedded

[colossus]

Looking damn good, but I'm guessing it's not comparable World in Conflict. Sure would like to see another type of game like that, and maybe this is the one that can accomplish that.

[Slatts]

looking forward to this :)

[ziiip]

Looking damn good, but I'm guessing it's not comparable World in Conflict. Sure would like to see another type of game like that, and maybe this is the one that can accomplish that.

I though it was WiC with better graphics.

[colossus]

I don't know, to be honest. I haven't seen much gameplay yet, apart from the video in the original post that is; which I can't make much out of (no sound and crude alpha version).
It probably is a bit like WiC, but I suspect it's mainly very similar to RUSE at certain points.

[Max Power]

Moving to games subforum :)

[Cripsis]

New gameplay footage -
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I won't be buying European Escalation as the gameplay looks far too arcadish, but I wish Combat Mission Shock Force had similar graphics.

[GRS]

I can't wait. Combat Mission put me to sleep.

[.Taffy]

I though it was WiC with better graphics.

I get the impression it's WiC but with ARMA tactics, scale and freedom!

EDIT: And much less restricive camera!

[maturin]

Did I just see hundreds of OPFOR infantry ambush a NATO column by sprinting at it from both sides, firing on the run? It looked like the first battle in The Two Towers, ffs.

[Smurf]

Did I just see hundreds of OPFOR infantry ambush a NATO column by sprinting at it from both sides, firing on the run? It looked like the first battle in The Two Towers, ffs.

Everything was going well until I saw that. And the giants red tracers. Really, wtf?

[GRS]

Yes, here's to hoping that's not really representative of how it plays out. Even if so its not like many other strategy games take problems like that into consideration so I don't see it being much worse just because of that.

[Tonci87]

Yes that was also my WTF?! moment. It looked really silly...
But I hope its just for the trailer.

[Slatts]

from playing ruse i know that large numbers of infantry could take down armour...light armour mind so thats why you would do that

although armour would be more effective :p

hope this one turns out good, i cant wait for it

[Breakerchase]

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Here's some actual gameplay for those who seem to be deterred by the mediocre trailer. IMO, it looks like it draws a lot from the old Close Combat games.

[maturin]

Yeah, that video changes everything. Any modern RTS without that kind of scale can never pretend to be remotely realistic. Even that WiC mod with the lovingly reproduced weapons systems is like a cartoon when you are always engaging with hellfires and MLRS from fifty yards away. With the kind of scale in Wargame, you can actually use ATGMs and artillery as they are meant to be used. Hopefully it can be modded, too.

[Maddmatt]

I'm not usually into strategy games, but that looks pretty awesome.

[CameronMcDonald]

Oh yes, he says engine at 1:08. Lollerskating.

[Tonci87]

Is he french?

[Slatts]

Yeah, that video changes everything. Any modern RTS without that kind of scale can never pretend to be remotely realistic. Even that WiC mod with the lovingly reproduced weapons systems is like a cartoon when you are always engaging with hellfires and MLRS from fifty yards away. With the kind of scale in Wargame, you can actually use ATGMs and artillery as they are meant to be used. Hopefully it can be modded, too.

i did read somewhere that they may add mod tools


Is he french?

eugen systems are french

[ProfTournesol]

Is he french?

Yep. Thanks god we don't rely only on Ubisoft :rolleyes:

[Tonci87]

Some more gameplay:

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The tracers are waaay overdone. I hope that it will be possible to reduce or disable them.

[ProfTournesol]

The tracers are waaay overdone. I hope that it will be possible to reduce or disable them.

I guess it's on purpose, as an helper in the wargame.

[maturin]

Yeah, it's clear that they aren't meant to be tracers so much as player-convenience imaginary spotting rounds, like in Empire Total War.

The problem is that the engine doesn't tone them down when you are zoomed in. They have enormous trails of fire for tank rounds, that don't even align to the barrel.

[GRS]

I just hope infantry combat doesn't suck like in most game like this.

[Breakerchase]

NDA has been lifted. If any of you got questions about the game, I'd be happy to answer them.

[Tonci87]

Are the Tracers really that big? Can you tune them down?

[Breakerchase]

For "big gun" projectiles, yes. I think Eugen deliberately put them in as a visual aid/indicator for the player. The closed beta build did not have any options for tweaking that.

[GRS]

Is the infantry combat worth anything or do they just run around take more hits than humans can take?

[Breakerchase]

Infantry combat is rather abstracted. You won't see individual infantrymen doing intricate fire and movement but it's hard to say anything about "taking more hits than humans can take".

[GRS]

I guess what I'm getting at is is the infantry combat believable? Or is it kind of an afterthought like in many games like this.

[Smurf]

The game is comparable to what? WIC, RUSE, Close Combat...? Looks like WIC on steroids.

Are you enjoying it? How is the MP? Performace?

[Breakerchase]

I guess what I'm getting at is is the infantry combat believable? Or is it kind of an afterthought like in many games like this.

Hard question to answer since the infantry combat doesn't have much granularity since you mostly give orders to whole platoons rather than individual squads. (Compared to games like Combat Mission where it definitely attempts to depict detailed infantry combat).


The game is comparable to what? WIC, RUSE, Close Combat...? Looks like WIC on steroids.

Are you enjoying it? How is the MP? Performace?

Like a larger-scale (and appropriately streamlined due to difference in scale) Close Combat IMO, which I enjoyed. Performance seemed pretty good but the closed beta MP netcode was very shoddy--random disconnects could happen which I hope Eugen has addressed. (e.g. Player 3 has 9999 ping and his units are not moving at all, 5 minutes later he disconnects)

[GRS]

So far I'm liking what I'm hearing. This game has a road network for supplies right? Is that well implemented or is it like in ruse were you have no control over it and your supply trucks will take the shortest path, even if an enemy unit is blocking it? Or do I have this all wrong?

[Breakerchase]

Yes, there is a road network. You have to use the "MOVE FAST" command to have your units use roads to move to their destination. Otherwise right click move will have your units ignore roads. (Important if you want your frontline combat units use as little fuel as possible moving to the frontline)

[GRS]

So do you like the way the road system works? Supply seems to be were so many wargames are lacking. I hope this one does it right.

[Breakerchase]

The road system is fine. I would have liked the units to use dirt roads if the route was shorter instead of just paved roads. The beta only had 1 map though, so I have no idea how the other maps and their road networks are.

But for supply: Supply trucks carry various amounts of "supply points" (usually 1000-1500 each). To resupply you simply need to park the trucks (they can come in platoons of up to 4 vehicles) close to a unit or platoon that needs restocking (ammo and fuel) and said unit will be automatically resupplied as long the trucks have enough supply points.

Replenishment of ammo won't cost the same, so for example replenishing a platoon of M60A3s could cost 500-600 supply points while restocking a flight of 2 AH-64s with their costly Hellfires could be 900. (Being very rough here)

[GRS]

I like it. It demands supply lines but doesn't force the player into a time consuming micro management system like in MoW. Thanks for all your answers. I'm sure I'll have more questions soon. :D

[Breakerchase]

New video of the recently-implemented NATO icons (the closed beta used generic diamonds):

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[Tonci87]

Looks great

[Slatts]

i guess its the same way as most RTS games for getting units? capture supply points and get money?

[Breakerchase]

i guess its the same way as most RTS games for getting units? capture supply points and get money?

No...you purchase units with a pre-set amount of points. You can gain additional purchase points by placing a command vehicle on marked objective areas when the battle starts.

[ziiip]

I get the feeling this game could use some extra advertising.

[Slatts]

No...you purchase units with a pre-set amount of points. You can gain additional purchase points by placing a command vehicle on marked objective areas when the battle starts.

oooooooh i like the sound of that :)

[.Taffy]

Did you get a chance to try out the urban combat. Is there a noticable shift in the AIs tactics? Do infantry come into their own here?

[Breakerchase]

Urban combat is simplified given the scale of the game. Not sure what you mean by AI but infantry of course is useful for rooting out defenders in the towns and for defending. (In one game I had 2 Strela-3 MANPADS teams in a village defeat a horde of Cobras--combined arms is essential :))

[.Taffy]

Good to hear. What I meant by AI is will the soldiers use cover like walls of their own accord and will the enemy AI garrison buildings etc.

[Breakerchase]

The game doesn't go into the granularity of individual soldiers seeking cover, but infantry units will automatically seek nearby cover (forests, hedgerows, buildings) when stationary.

[Smurf]

I actually believe that is something closer to the WIC infantry than with the COH's one.

[trini scourge]

I've been racking my brain trying to remember where I'd heard the name 'Eugen Systems' before. They made a fantastic game called Act of War that was like a cross between C&C and the Commando series. This is definitely going to be a purchase for me.

[Hellfire257]

I thought WIC was a great game - really enjoyed playing that. I'm certainly looking forward to this one.

[CameronMcDonald]

I liked WiC too, at least in single player. Watching this one with interest.

[Breakerchase]

The unit database is up:

http://www.wargame-ee.com/index.php?rub=database-home

[Slatts]

The unit database is up:

http://www.wargame-ee.com/index.php?rub=database-home

looking good :) plenty of units to play from

[Prydain]

I fear for this game being a crap WiC so where uncertainty takes, piracy gives.

Also, do I see a fucking CG Stingray in the database?

[SiC-Disaster]

How did you get to play this Breakerchase? Some place you could sign up or what?

[Slatts]

just noticed

no planes according to the database..please say it aint so lol

[Breakerchase]

How did you get to play this Breakerchase? Some place you could sign up or what?

Yeah, signed up for the closed beta in October/early November.

If there were planes, I'd love to see them implemented Steel Panthers-style. In a 1970s/1980s Cold War environment the majority of air-delivered munitions were unguided, and most of the aircraft (with the exception of jets like the F-111 and Su-24--they would not belong on the WEE-scale tactical battlefield anyway) did not have all the sophisticated gizmos we expect now in "modern day". :)

[maturin]

I'm sure there are planes for the purposes of flyby airstrikes and drops. Shame not to see loitering A10s and Su-25s, but my impression is that the game strives for realistic scale. And just like in ArmA, you just don't have enough space to do planes well. (I know ArmA has planes, but any competitive RTS-like mission with combined arms would quickly descend into havoc if more than half a dozen jets were involved.)

[Breakerchase]

There were no planes in the beta but I would like to see single airframes purchased for off-map one-use (or even two if the plane has remaining ammo) strikes.

[Mr. Charles]

Downloading the pre-order Beta right now :)

[GRS]

As am I. :D

[Slatts]

speaking of this game :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VkXQ5SbYeNw

[GRS]

It's interesting. I find the unit stat menus to be a pain to read but the game is pretty neat. Anyone want to get a few rounds in let me know.

DELETED cause this game is quite awesome.

[Mondkalb]

Edit: yeah, this is one of the worst strategy games I've played to date. Just arty spam that can hit your FOB at the start of the battle. Fighting for a refund as I type. It has so much potential but its just another RTS spamfest game under the guise of a realistic large-scale tactics game from what I have seen. Your mileage may vary, but I'm certainly not happy.
I totally differ.

I'm blown away by this game!
In my opinion a proper strategy game that finishes what World in Conflict didn't: Full scale cold war. Just without annoying nukes.
Combining units really is necessary, so, as you said, if someone spammed artillery, just haunt them with your Attack helicopter and he'll see that having only artillery is hardly the solution.
I ran into artillery-spammers today, too, and that's how I got rid of them.

And if you encounter communist tank spam, just set up proper flanking units and your APCs are able to ambush them successfully. Yet again just what I did today, without any regrets.
I didn't notice any severe bugs, but then again I'm a BI developer, which pretty much makes my judgement on that subject invalid, but all felt okay.


Over all a very great game so far, but I'm only 4h into it. If I were asked what to compare this game, id descibe this as a World in conflict that was scaled up dramatically and cross-bred with World of Tanks.

[GRS]

When I get arty raped the second the battle starts, I tend not to care anymore. The helo spam is just as bad since AA isn't all that powerful unless you feel like wasting resources on entire platoons of it, at which point it just gets demolished by arty spam. Plus AA is nothing to write home about so you have to either hope the other guy sends his helos too far up or send send your AA forward and hope you don't get arty spammed.

I was hoping for more focus on tanks and infantry, I got the exact opposite. Spam arty, cover arty by spamming helos. But like I said, YMMV. In its current state this game is just not for me. Shame too since that is my favorite era and setting. :(

[CameronMcDonald]

I didn't notice any severe bugs, but then again I'm a BI developer, which pretty much makes my judgement on that subject invalid, but all felt okay.

oh lulz

[GRS]

I've been playing more and honestly, I'm having some fun now. I don't know, I hated it at first despite loving similar games. My biggest grudge now is that infantry seems pretty useless compared to other units.

Still on the fence. Not sure if I want the game or my money.

[CameronMcDonald]

My biggest grudge now is that infantry seems pretty useless compared to other units.

Oh god, reeks of WiC.

[GRS]

They aren't totally useless. Just not very useful. The game is actually pretty fun. Still too much spamming but not as bad as I originally made it seem.

[Gabe_Ruckus]

So far, I've got a pretty positive opinion of the game.

I dealt with an arty and heli spammer in the last game I played, just moved my units out of the FOB area quickly. His arty were stuck across the map, and therefore not very accurate, and he'd dropped most of his deployment points in them and FOBs for ammo. My 6 mobile pieces, on the other hand, accompanied by supply trucks, were able to effectively engage enemy forces and stay mobile to avoid counter-battery fire. The AAA units are effective enough to counter heli-spam, too, and a player who thinks they can effectively win a game with massed arty and choppers is going to find themselves fighting a large combined arms force of cheap units.

The fog of war factor is really well done, too, keeping units in reserve can make or break an engagement, and the infantry are great for setting up an ambush secondary to a tactical retreat, especially the ones armed with guided missile emplacements. I just played a game as the USSR side with no unlocks, and pretty well carried my team through to the win.

I almost never pre-order anything, and I'm glad I did this one. The multiplayer is a lot of fun, and hopefully the SP campaign will offer some strategic depth and force you to think tactically.

Grey areas in the victory conditions are a nice touch, too, it's neat to see a match end in a near victory vs an overwhelming victory, and the replays are pretty illuminating when you're looking at ways people try and exploit certain unit types so you can develop counters.

I might be a bit biased, I used to do S2 stuff for a living, and a game that lets me use key terrain and deceptive tactics is going to score extra points in my book.

---------- Post added at 00:23 ---------- Previous post was at 00:20 ----------

One more note, I'd like to see some kind of tech level restriction in the final game, as it is, the infantry IS kind of useless unless you're using it with ATGMs to cover withdrawing armor, and so I haven't seen infantry on infantry engagements. But there are a LOT of light units like troop transports and M113 mortar carriers, so being able to limit unit types in custom games and a few smaller maps would be great.

[GRS]

Yeah I'm really loving this game. Must have been having a bad day when I first played or something because I don't know what I was thinking. Anyone wants to get a game in let me know.

[SiC-Disaster]

I havent played WEE as I havent bought it but I remember how the infantry behaved in RUSE. I'm not sure how similar they are to eachother, but infantry always seemed kind of weak in RUSE.
But that was untill you park them somewhere in the woods or a town centre, because then they would utterly rape everything they got the drop on. Many people didnt expect this so I used them to good effect in MP, as long as I was playing agressively and I got them out of sight before the enemy could notice them.

[GRS]

Infantry does have its place in this game, but they are easily destroyed once located. You can deploy AT or AA infantry that aren't necessarily strong but have a good range. There is much more to infantry in this one than RUSE. Really, this game is not much like RUSE at all.

[Gabe_Ruckus]

Just found a great use for infantry. AA infantry in the woods are invisible until they're SHOOTING DOWN ALL YOUR CHOPPERS. Just awesome stuff, a really well put together wargame with realistic weapons and pacing. Best since Close Combat, and dethrones Company of Heroes for modern RTS.

If you're in the military and have ever had to do any planning at all, you're going to love this game. Never played a strategy game where holding key terrain was more important than squatting an objective point.

[GRS]

Yeah, I must have been drunk the first time I played. This game is probably my new favorite.

[SaOk]

I also bought this tonight and feels excelent. Usually RTS games are reaction tests, but this is played with tactic skills like combat mission serie. Very great so far. A true PC-game and without publisher having negative effect on it.

[CameronMcDonald]

I've picked it up. It would appear that a well-balanced force is pretty much a must, as well as keeping your units and unit types within support distance of each other while on the move. I like it insofar.

[GRS]

I also bought this tonight and feels excelent. Usually RTS games are reaction tests, but this is played with tactic skills like combat mission serie. Very great so far. A true PC-game and without publisher having negative effect on it.

I couldn't agree more with your reaction comment. I love not having to click as fast as I can at the start to rush units out. It's actual battle strategy that counts, not twitch clicking. This is the ArmA of RTS games to me.

[Janez]

Can anyone tell me if this game has/will have skirmish mode? You know, playing vs. AI or just campaign.

[Slatts]

Can anyone tell me if this game has/will have skirmish mode? You know, playing vs. AI or just campaign.

it does have a singleplayer mode from what i can see in youtube videos, the pre-order beta doesnt have this option open

i would say that there is V AI battles and a campaign

[SaOk]

I made a gameplay video of my latest 2vs2 match that I lost, but had much fun:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_SnRFGbXLI

I was the blue group that tried to hide in thin treeline and constantly got bombed by artillery. Still I got some enemy tanks destroyed as well. :) Great game.

[Mr. Charles]

Haven't had much chance to play it and when i tried to play it, the game would just crash on me.

[Gabe_Ruckus]

Check your video card drivers, also I had trouble getting it started until I disabled 3d vision. I guess it doesn't play nice (Which is fine, that shit melts my eyeballs in most games) with 3dvision.

[zwobot]

Reading through this whole topic I already wanted to purchase the pre order beta. Then I found out you need Steam :(

Is there any information if there is going to be a version of this game which will not require Steam?

[GRS]

I have not seen any.

They're not going to reset anything after release are they? Like decks and such.

[Dwarden]

really reminds me on improved World In Conflict (there are one or two awesome mods for WiC which turn the game to strategist heaven)

[Tonci87]

really reminds me on improved World In Conflict (there are one or two awesome mods for WiC which turn the game to strategist heaven)
Wich ones?

[Dwarden]

Wich ones?

Modern Warfare 2.0 is one of them (i forgot the name of the second one but i'm sure it's on ModDB too)
http://www.moddb.com/mods/wicmw


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FK4tSnihsiQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8vxWHxpMRU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9V_Y5oaxlSc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYGB1dyFICk

more videos http://www.youtube.com/user/blahdy21/videos

it's one of best mods i see in long time in terms of overall quality and complexity in scripting all the features (linked radars for anti-air defence etc)

[Tonci87]

I think I´ll give this a try. Thanks!

[GRS]

I might try WiC again for those. I hated WiC when I played it before.

[CameronMcDonald]

WiC SP was great - really loved it.

WiC MP tended to devolve into a contest between who could field the most heavy tanks and heavy air at one time.

[SaOk]

In this european escalation, I´ve already seen quite suprising ways to play. Yesterday one team-mate built around 50-80 cheap rifle squads that he spread around the map (edges). I though he was joking (since I made few mistakes at start and we had only one zone captured, and even lost it early), but once he began to attack with those, the victory came fast. Still the opponents were playing quite poor too, my one AA-guy dropped at least 5 cobras and they constantly attacked with tanks very close each other which could be easily scared with arty.

But of the best aspects in this game is the possibility to play in different way. And you dont need to be fast. Someone said the leading player in league make only 12 clicks in minute (I make 9.8) while in starcraft 2 the best (koreans) use 200-300 clicks in minute.

http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/2416/wargame2012022022501252.jpg

Excelent game, and it only gets better.

[Derbysieger]

This game looks interesting. I havent played a RTS/RTT in a while. The last one was WiC where I had a lot of fun playing CWs and later Match Making when CWs were harder to find.


WiC SP was great - really loved it.

WiC MP tended to devolve into a contest between who could field the most heavy tanks and heavy air at one time.

Public MP was really bad most of the time. One experienced CW player on one side could usually dominate the opposing team and ruin it for everyone (not to mention all the idiots who had no clue what to do). CWs and MM on the other hand were something completely different. You played much more as a team and you gave a rats ass about score - only winning was important which changed the gameplay a lot. CWs were much more fun and made me a lot better at WiC.

[.Taffy]

In this european escalation, I´ve already seen quite suprising ways to play. Yesterday one team-mate built around 50-80 cheap rifle squads that he spread around the map (edges). I though he was joking (since I made few mistakes at start and we had only one zone captured, and even lost it early), but once he began to attack with those, the victory came fast. Still the opponents were playing quite poor too, my one AA-guy dropped at least 5 cobras and they constantly attacked with tanks very close each other which could be easily scared with arty.

But of the best aspects in this game is the possibility to play in different way. And you dont need to be fast. Someone said the leading player in league make only 12 clicks in minute (I make 9.8) while in starcraft 2 the best (koreans) use 200-300 clicks in minute.


Excelent game, and it only gets better.

I'm glad you said that, I do worry with games like this you are so busy rushing around getting new orders in that you don't get a chane to admire the visuals or enjoy a particularly fierce firefight. I imagine the scale of the maps has a lot to do with this, an aspect I find lacking in WiC and CoH.

[Gabe_Ruckus]

Not just the scale, but realistic speeds for the units do a lot to keep it at a manageable pace (I'm pushing 30, I don't even ATTEMPT to play Starcraft online). Once you select a platoon of tanks and click, there's a slight delay, they form up, then move out, and they move at a realistically slow pace, depending on terrain. There's also a chance to get a track stuck in mud if you take it off road, or throw a track, or move really slowly through swamps. There are roads, but that makes holding key terrain that much more important in this game. I won a match by holding a key ridge along my enemy's primary avenue of approach, and stopping the attack that nearly wiped out my ally. Making sure to keep units supplied and keeping the trucks protected from your FOB to your lines keeps things slow, too, since you're going to need to slow down to protect your trucks.

I've seen player attempt tactics that could be exploitative - One match saw one of my enemies drop all his points into FOBs and Artillery pieces (The FOBs are basically giant supply hubs). But arty gets pretty spread out at range, and since he couldn't project enough force to get a sense of where my forces were concentrated, he spent a lot of his time shelling an empty objective zone that I moved out of to control the ridge I mentioned earlier. This game is GOOD, I could see an actual military using it, or a version of it, for Officer training.

[Mondkalb]

From what I've heard they're going to reset everything for the release (Tomorrow?!).
But I'll take this as a chance to focus my unit deck on rocket launching vehicles, Tank destroyers and AA infantry when it's starting again.

Setting up ambushes in surrounding areas and sending out ninja SF Forces to disturb enemy supply routes/command vehicles has proven to be the most successful tactic for me to counter the enemy tank avalanches of BMPs and T-62s.

[Sudayev]

First time I see this game :O looks really nice indeed, I like cold war RTS games, the last one good Cold War title I played was Cold War Crisis mod for C&C Generals.

Is this game available on the market yet ?

[GRS]

From what I've heard they're going to reset everything for the release (Tomorrow?!).
But I'll take this as a chance to focus my unit deck on rocket launching vehicles, Tank destroyers and AA infantry when it's starting again.

Setting up ambushes in surrounding areas and sending out ninja SF Forces to disturb enemy supply routes/command vehicles has proven to be the most successful tactic for me to counter the enemy tank avalanches of BMPs and T-62s.

Yeah, they are resetting. I really don't want to rebuild my deck, but it's not like I won't enjoy the process.

[Gabe_Ruckus]

Aww, I was looking forward to the head start. I hope the SP earns me some command stars, I was really looking forward to the campaign portion too.

[colossus]

I'm sitting on the fence on this one. I hated RUSE, but I love WiC. Hopefully there will be a demo coming out soon.

[Mondkalb]

I'm sitting on the fence on this one. I hated RUSE, but I love WiC. Hopefully there will be a demo coming out soon.

That is exactly how I felt. I played the demo of RUSE and I was really not convinced by the gameplay. World in Conflict single player of course goes without saying that it is excellent.

And Wargame? I just love it. In fact their terrains are such a stunningly good representation of German terrain, that they are to blame for my ambition to remake Celle. :o
Except for the heightmaps of their maps: there are no rolling hills, just either water, flat area or plateau. But the layout of the fields and forests are superb, many possibilities of approaching an objective.

Heck, I even sacrificed my lunch break to get a taste of the first single player mission...
And the first thing I learned: Do not play this game when in rush. It's no fun then if you can't spend time looking at the towns and units.

[GRS]

If you have steam you should have just pre-ordered and get it refunded if you don't like it since it was still technically a pre-order. :)

[Dwarden]

this game need spectator mode (or does it have one?) , i would like to watch the battles (interactive screensaver)

[Jakerod]

Except for the heightmaps of their maps: there are no rolling hills, just either water, flat area or plateau. But the layout of the fields and forests are superb, many possibilities of approaching an objective.
I thought those maps looked a bit flat in the videos. I'm still considering getting it though.

[maturin]

I don't think elevation is really feasible without some really involved game mechanics to handle it. You would need some sort of visualized map layer to tell you where the dead ground is, and whether you have line of sight. This was an issue I had with the Men of War demo, which has much more detailed terrain. I couldn't tell what was defilade and what was in the open, and bullets seemed to be zipping through the ground.

[Smurf]

Wasn´t a problem for Total Annihilation 15 years ago. Just saying....
And yeah, in MOW I have a hard time to judge heights.

Hows the MP interface and player integration? I mean, your profile, clans, statistics, CW.... I really like what WiC offered (IMO, one of the best in-game built "that thing").

[Slatts]

they did have mountains in ruse so its not something they cant do

yet to pick it up..over to gamestop tomorrow :D

[Jakerod]

It isn't bad in TA's spiritual successor Supreme Commander either. I could see it being an issue from a zoomed out strategic perspective but you can zoom in pretty far in WG:EE it would seem. That would probably be good enough. I'm going to monitor this thread and use that to decide if I want to get it or not.

[Gabe_Ruckus]

I think you'd enjoy it, Jakerod. The terrain can seem a bit flat, but the way it's implemented with plateaus is much more like Steel Panthers than Supreme Commander. Makes holding that terrain above avenues of approach much more important since a rolling hill would be a nightmare to get your units into an actual hull-down position, and now it's just calculated based on their position. Actually, now that I think about it, this is like a real time Steel Panthers 3, which is just awesome!

[mrcash2009]

http://www.livestream.com/tgapples

Interesting watching live MP play streams.

[Opticalsnare]

Think il get this one looks quite cool.

Edit: Well i bought it, played the SP for a bit was ok. But the mutliplayer keep crashing to a blackscreen as soon as it starts.

[SaOk]

Btw. there is some hills on the new maps (not just the plateau(s)). So far spotted one, but would expect more. :) I was wondering why my tanks dont shoot the nearby enemy, but once I zoomed down I noticed that I was climbing on the hill.

[GRS]

Rivers of Blood has some of those hills.

[colossus]

Well, I finally bought the game. Now I just have to figure out if and how you resupply the supply trucks. :butbut:

[Slatts]

Well, I finally bought the game. Now I just have to figure out if and how you resupply the supply trucks. :butbut:

bring them to a F.O.B :)

EDIT: note, if you have artty units firing and being resupplied by a FOB, you must wait for them to be fully stocked before the trucks will be restocked

[colossus]

Yeah, I was a bit hasty with that post. I probably should have launched mission #2 (Crossroads) first.. :rolleyes: Thanks anyway :D
First impression is good, although the UI could have been a bit more embellished.

[Opticalsnare]

Alot of spam in this game.

[Slatts]

Alot of spam in this game.

its easy to counter, thats the point of RUSE and wargame, everything has a counter so you must use good tactics

[GRS]

I just watched 7 out of 8 Pattons get blasted because not one of them shot back. They all had ammo, the go ahead to fire, and where well within range with a good line of sight. Anyone know whats up with that? Totally screwed me that game. That's why I play Pact. :D

[Opticalsnare]

Well this game is turning pretty stalemate for me. Its either someone spams a shitload of arty which is getting pretty common now just sit back in your base and spam spam spam on anything that moves with a barrage of arty. Or spam cheap units and send them on a roadtrain of death down a highway to the enemy base, or both sides just end up camping in forrests and awaits the other team to make the move which pretty much means whoever attacks first loses the match, cause its easier to gain points by just letting the enemy attack you while you just sit back and let the points role in. Anything inbewteen seems just be a waste of time, any form of tactics seems to get overshadowed by the things i mentioned above. For example i played a round 3v3 our team captured more points and was generally on the offensive more the other team camped alot had less capzones and generally played the defence, although we managed to get right up to their base pounding them into submission the game ended because the points limit was reached, what surprised me was that we lost while they won.... Like how does that work...

So..

We had more capzones
We attacked more and successfully reached their last capzone/mainbase
We had more units on the battlefield than they did
We played as a team supplying eachother with ammo/fuel and arty support when needed

The enemy camped and failed to cap as many zones as we did...
Had alot less units towards the end of the game than we did..
Was facing complete and utter destruction as our armies was pounding their LAST capzone

Game ends, they win with a minor victory... Ermmmmm wtf

[GRS]

I love arty spammers. They always waste money on arty and can't defend themselves.

[gammadust]

@<hidden>
most probably, despite your team having lost less units, they were more expensive and made your opponents earn more points per kill.
also, capping afaik, only increases points earned per cycle (4 seconds), i don't think it counts toward winning directly.

did you keep an eye on the points counter? i see many players infiltrate opponents base just with the intent of destroying the command vehicle (200-240 points)...

but i agree on the spam though, i've seen that a lot too.

[GRS]

The only thing I can see wrong with this game is the stupidly small number of maps and people's obsession with "Hell's Highway". Maybe DLC will change that, who knows.

[Slatts]

i dunno how you play snare but the only spam ive had be a problem is from gunships against my armoured units

sure i have AA but they take out a good few of my armour units and i dont have the advantage for the final push

arty spam is easy to take care of, my VDV behind enemy lines spotting them for my arty...or hinds :D you can counter spam rather easy if you have the right units

[gammadust]

I came across this troll spammer


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQQS39lUDS4

It's sufficient to check his units placement in the beginning (~4m30 in), no need to bring yourself more pain than that...
It is revealing how his team mates FOB resources were being sucked by this guy, one of them left.

There is a bonus though, for those who resist a opponent like that, WIN.

[GRS]

I do hate FOB leeches. Like Slatts said, VDV behind enemy lines, always. He would have been toasted real quick.

[Mondkalb]

I am really looking forward to the next big update:


- Comp Stomp: It’s being tested as I speak (well, write). It takes more time that stated two weeks ago because we’ve decided not to just transpose the solo campaign’s AI, but to improve it especially for the multiplayer in order to give it sharper teeth. Thus more challenge, be warned…
- Ability to ping the map.
- New Game Modes & Victory Conditions
- New Multiplayer Maps
- Possibility to watch old replays from previous versions.
http://www.wargame-ee.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3470


Especially awaiting proper COOP.

[GRS]

Damnit I deleted all my old replays. :(

Very excited though. Thanks for posting that.

[gammadust]

Found this (http://www.wargamereplays.org/) interesting to share and view other player's tactics and strategies

[GRS]

Ha, I love all the people who think flanking on Hell's Highway is some genius creative concept, the map screams to do it. I also don't get the fascination with that map, I think it's kind of lame since it's so over played.

Cool site there gamma

[RangerPL]

Just bought this game and am two missions in to the singleplayer campaign. Are the people here still playing it?

[GRS]

I am, but my PC is down right now and my new build is two weeks out. I can't wait to play again though.

[Slatts]

still now and again, kinda hard to get playing the campaign when theres work to be done lol

[RangerPL]

My steam name is RangerPL1322 by the way (my name on W:EE is RangerPL) if anyone wants to play, feel free to add me.

[Shashman]

Took advantage of the 40% discount last weekend and bought it.

Stuck on the last mission of the first campaign though.

Played my first MP game last night which was fun!

[GRS]

We'll have to get a game going sometime once I'm back online. My new build will be done next weekend.

My W:EE name is Gary

[Slatts]

wouldnt mind joining in with you guys if i have the time

[GRS]

We'll have to get some BIS forum member games going. I'd be happy to play against anyone. I prefer 1v1 because I remember getting very tired of people doing dumb things like not watching unguarded CV's or using tanks as AA, but I have more faith in the people here. ;)

[Shashman]

doing dumb things like [...] using tanks as AA

In that first MP game I played last night, that actually happened to me. I had 3 or 4 Leo 1A4s hidden in a forest overlooking a sector, and one of the opponents flew over with 6 Mi-24As. They all got shot down haha! I didn't do it on purpose, it just happened. Couldn't believe I won the engagement!

[GRS]

In that case yes, but I have seen people on my team send T64's out to fight Apaches. True story. 2 T64's sent into the open to fight 4 Apaches. -_-

[RangerPL]

Stuck on the last mission of the first campaign though.
I beat that one a few days ago. I had something like two Leopard 1A4s, four Leo 1A3s and four AMX-10 (with the missiles). Aside from that I had a Kiowa for recon purposes and two Chapparals for air defense. It's not that hard if you maneuver your armored/mechanized forces and pay attention to what the Soviets are throwing at you. There's an FOB to the right side of the map that you can use to replenish your Chinooks and trucks.

I got tank rushed near the end and was facing over a dozen T-64s but fortunately the peace treaty was signed before they got to the bridge.

[Slatts]

The machine gun on top of a tank is an anti-aircraft gun ;)

problem is that helis have NO armour

[Hellfire257]

I filled the tree lines with Marders and Panzergrenadiers. The amount of MILANs they were going through was beyond the joke. Keeping them resupplied with the Chinooks was critical.

[GRS]

The machine gun on top of a tank is an anti-aircraft gun ;)

problem is that helis have NO armour

It's only an AA gun if they can get that close. Once again, I was referring to people literally sending tanks, which have "AA guns" that are far out-ranged by helis, out to take down tank killer helis. It's stupid to do no matter how one looks at it.

[Slatts]

It's only an AA gun if they can get that close. Once again, I was referring to people literally sending tanks, which have "AA guns" that are far out-ranged by helis, out to take down tank killer helis. It's stupid to do no matter how one looks at it.

ooooh ok i thought you hated the fact it can do that

[Shashman]

I beat that one a few days ago. I had something like two Leopard 1A4s, four Leo 1A3s and four AMX-10 (with the missiles). Aside from that I had a Kiowa for recon purposes and two Chapparals for air defense. It's not that hard if you maneuver your armored/mechanized forces and pay attention to what the Soviets are throwing at you. There's an FOB to the right side of the map that you can use to replenish your Chinooks and trucks.

I got tank rushed near the end and was facing over a dozen T-64s but fortunately the peace treaty was signed before they got to the bridge.

Unfortunately I only have access to Leo1A1s and A2s, Chieftain Mk2 and Mk5 (though only one of each? :/ ), as well as M60, AMX-30 and AMX-30 Valorisé, which, unfortunately (apart from the Chieftains) are quite mediocre MBTs :(

I place 4 Marder A1s with MILAN F1 teams in the treelines surrounding the bridge, covering all sides, along with 2 flakpanzers (the better one), either a Striker or the German equivalent, 1 chapparal and usually around 6 MBTs also evenly spaced, covering all the flanks. However, I get rushed and overwhelmed nearly every time. The Chinooks can't keep up with resupplying my units and eventually the Soviets break through and destroy my command jeep.

Also, how do I take control of the French and US units?

[GRS]

ooooh ok i thought you hated the fact it can do that

No I think giving tanks any "AA" defense at all is a good idea to put strains on heli-spammers. :P I just hate when people think very limited "AA capability" = "AA unit". That's all I was getting at. :)

[Slatts]

Unfortunately I only have access to Leo1A1s and A2s, Chieftain Mk2 and Mk5 (though only one of each? :/ ), as well as M60, AMX-30 and AMX-30 Valorisé, which, unfortunately (apart from the Chieftains) are quite mediocre MBTs :(

I place 4 Marder A1s with MILAN F1 teams in the treelines surrounding the bridge, covering all sides, along with 2 flakpanzers (the better one), either a Striker or the German equivalent, 1 chapparal and usually around 6 MBTs also evenly spaced, covering all the flanks. However, I get rushed and overwhelmed nearly every time. The Chinooks can't keep up with resupplying my units and eventually the Soviets break through and destroy my command jeep.

Also, how do I take control of the French and US units?

you cant take control of the allied units

what i did was push out and make some fall back lines, push your tanks our as far as you dare and keep some recon units out to see them coming. put some infantry and lighter vehicles in tree lines and as your tanks/recon start getting hit hard fall back to the infantry..make a stand there and then fall back to the bridge

the trick is not holding at the bridge but pushing out and delaying the russians further out

[GRS]

Don't overlook recon either. I remember having an umbrella of recce units out there so I could shift my lines accordingly. That way I wouldn't be desperately defending with a small force and then again when the rest of my units arrived to support. Instead they'd all be there to form one solid line, instead of two weak ones.

[Shashman]

Admittedly, I don't use recon assets much, apart from the gazelle SNEB every now and again. They're just so lightly armoured and armed that they just end up being wasted deployment points.

I wouldn't have thought pushing out would be a wise move, because when (not 'if') that advanced force gets overwhelmed and obliterated, I'm left with lesser quality units to defend the bridge which is the actual mission objective. You don't get that many deployment points to start off with so surely it would make more sense deploying stronger units in an advantageous defensive position (treelines surrounding the bridge), than sending them out just to probe the enemy? Another problem is logistics: These probing attacks you suggest will require resupply, and I can't really afford to send out the pitiful supply trucks for that. I need all the supplies I can possibly get for my defensive positions back at the bridge

[GRS]

All about the recce. Just need to keep them out of fights. Then you know when the big attacks are coming and when to fall back so your advance force doesn't get wiped out by surprise.

[Shashman]

I'm such a n00b.

Only last night (after 3 or 4 MP games) did I realise that I could add units to my starting deck :a:

[Shashman]

Wheeey my 'long'est and first win streak in MP.

2 whole games :P

(only played 6 and the first 3 or4 were with/against ridiculously level'd players)

We should get some BI forum games going :)

[GRS]

My computer will be done in 3 days, so I'm in. Don't worry too much about level. Once you get past level eight or so its not very significant. By then you have enough stars to unlock a variety of units that can compete well, so long as you choose wisely and play one side. It is pretty unforgiving for newer players though.

I can't wait to play again. I'm really looking forward to finally seeing this new content.

[Shashman]

Just unlocked the Challenger 1 and... Just wow!

[GRS]

Hell yeah, expensive though, gotta be careful ;)

My PC is being built tomorrow. Assuming all goes well I should be down for a game the day or night after.

[Slatts]

Just unlocked the Challenger 1 and... Just wow!

got the M1 in one of the able archer missions
fucking amazing :D

[CameronMcDonald]

M1ip ftw. :p

[Prydain]

Hellfire missile my children. It gives.

[GRS]

Well, apparently copying your files to a new PC doesn't work. Bye-bye stars, level 30 and all decks.

Needless to say, I'm absolutely pissed. Powering through SP again to get what I can back.

[Shashman]

Just play lots of coop, should get your stars back faster :)

[GRS]

Working on it. :P

[Hellfire257]

I'm curious to know your opinions on infantry in this game. How do you guys employ them?

[GRS]

Efficiently :P

Best in woods and towns. They cannot take much damage but are easy to hide and can deal much more than they take. You can pull off some sneaky stuff with infantry.

[Slatts]

I'm curious to know your opinions on infantry in this game. How do you guys employ them?

if i need to clear out a forest or build up area i send in my motorstrelki or panzergrenadiers :D and have my VDV/SAS flying behind enemy lines for recon

they are useful if you use them right

[Shashman]

Yes, if concealed well in treelines, especially when armed with good ATGMs (Milan 2, Dragon II), they're pretty decent for defense, but very vulnerable.

[Slatts]

Yes, if concealed well in treelines, especially when armed with good ATGMs (Milan 2, Dragon II), they're pretty decent for defense, but very vulnerable.

the motorstrelki are pretty darn effective with the rpg-7 in forests/towns ;)

[GRS]

I use motostrelci like there is no tomorrow. Deployed in basic Skots, sure, the basic Skot isn't worth anything really, but it's fast and then full vet infantry only costs 20 points. I like to own the woods. :P

[Shashman]

Ewww Warsaw Pact! :p

I only play NATO

[GRS]

Sounds like a challenge. ;)

[Slatts]

Ewww Warsaw Pact! :p

I only play NATO

evil capitalist :p

me and GRS should team up against you :D

[GRS]

I'm hardly supportive of the Pact side politically, I just like their hardware. :P

[Slatts]

I'm hardly supportive of the Pact side politically, I just like their hardware. :P

so two NATO players against me and my good ol' pact :D sounds like a challange ;)

[Shashman]

Don't get me wrong, I've always been a massive admirer of Pact hardware, but in Wargame, I have ZERO experience with them so I stick to what I know :D

Challenge gladly accepted. Bring it ;)

[GRS]

My W:EE name is simply: Gary

I'm on quite a bit.

[Shashman]

Went to the Bovington Tank Museum today, and saw quite a lot of the hardware you get in W:EE up close and personal :D

Kurze
M60A1 Rise
T-72M
BRDM-2
Leopard 1A5
Leopard 1A2
BMP-1
Chieftain Mk2
Chieftain Mk12
Challenger 1
T-62
T-55
T-34
Stryker

[RangerPL]

Has anyone gotten past the first mission in the Polish campaign? I'm not able to reach the loyalist garrison on time. If I try to rush to get to it, I can reach them but lose my deployment zone and get overrun quickly. If I try to move slowly by capturing zones along the way, the garrison gets wiped out before I can get to it.

Is there a good way to do this? I've tried flanking from the left but there are no bridges on that side of the map so I can't link up with the garrison quickly without going through the center of the map, which is crawling with enemies.

[Slatts]

I passed it on the first go, didnt do anything special, just fought through the resistance.be sure to use arty to stun enemies

on MP i gave the AML-60 a go and i love that little thing :D clears out forests in a second

[RangerPL]

Should I buy extra arty or are the starting 2S3s fine?

[ziiip]

So how's the online population doing in the game?

[CameronMcDonald]

Should I buy extra arty or are the starting 2S3s fine?

2S3s work fine.

[colossus]

Looks like "Wargame: Airland Battle" is coming up. I understand it's a new game, not an expansion or DLC. Hm.. oh well, it looks interesting though. I like games similar to WiC. :)


http://youtu.be/YFSPfq2SlUk



Today, we are proud to unveil in a first video teaser Wargame: AirLand Battle, the sequel to Wargame! Planned for released for 2013, Wargame: AirLand Battle will bring the series to a brand new dimension. Today's video gives a glimpse of the spectacular new features to come!


While the first Wargame made a splash with its powerful engine, Wargame: AirLand Battle will be the series's leap forward by bringing a level of detail never before seen in a real-time strategy game. The new version of the IRISZOOM Engine(tm) will display spectacular graphics with a wide variety of units, scenery, and impressive topography reproduced from satellite maps, all of which are visible in today's teaser.


Just like its predecessor, Wagame: AirLand Battle takes players through a series of conflicts commanding NATO and Warsaw Pact troops between 1975 & 1985 at a turning point of the Cold War. In this episode, war rages in Northern Europe, notably Scandinavia, whose architecture and magnificent landscapes are faithfully recreated in the game.
Wargame: AirLand Battle allows players to command all military resources of the Cold War era from tanks to planes. A total of 150 planes strengthen the playable arsenal of the game, from fighters to bombers to electronic warfare planes. Four new nations and their vehicles join the original eight from the first installment, making a total of over 750 vehicles and combat units rendered in realistic detail! Wargame: AirLand Battle also brings authenticity to the next level thanks to a new weapons system, better handling of fire effects, and a new Urban Combat Interface (UCI) allowing for battle inside cities.


The solo campaign is composed of several new dynamic campaigns, during which players manage all aspects of battle by leading each squad of the Theater of Operation and making good use of reinforcements and strategic support. Wargame: AirLand Battle still allows customization of armies in solo and multiplayer modes thanks to the 'Deck' system, which is now being enhanced with an integrated 'viewer'. Ultimately, each decision made will have an impact on the tactical outcome of battles and evolution of the global conflict! Prepare to re-enter the Cold War in 2013!

Source: wargame-ee.com (http://www.wargame-ee.com/index.php?rub=news-infos&id=136)

[GRS]

That looks great. I miss Wargame. My new, temporary, residence has terrible internet so I cannot play anything online for another five months.

[Slatts]

At first I thought why isn't this a DLC but after reading the details I can see why it's a new game :) Will be buying

[[EVO] Dan]

Got this game recently, enjoying playing it and will get the new one, but not until I get a new PC (my laptop struggles to run it)